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Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum
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rmcd
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 3:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

Do you have to vent from the hockey puck if it was deleted as part of the TDI ALH install. Does the crankcase vent catch can need to be at a certain height relative to the turbo or.....

My exhaust is in the way so i will relocate my catch can and dig up a spare hockey puck if needed.

By they way. Thanks for all this great tdi info. Maybe there should be a dedicated thread for tdi installs?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 6:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

BavarianWrench, that's a good point about different probe locations, different guages, etc. making it difficult to get consistent information on the EGTs. It will be interesting to hear what people feel is the ceiling, or worry point, of the EGTs.

MarkWard, I'm thinking about running a lift pump anyway...just because. I know some have said that it's not necessary, but for a newby like me, it seems like if I use a pump that does not restrict fuel flow if it fails, I have a useful tool for purging the air out of the system when necessary. It seems that would take some of the question marks out of things for a person with limited diesel experience.

Is there a particular lift pump that people suggest that does not restrict flow if it fails? I found the Kennedy Diesel lift pump but it seems kind of spendy at $195.

And yeah, the diesel heater makes me feel toasty already.

dkoesyncro, that's a really good question about how the factory deals with the EGTs. I'm guessing that at least part of it has to do with the aerodynamics like syncrodoka mentioned, but I can't imagine that's the whole story. I would love to learn more about this.

syncrodoka, that's exactly how I feel/felt about the TDI thing. It's these little details and lack of knowledge on my part that have kept me from taking the leap. However, this thread is really starting to gather some good information that is making me feel more and more confident.

tjet, thanks for those cold weather tips. That's the kind of stuff that would have never crossed my mind until I was forced to deal with it. Awesome!
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

rmcd wrote:


By they way. Thanks for all this great tdi info. Maybe there should be a dedicated thread for tdi installs?


Yeah, I feel the same way! I changed the title of the thread a bit and I hope that the TDI information keeps coming.

At this point, I'm going to keep pressing forward with the mTDI. I will keep gathering parts as I figure out what I need and hopefully it all pans out like I want it too.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

outwesty wrote:
... I love the WBX but I wouldn't hop in it and drive to the arctic circle tomorrow like I have with the TDI. The thing can have parts dragging behind it and still keeps going....


It's comments like this above, (along with driving a TDI car to work daily) which sells me on a conversion for my Syncro.

Another plus is range. If a 20 gallon fuel tank is added & the Syncro tank modified, you are looking at a safe 800+ mile range at a realistic 25 MPG. That's based on a usable fuel of 15 gallons on the stock tank, + 18 gallons on the aux, = 33 gallons x 25 MPG est.

Range is a big thing with the guys at campervanculture

If you haven't seen it, you can see their amazing Morocco journey below (with new TDI installed Cool

https://vimeo.com/86433224


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

I've never had any issues with water in the fuel and park with the tank at any part of full in very cold weather. Regardless it is definitely a good idea to have a spare fuel filter at all times.

I personally keep EGTs limited to 1250 peak. I used to run hotter than that, but I'd personally rather be easier on the engine. Dialing in the EGTs is not difficult. As I mentioned before either reducing fuel (without changing boost) or increasing boost (without changing fuel) will lower EGTs. As far as the factory is concerned, they intrinsically regulate EGTs by adjusting fuel or boost. I do not know how hot the stock factory tune will run the sustained EGTs.

The lowest temp I have tried to start one of my mTDIs was down to -7°F at 7,000' of elevation without a block heater. It started virtually instantly - on the first revolution of the starter.

I don't see a need for the hockey puck if running to a catch can and atmosphere. I wouldn't run that way myself, though, due to the potential mess and added emissions.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

Christopher Schimke wrote:


outwesty, thanks for that awesome report. It's reports like that that make me swing toward the TDI. Is that a lift pump on the firewall next to the filter? Is that necessary? I mean, obviously you are running it for a reason, but I notice that some people don't.

I have a question about the EGTs though. When you said "I let my EGT's get up to 1450 before backing off and have held them at 1450 for up to 10 minutes going over long passes." what were the conditions like that led up to the 1450º EGT (travel speed, steepness of the terrain, how long did it take for the EGTs to get that high) and once you backed off, was that to prevent the EGT from climbing higher and you held it at 1450º or did you back off enough that the EGT started coming down?

