Opinion on condition please! First Vanagon/Syncro

[E-Rock]

Hi folks. I've posted few times on the forum but I've been a long time lurker. I'm finally nearing the purchase of a Syncro that I won't be able to see in person. I don't have a ton of money to play with but think I found one that meats my criteria. My only concern is rust, as the vehicle will be coming to NY. The factory undercoating is gone and the underside is covered in surface rust but nothing appears to be structurally compromised. I've attached some photos and would love to hear opinions. I figure that I'll coat the underside in fluid film to help prevent from further wear. I know it's hard to tell what's going on just from photos. The vehicle had a mediocre paint job and was originally sprayed 6" up the side with rhino lining which was mostly removed. I'm wondering if this is what accounts for the crusty bits around the jack points. Everything else about the bus seems solid, although it will need some new tires soon . Thanks for helping out a novice.

-Eric

[ChilliConCarnage]

[dobryan]

[insyncro]

Line up and pay for a pre purchase examination by a qualified mechanic who has Syncro experience.

Not only will you learn from the experience, use this mechanic to maintain the van.

Your largest hurdle will be locating NLA and hard to come by parts to keep this van running and driving.

Plan ahead and have the mechanic and parts sources lined up before any van is purchased.

Just buying the van is just one aspect of Syncro ownership.

Give it a good think
Some are not truly cut out to own a $yncro.

A few threads around here will back up that statement.

[flomulgator]

I'm not seeing anything that looks too bad yet, but there are some areas that I would ask the seller for additional pictures of:

transmission mounts
fuel tank straps
rear shock mounts
rear bumper underside
bottom corner driver's side of windshield
rear panels behind rear tire

These will give you an idea of how incipient the rust really is. From what we can see in the photos so far it just looks like surface rust, but none of the nasty places are really shown.

The difference between surface rust and all the above places being rusted can be measured in time & money, or money & more money. If it truly is just the surface rust you have 3 options:

1. Buy it an do nothing, expecting it to succumb to NY salt to the point of a total loss in 5-10 years. (I think I just felt a shift in The Samba, like a million hackles just raised up at once).

2. Buy Fluid Film by the pail, and a spray gun, and make a sticky stinky mess of the whole thing (but like food-grade shellac on a photo-shoot food product, it will preserve that syncro-y goodness for another year). This is actually a decent strategy if you stay on top of it. Or,

3. Plan to spend about a 100 hours brushing, sanding, converting, painting, and undercoating the thing and all it's parts.

That's my 2 cents.
- from a guy who just spent all weekend doing step 3.
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She's built like a steakhouse, but she handles like a bistro!

[Terry Kay]

Looks like a well used Vehicle.

As long as you have a ton of cash to keep it up and running , go for it.

No sense of attempting to suggest anything else--you want a Syncro--??

Buy it.
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T.K.

[minsk]

$yncro

love it.

that syncro doesnt look as have as rusty as mine was.
what was the price?
_________________
1987 Sunroof Syncro
1988 Vanagon GL
1990 Carat
2009 audi a3

www.sunroofsyncro.com
vanagonmechanic.com

http://facebook.com/pittsburghvanagonclub
https://www.youtube.com/minskmade


my super slow 1987 sunroof syncro rebuild
https://goo.gl/photos/7e9MZhHJxGvvv1Tm7

VANAGON STICKERS
https://www.etsy.com/shop/pigeonink

[minsk]

i chose number 3


3. Plan to spend about a 100 hours brushing, sanding, converting, painting, and undercoating the thing and all it's parts.
_________________
1987 Sunroof Syncro
1988 Vanagon GL
1990 Carat
2009 audi a3

www.sunroofsyncro.com
vanagonmechanic.com

http://facebook.com/pittsburghvanagonclub
https://www.youtube.com/minskmade


my super slow 1987 sunroof syncro rebuild
https://goo.gl/photos/7e9MZhHJxGvvv1Tm7

VANAGON STICKERS
https://www.etsy.com/shop/pigeonink

[insyncro]

Here is a true story:

A young man contacts be because he bought a Syncro.
He wants to drive to AK with it
The seller, a Samba member, explains the condition of the van to him.
New paint, rebuilt motor by a respected professional and "perfect" transmission.

The buyer paid $16,500 for it.

Drove it up to my shop, after a few hours of my time on the phone with the new owner.

I could hear the van coming from over a mile away.
At about 150 yards I could see rust and mismatched paint.
It pulled onto my pad as I directed.
The van after two minutes dropped engine oil, coolant and a large amount of transmission fluid.
I took one look at the underside of the van, ask the new owner to move it off my fresh asphalt and gave him and his girlfriend a quick looksee inside my shop, showed them what a properly built and installed WBX from the same builder looks like, showed and explained the cost to properly rebuild a Syncro locker transmission and let them both know that I can not even touch the van they brought here for me to look at and build/maintain for them.

I am sharing because no pre purchase exam was done and after the fact I had to let them both know that what they purchased MAY be worth $2500-$4000 on a good day...closer to $2500 if people around here saw the condition.

Ads and pictures are great.
You better know or hire someone who knows to look these vans over...
Or you may be making a very costly $yncro purchase.

