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Bloku
Expert Noob
Joined: April 09, 2013
Posts: 559
Location: Tulsa/Jenks Oklahoma
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 Posted: Tue May 17, 2016 9:23 pm Post subject: Sway bars |
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Howdy again samba peeps! A quick question for yall; I want to put some pretty hefty sway bars on my ghia to have it handle. I hear that T1 VW's really need bigger sway bars up front than in the rear and I was looking for a 7/8" bar for the front and a 3/4" rear. I can find the 3/4" rear but the larger, front, sway bars seem to have fallen off the face of the internet  . I am going for a setup similar to Glenn's beetle (http://www.glenn-ring.com/Beetle.html) and he has 1" swaybars! Where did man go about finding these large sway bars? If anyone knows it would be a great help. Thanks as always! 
_________________
1971 Karmann Ghia
1975 Porsche 914
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1975 BMW 2002
1976 BMW 2002 (Bored and Stroked w/ 5-Speed)
1981 BMW E21
1986 Toyota 4Runner (Dead engine and trans)
1989 Toyota 4x4 PU
1994 BMW E36 (Daily) |
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SoCalJes
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2011
Posts: 1093
Location: Broward, FL
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 3:38 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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I don't know about 1" but are you looking for these?
http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=C13%2D9594
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Jesse
71 Ghia
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Just because it didn't come that way, doesn't mean it shouldn't have. |
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CiderGuy
Samba Member
Joined: December 23, 2013
Posts: 1351
Location: Bucks County, Pa
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 4:35 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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Be aware that while that sway bar comes with bushings, it doesn't have the clamps to attach the sway bar to the car.
Also you'll find it easier to just cut the clamps holding the stock sway bar in place, rather then messing with bolts that been there for almost 50 years. I used a grinder with a cut off wheel.
_________________
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Cars Currently Owned:
1970 Karmann Ghia Coupe
1973 Karmann Ghia Coupe - Project car for sale
1970 Karmann Ghia Convertible (Body off restoration)
Timing is everything |
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Bloku
Expert Noob
Joined: April 09, 2013
Posts: 559
Location: Tulsa/Jenks Oklahoma
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 5:06 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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| CiderGuy wrote: |
Be aware that while that sway bar comes with bushings, it doesn't have the clamps to attach the sway bar to the car.
Also you'll find it easier to just cut the clamps holding the stock sway bar in place, rather then messing with bolts that been there for almost 50 years. I used a grinder with a cut off wheel. |
Thank socaljes but I need a bigger front than rear. 3/4 is good for the rear but the front needs a mighty big one.
Thanks for the info ciderguy. I am known to be the one who gets pissed by old rust welded parts. I'll just cut it off 
Still, does anyone know where to get front sway bars (for t1s) that is bigger than 3/4" (7/8" or 1").
Thanks!
_________________
1971 Karmann Ghia
1975 Porsche 914
-----
1975 BMW 2002
1976 BMW 2002 (Bored and Stroked w/ 5-Speed)
1981 BMW E21
1986 Toyota 4Runner (Dead engine and trans)
1989 Toyota 4x4 PU
1994 BMW E36 (Daily) |
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scotty timmerman
Samba Member
Joined: January 10, 2010
Posts: 1000
Location: gigharbor W.A
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sactojesse
Samba Member
Joined: November 21, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 9:22 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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| Bloku wrote: |
| Still, does anyone know where to get front sway bars (for t1s) that is bigger than 3/4" (7/8" or 1"). |
Whiteline makes a 22 mm FSB, but it's spendy:
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Whiteline-Front-Swaybar-22mm-RACE-Adjustable-OTT-p/bwf8xz.htm
That's just shy of 7/8" in diameter.
On my prior '69 (IRS) ghia, I ran 3/4" FSB and RSB. It was fun, but you could get the rear to step out a bit. Running a larger diameter FSB will temper that somewhat.
