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My Rail Thread
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Guardian1
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Joined: May 16, 2015
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Location: Michigan, Dundee
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 12:11 am    Post subject: My Rail Thread Reply with quote

So I think it might be best to start a “My Buggy thread”, I have had my Buggy for a few months now. I think I enjoy working on it and researching/diagnosing problems more than actually driving it! I have already posted a few pictures of my buggy, but to kick this off, I will share them again.

Here is a breakdown of the motor.
- 1915 Duel port
- 110 Engle cam
- Stroker seat crank
- Decade duel 44 carbs
- Mahle pistons. 94mm


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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, i have already been told i need new shocks!!!! Laughing

My plan is to start by making it “Michigan” street legal and maybe some light off roading. It is not in the budget to spend $300~1000 per shock. After reading a few threads, it sounds like the KYB gas-a-just shock would be the best route. (As I currently have EMPI coil over shocks Embarassed ) Here is what I have been looking at.

Front Shocks
http://www.appletreeauto.com/FRONT-LINK-PIN-GAS-A-JUST-KG4521/

Rear Shocks
http://www.appletreeauto.com/TYPE-1-REAR-SHOCK-KG5529/

Or is there a better budget shock? or am i completely missing the mark by thinking these will suit my needs? [/url]
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GoMopar440
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I've read here on the Samba a lot of people with a lot of buggy/rail experience (I'm still a relative newb at VW's) advise against a gas charged shock on the front. The lack of front end weight makes them ride pretty rigid with those kind of shocks. There's enough weight in the rear I think they'd be fine out back. Just a standard emulsion type shock would probably work better up front. Maybe something like this one for example. I doesn't hurt that you can get both front shocks for about the same price as just one of the KYB Gas-A-Just shocks.
http://www.mooreparts.com/11667-AC513003/

Another thing you may want to consider, that is also relatively low cost, would be a trailing arm beef up kit. The stock IRS trailing arms are a known weak area if you do any off-roading. The only thing is you have to be able to weld or can get someone to help you with that if you don't have a welder or the knowledge to do it yourself.
http://www.appletreeauto.com/BEEF-KIT-IRS-TRAILING-ARMS-6574/

Nice rail BTW Wink . I wish I had gotten a bigger engine like yours when I got mine (stock 1600DP) a couple of months ago. But honestly I've got too much other stuff to deal with to get mine street legal before I need to worry about that yet. The 1600 scoots pretty good for what it is but I know I'll be wanting more power after I get a little more saddle time under my belt. As you may have guessed from my username, I like having gobs of torque under my right foot. Twisted Evil
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Homemade rail for street & off road: BJ front beam (bent), IRS rear (boxed/maybe bent), stock T1 DP 1600, 009, 34PICT-3 (soon to be dual 40HPMXs), 4-1 glass pack exh, T3 brakes (F disk, R drum & Dual MC), Bug trans (002, 5 rib going in soon).
Link to my rail (re)build thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=629493
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Bashr52
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 4:25 am    Post subject: Re: My Rail Thread Reply with quote

Guardian1 wrote:
So I think it might be best to start a “My Buggy thread”, I have had my Buggy for a few months now. I think I enjoy working on it and researching/diagnosing problems more than actually driving it! I have already posted a few pictures of my buggy, but to kick this off, I will share them again.

Here is a breakdown of the motor.
- 1915 Duel port
- 110 Engle cam
- Stroker seat crank
- Decade duel 44 carbs
- Mahle pistons. 94mm


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Looks like a solid ride! Whats a stroker seat crank? Do you mean a counterweighted crank?
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heywebonya
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In some of the pictures you have coilover fronts and other pictures have plain shocks. Which is it? Just use the cheap ones until it is street legal

Also, replace the steering coupler, the polyurethane reds do not have a good history.

What part of MI? I am in Kalamazoo.
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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Bashr, when I bought the buggy, that's what he had written down, I am guessing maybe he wrote it down wrong? (He told me that he had the motor built) At some point, I would like to buy and rebuild a 1600DP, as I have never opened up a motor before so I am really n00by when it comes to the inside of a motor.

Heywebonya, I live in Dundee, on the outskirts of town. As for the front shocks, (I know that a little deceiving) they are actually the same set in both pictures. I just removed the coil overs, when they are on, I basically have no suspension at all. Also, thanks for the tip about the steering coupler, what would you suggest?

GoMopar, I hear ya about MO-Power!!! Right now this is by far the fastest toy I own, so it is still a little intimidating for me. I was told to stay away from EMPI shocks all together, (And everything I have read)is that not the case? Maybe I need to do a little more research, the shocks that I posted are ones for the rear and the other are specifically for the front. I was thinking by them being adjustable, the shocks would lighten up enough for the front end of a rail. As for the Beef up kit, I am still working through a problem with one of my wheels being "tilted" in, http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7740487&highlight=#7740487 I think I might just be suffering from a "droopy rear-end" Laughing I just have not had the time lately to really dig into any projects on the rail. Provided that I don't end up with a bent trailing arm, I will definitely look into that kit!!!! I do own a flux core welder, but that probably will need to be done with a mig.

