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platatomi
Samba Member
Joined: August 09, 2012
Posts: 465
Location: Los Angeles, California
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 Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:59 pm Post subject: |
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| 64delux wrote: |
| platatomi wrote: |
I wouldn't drive far on the highway/freeway without at least an oil temp gauge, but that's just me. I know my car runs on the hot side and with the gauge I know if I need to slow down to let the engine cool or if I can power ahead.
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If you get warm you should speed up or change down more RPM means more cooling!
Mitch |
At at certain point, it just gets hotter the faster I go. For example, at 55mph on level ground at 95*F, I run about 225* oil in the sump. If I speed up to 60 or more, I exced 230*. I don't know why it runs hot, I have tried all the common fixes. Thinner oil may help, but my engine's builder recommends I run 20w50.
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'69 Beetle daily driver, fixing things as I go...
Update -
No longer daily driver but still fixing things... |
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67jason
Samba Member
Joined: August 28, 2005
Posts: 4741
Location: behind my back feet - Pittsburg CA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:09 pm Post subject: |
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| platatomi wrote: |
| 64delux wrote: |
| platatomi wrote: |
I wouldn't drive far on the highway/freeway without at least an oil temp gauge, but that's just me. I know my car runs on the hot side and with the gauge I know if I need to slow down to let the engine cool or if I can power ahead.
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If you get warm you should speed up or change down more RPM means more cooling!
Mitch |
At at certain point, it just gets hotter the faster I go. For example, at 55mph on level ground at 95*F, I run about 225* oil in the sump. If I speed up to 60 or more, I exced 230*. I don't know why it runs hot, I have tried all the common fixes. Thinner oil may help, but my engine's builder recommends I run 20w50. |
20w50 is THICK. i dont know who built your engine, but thats just bad right there.
experiment with thinner oil and see what happens. 
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67 bug x3
67 ghia
64 bug |
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VWCOOL
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2006
Posts: 1821
Location: Down under
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 1:43 am Post subject: |
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| platatomi wrote: |
| 64delux wrote: |
| platatomi wrote: |
I wouldn't drive far on the highway/freeway without at least an oil temp gauge, but that's just me. I know my car runs on the hot side and with the gauge I know if I need to slow down to let the engine cool or if I can power ahead.
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If you get warm you should speed up or change down more RPM means more cooling!
Mitch |
At at certain point, it just gets hotter the faster I go. For example, at 55mph on level ground at 95*F, I run about 225* oil in the sump. If I speed up to 60 or more, I exced 230*. I don't know why it runs hot, I have tried all the common fixes. Thinner oil may help, but my engine's builder recommends I run 20w50. |
230F is NOT "too hot", "running hot" or "overheating" in a VW engine
20/50 is NOT "too thick" for a VW engine - especially if the engine builder stakes his reputation on it
You won't ever find a reason why it's 'running too hot' because IT'S NOT
However, always keep in mind that sudden rises in engine temp can be indicative of a problem - just like it is in a coolant car |
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Brian
Samba Moderator
Joined: May 28, 2012
Posts: 8340
Location: Oceanside
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:09 am Post subject: |
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word.
To non-productively add; I only have a tach and volt meter. No fuel gauge, no speedo. Just a tach, volts, and idiot lights.
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Wash your hands
'69 Bug
'68 Baja Truck
'71 Bug
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Only losers litter |
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vugbug68
Samba Member
Joined: June 25, 2006
Posts: 2696
Location: sacramento
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:01 am Post subject: |
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| VWCOOL wrote: |
| platatomi wrote: |
| 64delux wrote: |
| platatomi wrote: |
I wouldn't drive far on the highway/freeway without at least an oil temp gauge, but that's just me. I know my car runs on the hot side and with the gauge I know if I need to slow down to let the engine cool or if I can power ahead.
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If you get warm you should speed up or change down more RPM means more cooling!
Mitch |
At at certain point, it just gets hotter the faster I go. For example, at 55mph on level ground at 95*F, I run about 225* oil in the sump. If I speed up to 60 or more, I exced 230*. I don't know why it runs hot, I have tried all the common fixes. Thinner oil may help, but my engine's builder recommends I run 20w50. |
230F is NOT "too hot", "running hot" or "overheating" in a VW engine
20/50 is NOT "too thick" for a VW engine - especially if the engine builder stakes his reputation on it
You won't ever find a reason why it's 'running too hot' because IT'S NOT
However, always keep in mind that sudden rises in engine temp can be indicative of a problem - just like it is in a coolant car |
I would try 10-40 and see what your temp and pressure does. I went from 15-40 to 10-30 on one engine and my temp went down a bit, but on a different engine switching to 10-30 raised my temp so I went back to 15-40.