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1966 Karmann-Ghia convertible |
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SoCalJes
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2011
Posts: 1093
Location: Broward, FL
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 12:31 pm Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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Bloku, did you ever lower your suspension? I think I remember you mentioning it. The lower your center of gravity the less side sway effects your suspension.
I really doubt you need anything bigger than the 3/4" for street driving if you're adding front and rear sway bars. my $ 0.02 
_________________
Jesse
71 Ghia
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Just because it didn't come that way, doesn't mean it shouldn't have. |
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Bloku
Expert Noob
Joined: April 09, 2013
Posts: 559
Location: Tulsa/Jenks Oklahoma
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 2:50 pm Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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| sactojesse wrote: |
| Bloku wrote: |
| Still, does anyone know where to get front sway bars (for t1s) that is bigger than 3/4" (7/8" or 1"). |
Whiteline makes a 22 mm FSB, but it's spendy:
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Whiteline-Front-Swaybar-22mm-RACE-Adjustable-OTT-p/bwf8xz.htm
That's just shy of 7/8" in diameter.
On my prior '69 (IRS) ghia, I ran 3/4" FSB and RSB. It was fun, but you could get the rear to step out a bit. Running a larger diameter FSB will temper that somewhat. |
Yea, that is way more than I would ever want to spend on a sway bar. I just saw in a few post that you want a bigger sway bar up front than in in rear (for balanced driving) but this is rear engined, Ill let the end slid out so the 3/4 FSB and RSB sound like a winner to me!
How did the car feel in comparison to before sway bars, and how "flatly" dose it handle? I like it to feel like I can take a corner at near any speed
| SoCalJes wrote: |
Bloku, did you ever lower your suspension? I think I remember you mentioning it. The lower your center of gravity the less side sway effects your suspension.
I really doubt you need anything bigger than the 3/4" for street driving if you're adding front and rear sway bars. my $ 0.02 |
I wound up leaving the car as is (low profile tires and drop spindles with caster shims). The rear was also lowered a bit so any lower would be silly for oklahoma roads. Like sactojesse said, front and rear sound OK.
_________________
1971 Karmann Ghia
1975 Porsche 914
-----
1975 BMW 2002
1976 BMW 2002 (Bored and Stroked w/ 5-Speed)
1981 BMW E21
1986 Toyota 4Runner (Dead engine and trans)
1989 Toyota 4x4 PU
1994 BMW E36 (Daily) |
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sactojesse
Samba Member
Joined: November 21, 2006
Posts: 2655
Location: Sacramento, California, USA
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| Posted: Wed May 18, 2016 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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| Bloku wrote: |
| sactojesse wrote: |
| Bloku wrote: |
| Still, does anyone know where to get front sway bars (for t1s) that is bigger than 3/4" (7/8" or 1"). |
Whiteline makes a 22 mm FSB, but it's spendy:
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Whiteline-Front-Swaybar-22mm-RACE-Adjustable-OTT-p/bwf8xz.htm
That's just shy of 7/8" in diameter.
On my prior '69 (IRS) ghia, I ran 3/4" FSB and RSB. It was fun, but you could get the rear to step out a bit. Running a larger diameter FSB will temper that somewhat. |
Yea, that is way more than I would ever want to spend on a sway bar. I just saw in a few post that you want a bigger sway bar up front than in in rear (for balanced driving) but this is rear engined, Ill let the end slid out so the 3/4 FSB and RSB sound like a winner to me!
How did the car feel in comparison to before sway bars, and how "flatly" dose it handle? I like it to feel like I can take a corner at near any speed |
I did my modifications in stages. Replacing the stock 3/8" FSB with a 3/4" FSB (but no RSB) made it much more stable at speed and in crosswinds, but with a tendency towards benign understeer. Adding the 3/4" RSB added a bit more balance to things, but with the ability to rotate the rear end if I wanted to get "frisky."