I guess the prudent question is - From the driver's seat, what are the proper precautions and measures to take when it comes to EGT? We have lot's of steep mountain terrain around here so if I end up going the TDI route, I will undoubtedly need to deal with that at some point. What EGT is too high? I know several people have made comments about them in the past so I'm sure everyone's comfort level is different, but where does a diesel newby start to be concerned?


Correct Chris, The lift pump is just for when I run out of fuel to make priming the pump easy. I've only ran out of fuel one time, and I just re-filled the tank, turned the key, and the system was primed....done. If you've ever primed a TDI with empty lines it can take a while. If these facet lift pump die, fuel can still be pulled through them which is nice. (cheap at about $40, available at any napa)

Bavarianwrench Andrew brings up a good point. Temps will fluctuate based on where EGT is measured. I have mine in the blazes of hell right in the main flow of the manifold 2 inches before the turbo. A reading in the EGR block off plate or post turbo is not going to be as true. When reading posts on TDI club I've noticed some of the lower readings are from people with these types of EGT probes not in the main gas flow.

Sorry if this is confusing. I'm generally at 700-900 EGT on the highway. Once 1450 (a steep grade) is reached I just let off and feather the pedal (while maintaining same speed) and sometimes the EGTS will immediately drop a bit depending on the incline, or hover steadily. My EGT's are a little higher than they were before as I have moved to a different elevation, and changed nozzles and the tune just isn't dialed in for the new nozzles. I was just going to wait until I get the GT2052 on and then have mark send me new chips. On another note, I can still go up Donner pass in 4th and keep the EGT's at say....1200ish but just at a slower pace. 1450 is doing 65-70 up a pass.

EDIT - Keep in mind this is a 2WD but I've had no trans issues in 90k miles. GTA rebuilt it with a 1.14 third and 0.70 4th. This was perfect with a 215 65 16 tire but when I bumped up to 215 70 16 I think a 0.75 4th may have been a little better for keeping EGT's down on long 4th gear pulls. (I'm still quite pleased with the .70 though. It cruises 72MPH at 3050RPMS) You will likely spend weeks playing with those gear calculators trying to figure out what is perfect.

If you want this to turn into a TDI thread (which is great) I can add a few notes on some things I did that were an improvement but don't want to derail your initial question too bad.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

outwesty wrote:


If you want this to turn into a TDI thread (which is great) I can add a few notes on some things I did that were an improvement but don't want to derail your initial question too bad.


Yes, by all means, let's please turn this into a TDI thread. I mean, for the most part the WBX is "known". However, to people like me, the TDI is a bit of a mystery. It's really great learning from all of you who have been down the TDI road and who have tips, tricks and experiences to help those of us who are considering a TDI compared to another swap. Even the Subaru, 1.8T and Bostig swaps feel very well known compared to the TDI...to me anyway, and I can't be alone with that feeling.

So yeah, bring on all of the TDI stuff you can muster. And thank you!
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 9:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

You are welcome. Glad to be of help. I owe a lot of people on here a beer for sharing their knowledge. I've attempted to keep things as simple as possible so repairs far from home are not a matter of waiting for weird or hard to get parts; should that ever happen.

Coolant routing. The stock 1.6 vanagon diesel hose routing is different from how the AHU is set up. Karl Mullundore noticed this first (who has been of great help along the way) and made a post about it on here before. I can't find it at the moment (anyone remember? ) but it just involves making an aluminum connector to route coolant how the AHU was in the car it came in. I also added a restrictor in the upper coolant hose that connects to the top of the coolant tank. Its a brass plug with a 1/4" hole drilled in it. This allows less coolant to bypass back into the coolant tank via this upper hose. These two changes DRAMATICALLY reduced my oil temps (by pushing more coolant through the exchanger I'm guessing) 255F oil temp is now my Absolute MAX on the hottest of days over a long pass. Oil temp usually follows coolant temp in regular driving and about 225 on the highway which I feel is just about perfect. I also run the larger Passat coolant exchanger (easy to find info on this on TDI club) It requires a longer threaded oil filter post from a VR6 I want to say. I have a super small oil radiator mounted in the engine bay under the coolant tank with a thermostatic sandwich plate but I don't think its really necessary. Do the two mods above with a passat coolant exchanger and you should be good. Also make sure your gauges have their own ground. For years I was getting incorrect (high) readings because of this when the headlights were on.