I am just sharing and no longer entertaining any Vanagon work at my shop due to experiences like this and plenty of others that can be searched and read online at your leisure.

Hope this helps.

[E-Rock]

I was hoping to get it for 14k but it might end being 15. It's been looked over by Automeister in Manhattan Beach. It has a pretty low mileage gowesty 2.3l in it. Interior is in great shape. I have a buddy who's going to see it in person on Wednesday who owns a syncro so hopefully he can fill me in a bit more! It does seem like a daunting undertaking with having to fend off rust in NY. Maybe I should just get something a bit less valuable. But damn, syncros! Gah!

[davevickery]

It looks fine. It will be a cream puff compared to the others in the Northeast. It looks like it was repainted, was that a while ago? The longer the better because you can tell how well it is holding up. It looks good to me from the pics. Is there any rust coming through the paint on main body panels? It will come through first at at the underside and seams which is to be expected, but it would be nice to see before repaint pictures if they have some, or look at the paint job up close.

Nothing you can do to keep the rust from expanding over time. Even a rust free Arizona van will immediately get surface rust when brought to a wetter climate.

You just have to be realistic, it is a 30 year old van you are taking to New England. It is going to rust, very much so if driven on salty roads, but even if just driven in summers, what's there is going to slowly grow. I grew up in NE and you don't expect vehicles to last forever.

[insyncro]

A Toyota pickup is a great year round NY vehicle.
Play your cards right and Yota will spring for a brand new frame and retro it with many new parts.

All my Buddies here in NY want vans and have Yotas.

[Abscate]

we wouldn't even call that rust here in NY. You will not prevent rust from happening though, its called entropy.

These are not cars for the budget minded - read the links to repairs and NLA parts and costs.
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.ssS!

[WestyBob]

I **almost** wish something **syncro specific** on my fleet of syncros would go bad after decades of ownership so I could join the "beware syncro costs" chorus that always spawns. (thread participants shudder and plot to retaliate

From what I can see there's nothing critical happening underneath and if it's been driven all its life in NE winters then I'd say it's amazingly comparatively clean.

What I will agree with, with some on this thread, as more important is to have it checked out and make sure everything is working properly before cash layout.

The last thing I'd recommend and echo is don't drive it in winter to help preserve -- syncros appreciate if in reasonably good shape. If you want it for a daily then I'd recommend something else -- Toyota trucks seem fine ... they seem to be popular in the Middle East.

[buspor63]

Have your buddy take a magnet with him to check for suspicious looking painted areas, Vanagons rust in all the same spots. My Syncro has always been a East Tennessee one, but it still has windshield and door step rust. Other than that, it's shiny underneath.
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Imagine that, theres not an "h" in either Westfalia or Syncro?

[Bassyaks]

Check the rear fender wells, have him look up on the underside. Also the step ups on each door. they usually are the first places to go, look for rust on the seams at the rear wheels.
Other than that the transmission is the next big ticket part. Your buddy should be able to asset that.
Like everyone says "expect to put a ton of cash into it" if you want a reliable vehicle .

Good Luck

[DwarfVader]

All I can say is this....

That horn is gnarly.

and the rust you see is only part of the problem. (I've learned more about rust in the last month than I think I ever wanted to know....)
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- oderint dum metuant -

I'll find my van someday, or it will find me.

[Howesight]

Is the vehicle a tin top or Westfalia? If it's a tin top, the asking price is on the high end and is in the range that would call for a body in decent condition.

The undercarriage components can be inexpensively cleaned and painted by you. Body rust is a different thing. As one poster said above, to check for the "canary in the coal-mine" rust, look under the rubber pads in the foot wells at the front doors. Then peel back the carpet and the shaped foam under the driver's feet area (the foam is glued, but do this check anyway). If these areas are good, that is a great sign about the life this van had until now.

Check all the body seams for signs of rust or repairs. The seam located on the driver side between the front wheel-well "dog leg" and the long panel in the middle of the van is one of the first seams to get rust. The next most likely is the seam at the dog-leg over the rear wheel-well flare on the passenger side of the vehicle. Finally, check for rust at and under the windshield rubber. If those are all good, then you may just have found a great van. Have your friend provide pics of any questionable areas he finds.

Hopefully, the under-carriage surface rust is the result of too much time driving on salty beaches in and around SoCal and the rust might just be restricted to undercarriage rust. SoCal vans can live forever, despite some beach salt, because of the dry environment and lack of road salt. So, bringing the van to Noo Yok is going to require some grunt work underneath, plus regular maintenance to your rust-protection efforts, to protect it.
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'86 Syncro Westy SVX

[Yondermtn]

Price is a little on the high side and I think it's been for sale for a while.
Definitely have someone check over the body. Looks like some work has been done in some of these pics but that could be my phone. http://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/cto/5328342053.html
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1977 Westfalia 2.0FI 4spd
1990 Multivan 2.1 Auto

[E-Rock]

I've decided to hold off on buying a syncro thanks to you guys! If I lived in a dryer, less salty area I'd move on one but it simply doesn't make sense for me right now. I appreciate your input! Now to find a tacoma...