Thanks guys.
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cbeck
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would finish the engine cage first. Why, check out my recent pics.
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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, I just read about the hit and run, sure glad you and your son are ok and the asshat was cought, I think it was said best when one member called him a POS Exclamation
I am guessing you are talking about how the backend of my rail was cut on either side to allow room for the duel carbs. I plan to get that fixed, hopefully in the near future. Did you ever manage to get your rail back on the road?
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2RL
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing that you need to address before it causes a problem is you oil cooler. Where it is now without any kind of fan on it you're going to cook your engine ( assuming it's the only cooler and theirs not another in the shroud). Without a windshield you'd be fine, but having it on there virtually kills any air flow you had. I almost cooked the old engine in my rail by running a windshield without any fan on the cooler, luckily I was able too remove it before any serious damage was done.
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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Uh60ce, I would have never known, do you happen to know what is the operating heat range I need to stay in for the oil?
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2RL
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2015 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I've read , as long as you keep it under 230° its okay. Mine runs around 180 most of the time according to my gauge (VDO with the sending unit in the relief port ). Its fairly accurate too.
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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks uh60ce, I will definitely investigate that further and get a fan.

On a side note I was reading an article about bent rear torsions and in the article is mentioned that it is very important to make sure your Snubbers are in good shape. So I went outside to take a look at my buggy and noticed that I did not have any. After investing further, I realized that the left side Snubber holder was broken off from the PO.
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Here is a picture of the other side that is good.
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It would appear that this piece was welded into place from the factory, does anyone know of a replacement piece, or even a work around so I can get the Snubbers back on? I was looking at the Urethane ones from Appletree. But i will need that "nub" or something to hold it in place.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



Thanks for any help!!!
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2RL
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apple tree carries a replacement urethane type that has a bolt moulded into it that looks like they would work in that situation. Most likely its an empi part...

http://www.appletreeauto.com/BUMP-STOP-ROUND-STACKED/
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Aerindel
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2015 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mine kept coming off and getting lost on the road so I went with some bolt on ones as well, I got these:

http://www.pacificcustoms.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Scr...ange_high=
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Homemade woods/street, bug out rail. IRS, Balljoint front end. 1967 1600cc DP, Weber 32/36 progressive, tri-mil quiet pack. Rear only cutting brakes.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630046
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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very cool Aerindel, thats kinda what I was hoping for. Are they right height? And I am guessing that you just drilled a hole and used a screw on the bottom side? If you could provide a few pictures that would be fantastic! Thanks.
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Guardian1
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just finished installing my Windshield, here is the link. Fifured i would yie it in with this one.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7766214&highlight=#7766214
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Aerindel
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My rear arms are re-enforced with extra plating welded on to the top, bottom and back edge, I believe they call this "boxed" so bump stop plug was relocated and welded to the top plate. There is no access to the back side of it like this so I cut it completely off and drilled a hole through the stock top shock post and installed the bumpers on the top. They where the same length as the stock bumper but the felt like harder rubber so I cut off one tier. Haven't had them on long but so far they are working.

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This is how it was set up (complete with missing bumper, seriously, I went through four of the stock ones before I gave up)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Homemade woods/street, bug out rail. IRS, Balljoint front end. 1967 1600cc DP, Weber 32/36 progressive, tri-mil quiet pack. Rear only cutting brakes.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630046
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didget69
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Toss out the rear 'coil-over' shocks - they suck. Those are merely helper springs on the shock.

Move the oil cooler before you bust a line & get hosed by hot oil. Relocate the cooler & at a minimum install a small fan on it, like those on a motorcycle. Don't place the fan over the air intake on the back of the shroud.

Your local Advance Auto/Pep Boys/etc should have the Energy Suspension Universal Bump stops - pn: 9.9101G available...

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/energy-suspensi...efZC=27284

bnc
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philthy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't forget to move your rear brake lines so they don't get smashed!
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dustymojave
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with Philthy.

And those bump stops shown are ALL made by Prothane, in Orange County California, no matter whose name they are sold under. Prothane is a subsidiary of BugPack, which means that they are now a subsidiary of EMPI, since EMPI bought Bugpack this spring. Let's hope manufacturing remains in California not China and the quality does not go downhill.

Aerindel could probably cut a couple or 3 more steps off and the stops still work just fine, while allowing a little more working travel. I suggest an extra "pad" of 1/8" to 3/16" steel plate on the arm where the urethane hits.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


There are some other sizes and shapes of similar urethane snubbers available if those won't fit somebody else's setup.
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Offroading VW based cars since 1965
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Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
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