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1966 Karmann-Ghia convertible |
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Bloku
Expert Noob
Joined: April 09, 2013
Posts: 559
Location: Tulsa/Jenks Oklahoma
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| Posted: Thu May 19, 2016 8:23 pm Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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| sactojesse wrote: |
| Bloku wrote: |
| sactojesse wrote: |
| Bloku wrote: |
| Still, does anyone know where to get front sway bars (for t1s) that is bigger than 3/4" (7/8" or 1"). |
Whiteline makes a 22 mm FSB, but it's spendy:
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Whiteline-Front-Swaybar-22mm-RACE-Adjustable-OTT-p/bwf8xz.htm
That's just shy of 7/8" in diameter.
On my prior '69 (IRS) ghia, I ran 3/4" FSB and RSB. It was fun, but you could get the rear to step out a bit. Running a larger diameter FSB will temper that somewhat. |
Yea, that is way more than I would ever want to spend on a sway bar. I just saw in a few post that you want a bigger sway bar up front than in in rear (for balanced driving) but this is rear engined, Ill let the end slid out so the 3/4 FSB and RSB sound like a winner to me!
How did the car feel in comparison to before sway bars, and how "flatly" dose it handle? I like it to feel like I can take a corner at near any speed |
I did my modifications in stages. Replacing the stock 3/8" FSB with a 3/4" FSB (but no RSB) made it much more stable at speed and in crosswinds, but with a tendency towards benign understeer. Adding the 3/4" RSB added a bit more balance to things, but with the ability to rotate the rear end if I wanted to get "frisky." |
Winner! That is exactly what I am looking for, sactojesse! Thank you for telling me that. My ghia is also mildly unhappy with meager crosswinds. This looks to be the fix! Peace
_________________
1971 Karmann Ghia
1975 Porsche 914
-----
1975 BMW 2002
1976 BMW 2002 (Bored and Stroked w/ 5-Speed)
1981 BMW E21
1986 Toyota 4Runner (Dead engine and trans)
1989 Toyota 4x4 PU
1994 BMW E36 (Daily) |
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helowrench
Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2003
Posts: 567
Location: dallas texas
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| Posted: Fri May 20, 2016 9:42 pm Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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My Ghia runs the 3/4" Front, and no rear. Understeers when pushed hard into a corner.
My Bug however, has the 3/4" front (19mm) and a 14mm rear (from Porsche 924/944.
It rotates on command with the gas pedal. very neutral in a corner.
Now, one thing you need to understand is just how much tire pressures affect this. It took me quite a while to get the pressures to work with the bars.
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Current VWs:
70 bug vert for wifey
73Thing bucket o rust
73 914 1.7
12 Passat 2.5 Highway cruiser |
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swavananda
Samba Member
Joined: February 14, 2009
Posts: 889
Location: Can o' Scruz
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| Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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I remembered this thread and it made me think about getting a rear sway bar as well. I already had the 3/4 front bar and the under steer was pretty noticeable. Just got the rear 3/4 kit installed and definitely a huge improvement.The rear just glides the perfect amount into corners now . Highly recommend, even for being Empi  |
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Evil_Fiz
Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2011
Posts: 1049
Location: Jacksonville, FL
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| Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:50 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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| helowrench wrote: |
...My Bug however, has the 3/4" front (19mm) and a 14mm rear (from Porsche 924/944.
It rotates on command with the gas pedal. very neutral in a corner. |
What extra measures did you need to take to make the rear 924/944 SB fit into the Type 1 IRS?
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It's not just about what's interesting. It's also about what's helpful, and it's helpful even if it helps just one other guy working on a Ghia.
kiwighia68
See my build on TheSamba at:
The K_R_A_K_E_N_N : a 70 Ghia Convertible reinterpreted
Last edited by Evil_Fiz on Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
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slalombuggy
Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2010
Posts: 9147
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:43 am Post subject: Re: Sway bars |
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All my cars have 3/4" SBs front and rear. Even autocrossing with 21x7"F and 22x9"R slicks the cars are pretty neutral and turn in good. On the street and racing at Bonneville they are both on rails even at speeds over 110mph in slight crosswinds. And neither are as heavy or aerodynamic as a Ghia.
brad |
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