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Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack plan
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Herdfan75
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Location: Tornado, WV
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2015 10:02 pm    Post subject: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack plan Reply with quote

I'm at a crossroad with my 64 Beetle and I haven't even started on it. The car is all original down to the paper hoses in the engine compartment. Problem is the heater channels and the floor pans are toast, in fact, totally missing on the driver side. Here's what it looks like:

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The PO cut out the heater channel between the door posts and the floor on the driver side. On the passenger side, everything is still intact. Now, I know that once the channel is removed the door shouldn't be opened but unfortunately it's been opened many times. The body is still on the pan thankfully. The door shuts well and the body lines meet nicely but the door gap is very wide on the driver side. Can anyone give me advice on how to close the gap so I can brace the car for removing the body from the pan? I can push in on the bottom of the door and the quarter panel and make it a little better, but not nearly good enough.

The reason I ask is I have a plan of attack but would like your advice first. I want to brace up the car and remove the body from the pan and store the body on a dolly for the winter. Then I will replace the driver side floor pan, lining it up with the factory floor on the passenger side body holes for reference. Then I'll replace the passenger pan. Once this is done I'll clean up the pan, front beam, replace brake lines and master cylinder, and freshen up the transaxle. My intention is to have the pan done by Spring.

Once warmer weather returns I'll replace the rear crossmembers (they are rusty on the ends) and a couple of small sections on the front firewall panel where the channels meet the front. Then, I will bolt new channels to the pan and lower the body on to make sure everything lines up correctly. Once I gt the fit where I'm happy with it I'll tack the channels in place and then raise the body back off about 6 inches or so and finish welding it up.

The reason I'm saying all this is, I really would feel more comfortable bracing the body and then removing so I can open the doors without worry once it's off the pan. Or, should I just leave well enough that alone, remove the body and make sure not to open the doors. Then, when I set the body back on the pan/channels, fix the problem as I'm lining the body back up to the new channels? In my mind, once the new channel is in place the body will be pulled back into place. See, the body isnt sprung...its just where the channel is removed on the driver side it's allowed the quarter on that side to lay out too far. They should have braced the car before they cut anything out!

I hope this all makes sense! I'm probably overthinking it. I just don't want to make it worse. If I could figure out how to pull that section back in I'd brace it across the back and sides and be done with it.

Here's the rest of the car. He has character!

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Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Mike Fisher
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 12:06 am    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

I would tack weld in the new heater channel so the door & quarter panel fit correctly, then cut/grind/fit & bolt the new 1/2 pan into position. You then have to unbolt the pan, so you can finish welding the heater channel completely. The final step is reinstalling the pan for final welding & www.masterseriesct.com brush on silver & black coating. On the passenger side cut the bad 1/2 pan out first & weld new 1/2 pan in last. Leave the body on the pan & everything will fit! Idea
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Herdfan75
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2015 9:46 am    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

Mike Fisher wrote:
I would tack weld in the new heater channel so the door & quarter panel fit correctly, then cut/grind/fit & bolt the new 1/2 pan into position. You then have to unbolt the pan, so you can finish welding the heater channel completely. The final step is reinstalling the pan for final welding & www.masterseriesct.com brush on silver & black coating. On the passenger side cut the bad 1/2 pan out first & weld new 1/2 pan in last. Leave the body on the pan & everything will fit! Idea


Now see, there you go. I knew I was over thinking it. I guess it would be fairly easy (all things relative) to fit the heater channel with the pan already cut out. Very Happy
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67rustavenger Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:21 am    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

Just an idea.
Weld an all thread rod to the inside of the A and B pillar with a turn buckle in the middle and a couple of jam nuts to lock everything in place. That way you can adjust the door opening to correct the door gaps before you do anything else.
Then follow Mike Fishers procedure to get it back together.
I have never done this. But it just makes sense to me.
I mean, after all the PO already did the damage when he cut out the heater channel and then opened the door.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Good luck
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bvd
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2015 9:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

having tackled this about 2 years ago (heather channels only), the above advice is pretty sound. take a look through old posts using the "search" function, and you'll find some pretty detailed threads on here with good photos of the process.

also, try to check out the "bug me" video which has some great demonstrations of heater channel replacement.
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Customalways
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2015 5:18 am    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

HerdFan -

I am about to start a Channel and some outlying metal install on my 56 ( http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=643347 ) link to my post on here titles 56 Heater Channel and Other Metal Start Point. There was a post on there that sent me to a build thread which was very very helpful.

As referenced in the previous post, I welded some steel angle and welded a turnbuckle between the 2 pieces for adjustments. I did this front to back on each side at the doors (i kept doors in place). I also put one side to side back where the back seat boys in. I can sent you pictures if it would help.

I may do a small build thread in hopes it will help someone out there as I have at times exhausted my eyes searching for scattered references. I also reference another members thread in my first post on my topic which is a great read if trying to get concept of channel replacement and other metal work in general.

I saw the videos in portion and they weren't very inspirational in my opinion. If someone did an updated version it would be seriously beneficial.
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bvd
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

Like above poster mentioned, welding angle iron with turnbuckles in the middle is really a good idea, as once you fit new heater channel into place, there is a decent amount of "finagling" that must be dona in order to ensure everything is squared up and door gaps are even all around before tacking in the channel for good.

I just used a solid piece of angle iron in the door to keep everything stable, but the turnbuckles are a great idea.

My door gaps on my '74 are a bit off as a result of not aligning everything 100% properly, but what the hell, I was a 21 year old shit head (now I'm a 24 year old shit head Laughing ). It was my first time tackling a heater channel replacement (both sides). It is a ton of work, I'm not going to lie, but if I ever attempt it again, I'd probably be able to do it in half the time. It's one of those "learn as you go" sorts of things. Anyone who is in the hobby these days, especially in my part of the world (New York State) where we salt our roads like a pork tenderloin in the winter, encounters heater channel rust at one point or another with an aircooled bug project. Especially if you can't afford to lay down at least $7,000.00 to buy one that's already been fixed.

Another thing, make sure you buy the best quality channels you can find. I used Dansk/Klokkerheim, as they were the best ones I could find at the time, but admittedly, they are a bit thinner gauge of metal than the original stuff from VW.

Good luck, and don't hesitate to ask anymore questions.
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bvd
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

Oh, also just saw Mike Fisher posting about Masterseries. He's always talking about how great it is, and agree with him 100%. GREAT STUFF! They use it to paint bridges with. Moisture cured urethane..........don't get it on your skin and use a charcoal activated respirator if you're using it in tight quarters with minimal air flow (15 bucks for a good Gerson one at your local harbor freight)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2015 1:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

Giving up already?

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1868140
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bvd
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2015 2:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Need advice on heater channel replacement and an attack Reply with quote

damn! herdfan, we didn't scare you away, did we?!?!
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