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66 Corvair - Weekend Cruiser
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theDrew
Samba Member
Joined: May 17, 2011
Posts: 1155
Location: Camas, WA
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:23 am Post subject: |
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I'm of the belief that you can never have too much information....
but then again I have more money and time into my engine than I want to admit.
one of these days I'll actually paint it...right now the dash is still bare fiberglass
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Aerindel
Samba Member
Joined: May 30, 2015
Posts: 459
Location: Western Montana
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 10:51 am Post subject: |
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I am of the mind to have as many gauges as you can afford.
I just have a cheap digital oil temp gauge from amazon, it reads about 20ºC low from the real temp but its consistent so I can just mentally add that 20º back in.
But like others have said, its not so much about absolute temp but just knowing what is normal for your car. If normally reads X and then one day you see that its suddenly X+30º you know something is up.
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Homemade woods/street, bug out rail. IRS, Balljoint front end. 1967 1600cc DP, Weber 32/36 progressive, tri-mil quiet pack. Rear only cutting brakes.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630046 |
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TheAmazingDave
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Joined: April 11, 2013
Posts: 788
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 11:59 am Post subject: |
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I'm all for adding gauges, but most often, you need to understand that they're just a reference. You need to monitor them, and watch for trends, so you can understand what's normal for your engine during various conditions.
They are just for information, first and foremost. When my CHT hits 400 on a climb, and then immediately drops back down once level, it's not a concern. If I'm cruising down the road and that gauge spikes, then I know I might have a problem. Only when the gauge has an extreme reading is it justification to pull over and check things out, as far as I'm concerned. Except for oil pressure. If it drops while driving, don't fuck around with that, but you can use gauges like oil temp and pressure to determine if you're going too fast and building temperature faster than you can shed it by evaluating pressure versus temp. For instance, if you're driving fast enough to surpass 40 PSI oil pressure hot, you might start bypassing your factory cooler and oil temp will climb. Then, you can use the pressure gauge to determine a safe cruising speed that doesn't bypass the cooler, and temp starts dropping back down. That's just an example.
Let your gauges tell you what's going on, don't let them rule you. Once you can recognize trends, you'll know if there's a problem or not.
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Just call me Big D. (formerly xBigDx408x)
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Deutschland Dubs 2015 at Presidio Trust |
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67vwcruising
Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Carson City NV
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| Posted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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I understand that i cant compare what my oil temp reads to other cars and to use it as a guide for whats normal for my car.
I'm going to get oil temp and pressure gauges a few weeks before the trip to see what my car normally does. This car is my daily driver from 105*F in summer to -10*F in winter so I have a pretty good idea of what to expect.
On a side note I replaced the old 34 ICTs because the throttle shafts were worn and i couldn't tune it properly. I Rebuilt a set of kadrons and installed them about a week ago. The car runs so much smoother i can't believe it.
I do think maybe the main jets are a bit lean because it feels a little softer in the top end and i think it is running a bit hotter. At least i think it smells hotter.
I think the jets were 155 main and 55 idles. Maybe i should bump the mains to 160?
1600dp 110cam 009@32* full advance
Also the road i plan on taking has a 50 mph limit on most of the way. The way there is mostly down hill. The way back is up hill, so my question is 50 mph @ 3200-3400 rpm sustained pushing to hard? |
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Multi69s
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Joined: January 24, 2006
Posts: 5364
Location: Lefty, CA
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mark tucker
Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009
Posts: 23937
Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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| Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2015 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| I put a thermomometer in my dip stick location.it didnt do squat for me.....the temp was usualy 175~178(F). never got more than 8 degrees more.but I still feal the same. I was thinken about a remote thermo for head temp...but not thinken too hard as that makes my head hurt. make sure your car is right, and tuned right. Ive seen cars with gauges& blown motors.wonder why? |
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haz77
Samba Member
Joined: December 12, 2013
Posts: 206
Location: NZ
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| Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2015 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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| xBigDx408x wrote: |
| When my CHT hits 400 on a climb, and then immediately drops back down once level, it's not a concern. If I'm cruising down the road and that gauge spikes, then I know I might have a problem. |
What CHT set up do you have?
