Front Shocks

CaChris · Posted: Mon Sep 14, 2015 4:42 pm Post subject: Front Shocks

Front shocks on a 67

I'm looking to replace my front shock on my 67 Baja, they do not appear to be doing anything. I can stand on the bumper brackets and I get no response from the front end. Plus the ride is not genital on the kidneys. I go down some fairly wash boarded roads and maybe some very light dune driving, other than that it's going to be my daily driver. Any recommendations on bolt on shocks for this front end?

dustymojave · Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 1:39 am Post subject:

KYB Gas-A-Just. By shopping carefully over the internet, you can buy them new for a little over $30 each instead of at list which is now over $60 each.

I drove my basically stock non-Baja 67 Bug with Gas-A-Just shocks for over 375,000 miles. I felt it worked great and rode nice. yet I have them on my Baja and raced my buggy with them.

I keep reading on here comments from folks who complain about a rough ride with the KYB shocks I have come to the conclusion that they're weenies expecting an offroad car to ride like a '67 Cadillac (wallowing around like a badly designed boat on rough seas).

Some of the group described above will try to talk you into going for "softer" shocks. But even for pure street, you need shocks that actually work as "Shock Absorbers". Others will try to talk you into buying "better" shocks for a lot more $$. But for the type of use you describe, the KYBs are all you need.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

Rusti shakelfurd · Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 2:04 am Post subject:

If it's a new rig check that someone didn't put them red bushings in the beam for the arms i have a rail that some one before me put those in and they were oversize and the front had no travel what so ever it was a pain to get the arms out and I had to turn down the bushings to get some travel again worth a check if it doesn't move at all as far as shocks go I agree Kyb does the trick
_________________
1961 baja (soon to be turbo 1600)
Home made sand and woods rail

CaChris · Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 7:25 am Post subject:

Thanks everybody

Kyb seem right for me. I do have red bushings, not sure what they are. I will take a picture when i get home tonight and post it. I believe the last person spray painted them.

race-desert · Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 5:30 pm Post subject:

Just for the fun of it- remove the shocks and jump on bumper to see if it moves! you might have something else going on like a cut and turned front end that was turned to far and/or what others have stated above.... after everything is right, buy yourself some kyb (whites) as stated above.

CaChris · Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 7:17 pm Post subject:

Ok here is what i found out...

Yes i do have red bushings

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Pulled the shock it is a kyb white

Made a top and bottom mark on the shock and placed it back in the car. With the weight of the car on the shock it almost bottomed out, maybe 1" left maybe.
Jump up on the bumper and it went all the way to the bottom, never coming back up.

I'm guessing not normal?

Rusti shakelfurd · Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 1:05 am Post subject:

Ya pull them bushings out and ream Em out or turn Em down a Lil bit i had that problem with those to

_________________
1961 baja (soon to be turbo 1600)
Home made sand and woods rail

CaChris · Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 7:49 pm Post subject:

Ok.... can i do this job with out pulling the ball joints out? Or am i looking at redoing the front end? I noticed that all the zirk fitting are covered or broken what the odds that i can fix them and inject molly and stuff will start working?

Rusti shakelfurd · Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 12:59 am Post subject:

It's worth a shot to grease the crap out of it i doubt that the spring packs are that dirty that it would inhibit movement but you never know my money is on those red bushings being oversize and binding it i have that one rail like i was saying had no movement what so ever and I took probably .050 off of the bushings and it fixed it right up and ya you got to pull everything apart and pull the arms out those bushings sit inside the beam 6 inches or so
_________________
1961 baja (soon to be turbo 1600)
Home made sand and woods rail

dustymojave · Posted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 10:34 pm Post subject:

The red trailing arm bushings (or the white ones as well) should be a snug fit into the beam without the arm inside of the bushing. It's best if they require a little tapping with a rubber mallet to get them in there. Then once the bushings are in place in the beam, the arms should be a close fit into the bushings. They should move easily, but not clunk around. If the bushings are a loose fit in the beam tubes, the bushings should be replaced. If the arms are too snug in the bushings, the bushings need to be reamed. The reamer tool for the bushings costs $80+. It doesn't need any other tools or fancy equipment to use the reamer. Just an end wrench that fits the end to turn it to ream and the wrench to fit the adjuster collars for fit. Don't try to take all the material off in one turn. Just shave it until the arm fits snug, but easily rotated in the bushing.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

CaChris · Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:19 pm Post subject:

OK so I'm reading the forums and I run across a thread that had stated that adjusting the lower bolt in would lower the suspension. So if I back it out would I gain some height?