Air Filtration - I think this is super important in a rear engine design when doing a lot of dirt road travel. The Donaldsons have two filters in them and I've never had so much as a spec of dust get to the secondary one. Its a little tricky but I HIGHLY suggest sucking air from the upper D pillar vent like the factory did. I used a lot of silicone hoses and made it work and its waterproof. My filter would get dirty too quickly sucking air from the bottom of the D pillar. The Donaldson part # is G065433 and available online at many filter places. I worked on a Grain farm last summer in the most severe dust conditions imaginable and all the modern farm machinery runs Donaldson....and some of them are as big as a trash can. They just work really well. I'm so glad I went that route over a K&N or similar.

Wiring -I won't go too into wiring since you are doing an MTDI but I moved the ECU from under the bench into the rear closet and added another OBD port there so I can do diagnostics from the front seat or in the engine bay(setting timing on vag com etc). I originally ran wiring underneath the van for gauges and DBW pedal but I moved it all inside eventually, and ran it behind the westy cabinets. I figure wires shouldn't be out in the elements if they don't have to. To each their own there.

Intercooler - Don't need to say much here as your 1.8T intercooler is the best I have seen. Just copy that idea. I have an air/water as well but not as clean as yours. The common Bosch pump ($90 or so) is still working fine and is triggered from the alt.

Nozzles - I've tried 4 different variations. They make a very noticeable difference in power over stock but without having a VNT turbo (like the ALH) they all have given a some amount of smoke at WOT. With a tin top I say start off stock and see how you like it.

Exhaust - I originally had a custom muffler made by Karls guy at stainless specialties but I felt bad not running a cat and didn't want to re-engineer what I already had. I simply replaced the muffler with a 2.5" magnaflow diesel spec cat. Its really not much louder and seems to smell a tad better.

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Lift pump - As noted in my previous post its just a precautionary measure when you run out of fuel or have to service the pump. I no longer have to carry a hand vacuum pump with me. At only $40, this seems like a cheap way to avoid headaches.

Turbo / bolts / drain - Use the VW turbo bolts! I used regular 12.9 bolts to attach the turbo.(aaz manifold with a 1/2" thick steel adapter to get the turbo up higher than stock, drains into block, not pan, have had no issues, I've read to use the largest diameter turbo drain hose you can fit) After 5,000 miles the bolts fatigued (guessing from heat cycles) and snapped off in Alaska. Luckily I could still drive into Anchorage without any boost and had a machine shop drill the snapped out bolts out. He happened to be from my Hometown of Grand Rapids, MI and refused to take my money and let me do the repair in the parking so all turned out well on that one. Anchorage VW had the correct bolts in 3 days. Lesson learned.

Oil Dipstick - I just shortened a MK4 TDI dipstick to the correct length and used the stock spot. You can engineer something that can be checked from the license plate but it seems like you're just adding another spot for a leak or possible failure. I never have to add oil between 7500 mile changes.


Espar D2 heater - Can't say enough good things about it. I have the high altitude pump on it and it just always works. I ran it for a week straight while camping in Cooke City, MT before and I don't know exactly how much fuel it used but it was not much.

EGR / CCV - I removed the EGR as I used an AAZ exhaust manifold on my AHU. I still run the stock puck in the valve cover and run the hose into the intake pipe (one on right in photo, before bung was welded on) Sure it coats the intercooler and charge pipes with oil, but it just works. I was going to do a catchcan but after hearing horror stories of engines running away on them when they got too full I decided not to.

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Porting -just a note. some may remember I had a head crack on the way back from AK with less than 10k on it. I paid a good amount of money to have the head ported and polished and they simply went too far with it. The intake wall was as thin as a piece of paper and after 60 days or so it got a hairline crack into a water jacket. This was no fault of the swap and I was still able to drive to Bozeman and swap the head for a stock one at a friends place. Be careful if you decide to enlarge the ports in the AHU head. I won't bother after that mess. Also, I use stock VW head bolts. If you use the ARP head studs I don't think you could slide the head off the motor while still in the engine bay.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2015 10:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

outwesty wrote:
You are welcome. Glad to be of help. I owe a lot of people on here a beer for sharing their knowledge. I've attempted to keep things as simple as possible so repairs far from home are not a matter of waiting for weird or hard to get parts; should that ever happen.