From what little I know No3 cylinder temp is far more important than oil temp can ever be, that said I will be fitting a oil temp & pressure gauge to my 1776 type3 build but am seriously thinking about CHT also, possibly a aircraft digital one with an audiable hi limit warning built in. |
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67vwcruising
Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Carson City NV
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| Posted: Sat Jul 18, 2015 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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I've decided on just the oil pressure gauge. When i bought the car the 1500 had a rats nest covering the oil cooler and it would get HOT driving the hills around here, I couldn't believe it ran for a year like that. So, i have a good idea of what happen as its getting hotter.
I think I'll make sure the seals in the motor compartment are good, up the mains, and go for it!  |
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67vwcruising
Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Carson City NV
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| I talked to my parts guy about jetting and he said he's running 130 mains on a 1776 (I'm running 130's on a 1600), so i don't think i'm jetted lean. I noticed that the passenger carb throttle shaft is loose so maybe that is causing a lean condition and making me run hot? |
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OLD VW NUT
Samba Member
Joined: February 23, 2011
Posts: 2776
Location: High Desert of Washington 98823
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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Gauges and lights are ok but you can't drive down the road watching your gauges and lights all the time. For low/zero oil pressure warning I have a little buzzer I wired up to the oil light. It buzzes every time I turn the ignition on and goes off when the oil light goes off. $6 is cheap insurance - the best gauge in the world won't do you any good if you don't see it when it hits zero pressure when you're speed shifting into second gear to impress your buddy.
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retroman
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2010
Posts: 227
Location: Reno (What is Rust???)
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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Easy drive to Sacramento. Take 50 not 80. I am driving my 67 from Fernley (nevada) to Salt Lake City area in Sept. The dip stick thing works good.
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1987 Vanagon Wolfsburg Weekender "Otto" been all over the place with never a problem! |
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renotay
Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2006
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Tue Jul 21, 2015 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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I-80s not a bad drive at all. I live in reno and drove my 2016cc to the last bug-o and then twice after that in 95-100 degree temps experimenting with differences in my decklid. I have a 4 row decklid with doghouse cooler and no external oil cooler running 10w30.
I cruised at about 70mph and double checked temp with a meat thermometer. oil temps with the decklid closed peaked around 235. next time with the tennisball trick it took a little longer but got about the same and then again with standoffs it peaked at 230.
My cht (dakota digital) showed a consistent 35-40 degree reduction with the standoffs. So if youre worried about the temp climbing the hill out of sac its a worth while investment. If you need another person to cruise down with for the next bug-o DM me, im going to head down |
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TheAmazingDave
Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2013
Posts: 788
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| haz77 wrote: |
| xBigDx408x wrote: |
| When my CHT hits 400 on a climb, and then immediately drops back down once level, it's not a concern. If I'm cruising down the road and that gauge spikes, then I know I might have a problem. |
What CHT set up do you have?
From what little I know No3 cylinder temp is far more important than oil temp can ever be, that said I will be fitting a oil temp & pressure gauge to my 1776 type3 build but am seriously thinking about CHT also, possibly a aircraft digital one with an audiable hi limit warning built in. |
It's a VDO CHT with ring sender on cyl #3, cold juntion is outside of engine bay. It reads pretty consistently irregardless of ambient temp.
The CHT and oil temp were instrumental for me on Sunday when I crossed the Mojave. I had to slow to ~62 climbing in the desert to keep my temps in check. No problems, car ran fantastic.
edit: Oh, with the VDO CHT, when they say do not cut the sender wire, do not cut the sender wire. From my understanding, the gauge is calibrated for the exact resistance of the length of wire provided. Shortening it can skew the readings. I coiled the extra wire and hid it under the carpet before it passes into the trunk up to the dash.
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67vwcruising
Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Carson City NV
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| Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 6:33 pm Post subject: |
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OK.. so i decided that i'm going to pick up an oil temp gauge just to keep an eye on things.
My only other concern is why the motor is running hotter with the kadrons. As far as i know the 130 mains should be big enough. The car runs very well , just hotter. I guess I'll replace the throttle shafts and see if that helps the temps. |
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67vwcruising
Samba Member
Joined: March 31, 2015
Posts: 127
Location: Carson City NV
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| Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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OK...So i went out and pulled #2 and 4 plugs. The base ring is very dark, not quite black, showing a little rich. The ground strap is tan almost white, so maybe I need to go one step colder?
Over all the plugs don't look too bad, maybe I'm imagining that it's running that much hotter..... |
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