CaChris · Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:35 pm Post subject:

OK so I'm reading the forums and I run across a thread that had stated that adjusting the lower bolt in would lower the suspension. So if I back it out would I gain some height? Seems Opposite....

CaChris · Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:28 pm Post subject:

Sorry double post!

Bummer I adjusted the upper adjuster all the way in maybe 1/2" but nothing change with the ride height (the bottom was stripped). I'm starting to think that the beam is for a lowered front end.

TDCTDI · Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:42 pm Post subject:

The problem might be that it's adjusted too far & that it has reached the limits of the balljoints travel thus causing a harsh ride, try loosening the adjuster clamp nuts & then backing the adjusting screw out, this will lower the front but allow the suspension to work.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.

GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!

An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.

Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it.

CaChris · Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:35 pm Post subject:

OK I will give that a shot I would rather have suspension then the ride height at this point. Do you think it might be a lowered beam? Should i look into getting a new beam or girding off the welds and rotating the adjusters? It's good to have options! Shocked

ORANGECRUSHer · Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 12:15 pm Post subject:

a lot of the convo doesn't make sense.
I think your springs are broken from the evidence you give. You say the suspension collapsed bottoming out the shock which you think is a prob with shock which is incorrect, it's your springs. At the same time, you say you have the adjusters turned all the way in and your willing to sacrifice travel. according to your shock test you shouldn't have any travel because your driving around on the shock stops all the time.

Pull yer dang beam apart already and have a look at the springs. (tight bushings will also cause this)
_________________
Brian H.
I may not know everything,but I will try to help if I can
OrangeCrushER Berrien Warrior 2.4L Quad4
LAZY MARY 1970 Baja ~~1835cc~~

CaChris · Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 6:34 pm Post subject:

Your right I'm confused for sure.... First bug Very Happy

. I was trying to not have to rip apart the front end until later. Loose fan bigger issue. Shocked

But I see this might not be an option. Not knowing what I'm talking about, I would have to agree my gut feeling is one of the torsion packs is shot. I do not have any stoppers on the front end it seems to me the shocks are the stoppers. I have about 1" of travel left before bottoming out the shocks. But I might be binding the ball joints because it feels like i have no front suspension. I guess my main concern at this point is that I don't have lowered front beam. Would hate to go though all the trouble of replacing everything to find out I need a new beam for a baja.

Thanks Chris

dustymojave · Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 10:12 am Post subject:

I see no reason for you to need a new beam. There may be parts that need replacing, but NOT the whole beam.

A ball joint beam does not have any stops other than the shocks unless/until someone ADDS hook and rod or other similar stops. Offroad use will quickly destroy shocks without other bump stops.

If you only have an inch of travel before the shock bottoms out and stops the movement, then you probably have broken torsion leaves (springs). Or maybe someone cut them to soften or lower it previously. Stripped adjuster can get a new bolt or weld in a new nut if that is what is stripped.

Screwing the allen screw IN will lift the ride height. Backing the screw out will lower the ride height.

If you pull the leaf packs out, leave the arm on the leaves on the side you pull from to keep the leaves together. It gives you a handle to pull with also. The leaves should not get flipped so the direction of rotation is reversed or the ends swapped left to right.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

CaChris · Posted: Sat Oct 10, 2015 3:10 pm Post subject:

Ok the upper seems softer than the bottom both seem to be working. I guess I'm going to pull out the upper and see where I stand. A little more info the upper torsion arm is rotating in the bushing. The lower arm and bushing is rotating in the beam. Time for new bushings or just ream? Need to buy the tool so I guess I'll put it back together until I get what I need.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNSXTXrdlC8

dustymojave · Posted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:19 pm Post subject:


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