Dude, you rock! Thanks for all of that info. I'll more to write on that info later, but I found Karl's oil cooler reroute posts and wanted to get it on here before I forget.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6...mp;start=0
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 5:44 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

Chris,

On the dual-mass flywheel question, I am like you, I have done a ton of reading but I have no personal experience. I just wanted to add one comment that Derek Drew passed along to me. He said the off-road guys generally don't like them for technical stuff.

This makes sense to me, because I think the biggest technical challenge the designers of these things face is getting the behaviour during initial clutch engagement right. They have a large amount of (rotation) travel during initial engagement. If the springs are too soft there is too much travel and the dual-mass can bottom out. If the springs are too hard then you don't get the desired amount of decoupling in the frequency range they are trying to work at.

They are designed for the every-day driver wanting smooth engagement and reduced NVH. But that comes at the cost of 'pedal feel' during initial engagement, so I can see why this might be a problem in certain kinds of offloading, for example HansJ in his boulder field.

My own conclusion has been that I would choose the dual-mass, for transmission protection. Then, if I didn't like it, consider a single mass and weigh the trade-offs. I think if you take care of the dual-mass it should last a long time. Single mass is cheaper, but comes at the cost of higher torsional forces. You can go to a bigger heavier one to smooth things out a bit on the transmission side, but you can only go so heavy before you start breaking crankshafts.

RonC
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 8:32 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

Wow! Amazing how quick this Thread has grown in just a few days.

I'll throw in my two cents about a TDI install. I built mine for a specific purpose: long trips, but ended up being my daily driver.

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It is a 2wd, tin-top 84, DK tranny (4.57 R&P) from 1980 air-cool (1.14 3rd & .77 4th from Weddle), 215/75/15 tires, and a 2002 Jetta ALH TDI engine. 70 mph equals about 3000 RPM (see pic below).... GPS and Scan Gauge verified. The Speedo data is converted using a Dakota Digital Interface. So, it is calibrated with the GPS (within + or - 1 MPH of correct). The pic below was taken while driving on the Yellowhead Highway in northern Alberta east of Edmonton pulling a popup camper.

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Oiling is not an issue. I had a custom stainless steel oil pan made after a disastrous failure of customizing the OE pan (lots of leaks). I run 5.5 quarts of oil. The pick-up tube was cut and re-angled for the 50 degree and set about 1/4 inch off the bottom of the pan. (no baffles on the bottom) The plastic windage/drain baffle that is OE on the ALH is modified.

50 degree: I left the Turbo drain OEM from the Jetta. Yes, it has a trap which holds oil. In my opinion, that is not an issue. RSXSR has been running his with the same set-up with no issues. The 50 degree requires engine cover modification using the ALH engine... that is a draw-back.

Cooling system: Bleeding air out was never an issue ........... I mean never.

To date, I've put over 51k miles on my project. It is a blast to drive. The Stage 1 Malone tune added about 20 HP which was a very noticeable improvement. Fuel mileage ranges from 32 to 36. The engine has over 180k miles on it (notice mileage in the above pic, summer of 2014). Yes, I did have to iron-out a number of bugs ........ pretty much a non-issue now.

As some of you know, besides a trip to Nova Scotia in 2013, my wife and I did a 33 day trip to Alaska and return in the summer of 2014 (pulling a 1200 pound popup camper) ........................ with ZERO issues related to the TDI engine. The average MPG for the trip was just under 26. (Stats are in the second link below at or near the end of the Thread)

EGT was never an issue, even in the Yellowstone National Park mountainous area in Wyoming on the return trip. Hills on the Interstate System did not bog down the engine. I can run 70 mph pulling the camper with all our junk on board. Also, due to a malfunctioning coolant system pressure gauge issue (my fault), the cooling system was not pressurized the entire trip.. no problem.

Yes, setting up and installing the ALH electricals is no cake-walk. But, I did install as many of the bells and whistles as possible, such as OBD and Jetta Cluster. The Cluster provides info such as Tach, Speedo, Glow Plug function, Fuel Level, Temp, Coolant level, Washer Level, Brake fluid level, CEL, etc. I did add PS to the Van as well as modify the AC system to use the compressor that come on the ALH engine.

EDIT: I do have a CAT on the exhaust system.

The entire project Thread (very long) can be seen here: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=276798

The Alaska trek (photos) can be seen here: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=417129
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2015 4:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

Random thoughts:

DMF vs solid flywheel. Just get the heaviest flywheel you can get. I'm going to even start looking for an even heavier serpentine belt pulley for that end. If I can't find one, I might make an insert out of lead weld another pulley to it. DMF would work great if it would last longer. Get a sprung clutch disc, that will help.

Crank case breather should be routed back to the turbo inlet, after the MAF. The air inside the crankcase has already been accounted for from the MAF (matters most for eTDI).

I keep my EGT at 1250 and then back off. I know even a stock ko3 can handle short bursts of 1450 without harm, but I'll just keep it under that. It's more important to not shut off the engine right away when the temps are that hot! Let it idle for a few minutes.

Cold warm up. This morning it was around 20*F or so in the desert. Started the van and let it idle to blow the condensation off the window. Ran both blowers full blast and coolant temp was around 40*C after 10 minutes or so and windows were drying out (it was around 40-50*F inside the van). When running the heaters, it does delay full warm up a bit. I also have nearly the entire heater hose system insulated with 1/8" foam and aluminum tape over it. Driving down hill with the heaters on full WILL lower the coolant temp below the thermostat temperature. I haven't had my fuel gel yet, but my brothers ALH Jetta gelled when it was around 5*F out. He was able to start and drive it a little while then it just died on him. He just got towed home. Winter diesel contains less wax to try to prevent it. You can also add something to the fuel if you are concerned about it.

Lift pump, I don't have one. Even the PD engines can get away with not needing one (they came stock with them) until air is introduced to the system. Like mentioned, a Facet square inline pump will work, you might not need to even run it, just have a switch to turn it on inside the engine bay when you do need it. I am however using a Mk3 one way valve on my fuel supply line just before the filter. I was concerned about diesel siphoning back to my tank and had some longer cranking times until I did that. May have just been a placebo I added to the system to make me sleep better...

You can get 06A steel oil pans from a Mk4 2.0, easily weldable. I know Christopher is going AHU which comes with a steel pan anyway, but for the ALH and BRM/BEW crowd...

The 058 windage tray should work pretty well for the 50* installation. Hinges could be added to the lower portion to try to control oil from sloshing away.

rmcd I had one of those catch cans on my TDI. Well it looked just like it. It was from ebay. I couldn't get it to stop leaking, however much I liked the idea of it. I may end up using the fancy MANN one someday. I am not breathing out the crankcase housing, just like stock. I just run the hockey puck in a straight hose down to the turbo inlet, post MAF. It's a clearish hose and I don't see any significant oil running down it. Inside the ALH valve cover is a pretty elaborate vapor catch system! It might be able to be modified to be more efficient too.

All I really know about other peoples TDI installs is some people love them, some people hate them. I might still chip mine, but I'll be doing it for economy, not power.

Another thing I want to do with mine is add the coolant glow plugs to the heater system, near the front of the van. That way, when it's cold I get that extra heating to the heater core. You could easily add the same thing to a mTDI setup with a manual switch, or even some sort of temperature controlled switch. I need to do some research into when exactly the ECU turns them on though.

I have the same cat (pretty sure) as Outwesty. It's a generic Magnaflow diesel cat 94005D. Definitely quieted the noise down! That's my only muffler.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:51 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

I'm the guy from the UK who's just fitted the DMF.. Very Happy It does make a big difference, clutch engagement is smoother, vibration and chatter/noise is less. How long it lasts will have to be a wait and see thing. I'd be happy enough with a 3 year life.
I have a AFN engine fitted in mine at 50deg. The AFN is 110bhp engine with 0.205 injectors and the VNT15 turbo. So kind of a AHU/ALH mash up with a bit more power.

Oil breather worries with the engine over at 50deg- I've heard of maybe one engine run away and the van in question was over at a crazy angle. Diesels to tend to breathe a fair bit of oil though, so i have fitted an oil separator from a bmw x5. It has no filter in it like the provents, so is fit and forget. It works by a venturi effect, and i have taken the drain connection off the bottom and via a one way valve connected it to the old turbo return connection.

I have the vw engine bars, and use Bernd Jager hydro mounts. The van feels less agricultural than others i have driven with standard mounts.

Power wise, personally i would try to avoid the more is better temptation. Your gearbox will thank you, as will your wallet.

Turbo oil return, i return to the sump in the standard factory location. If you have a non turbo sump then brickwerks sell a fitting you can retro fit to enable that. Now, the VNT turbo isn't really too happy with returning to the sump. If you drive off and get the oil nice and hot, everything is fine. if you do a couple start stop journeys, like moving it around your yard. then you will get a bit of smoke on start up. What Libby mentioned about cutting a T in and returning to the block as well has occurred to me, and now i know someone has done that i may copy... i know of one person who has put a scavenge pump on that T.

Reliability wise, i had a lot of problems at the start of my tdi experience, but these were mainly down to poor install and related to things like broken engine mounts, boost hoses popping off. The engine has never broke down, super reliable. The original AFN i had even had a bent rod, and i managed to drive it around for two years doing many miles inc mountain passes, driving to Rome ect ect. only symptom being a bit of white smoke when cold.

Lots of pics on my build thread on this forum, but I'm happy to stick some on this topic if someone wants particular stuff put on here
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 7:21 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

hans j wrote:
Random thoughts:



Another thing I want to do with mine is add the coolant glow plugs to the heater system, near the front of the van. That way, when it's cold I get that extra heating to the heater core. You could easily add the same thing to a mTDI setup with a manual switch, or even some sort of temperature controlled switch. I need to do some research into when exactly the ECU turns them on though.


i have these coolant glow plugs fitted. I did debate having a manual over-ride for them as they rarely come on. I will try to find the info i read. But its something When the air intake is below a set temp, i plug comes on. If its even colder then two plugs come on. Give us a bit and ill post up the details
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 7:40 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

I was nearly right
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

I've considered adding the coolant glow plugs but have been planning to add heated seat elements instead.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:38 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

Are Volks using the gasser tanks in a Syncro for diesel?
Or do you have to locate a diesel specific tank?

I ask as I have made quite a few plastic welds to the gasser tanks now and would like to know if the diesel tank is a different material.
If so, I will see if Wurth has the rods for my welder.

Thanks.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:33 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
BavarianWrench wrote:
Hello all. Some great feedback and links showing up here in this thread. I have a question about the fuel cell. Has anybody heated and reformed a non diesel tank to accommodate the diesel bell housing and starter? I've heard it can be done, don't know anybody who has done it. ...


Is the gas tank modification needed if you mount the engine at 50 deg so it clears the lid?


BavarianWrench wrote:
tjet if you are going to use a factory Diesel bellhousing, engine will be at 50 degrees and the starter at almost 12 oclock. your 2.1L Syncro fuel cell can not accommodate the starter. The Diesel Syncro tanks have a depression to accommodate the starter. I've heard of folks super heating a bowling ball and reshaping their tank? Just I've never actually known somebody to do it successfully. I have an extra tank so I'll try it.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:55 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI/WBX conundrum Reply with quote

Andrew A. Libby wrote:
tjet wrote:
BavarianWrench wrote:
Hello all. Some great feedback and links showing up here in this thread. I have a question about the fuel cell. Has anybody heated and reformed a non diesel tank to accommodate the diesel bell housing and starter? I've heard it can be done, don't know anybody who has done it. ...


Is the gas tank modification needed if you mount the engine at 50 deg so it clears the lid?


BavarianWrench wrote:
tjet if you are going to use a factory Diesel bellhousing, engine will be at 50 degrees and the starter at almost 12 oclock. your 2.1L Syncro fuel cell can not accommodate the starter. The Diesel Syncro tanks have a depression to accommodate the starter. I've heard of folks super heating a bowling ball and reshaping their tank? Just I've never actually known somebody to do it successfully. I have an extra tank so I'll try it.


OK, well I have tried heating and forming the gasser tank, it held but slowly went back to the original shape after multiple fillings....hence my welding experiences due to rubbing.

This is why I went in the direction of having custom fuel cells made for a few of my vans.
Not a major undertaking, just costly and you need to know exactly what you want as an end product.
I am sure these tanks could be used for bio and diesel, just would have to check to see if the baffle material could handle it.
I settled on a 17.5 gallon fuel cell to make room for the starter and slave cylinder I use with the RJES for the H6s, plus a tiny bit more room to insure that I could mount the driveline and keep the best ground clearance with the Syncro.

I still want to try a diesel conversion, this is why I ask.
Thanks for clearing it up.

I was thinking EE20 in the past, but they don't make much sense now after we have seen what they can do.

I have a rose bud and plenty of tanks to play around with, now to find a bowling ball to torch Wink
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:57 am    Post subject: Re: Syncro TDI Info and the WBX Conundrum Reply with quote

Does anyone know if the Syncro diesel tanks are a different material than the gassers?
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