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Brake stop light switch
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49gary
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 8:26 am    Post subject: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

Hi all, need some help understanding how to wire the master cylinder on a 68 Beetle convertible. I have looked and dozens of diagrams and can not find one that fits. Attached is a picture of the wires and a drawing which isn't very clear. The wires on the care are:
1. 1st line in: 2 wires= A. BLUE wire to a connector
B. Red wire spliced to a black wire to a connector
2. 2nd line in: 3 wires= A. BLUE wire and GRAY wire with an orange line to a connector
B. GRAY wire to a connector
3. 3rd line is: 4 wires= A. GRAY wire and BLACK with red cross hatches to a connector
B. BLACK wire and a TAN wire with an orange line to a connector
Please help me figure out where each goes on the two, three prong switches.
Thanks for the help.
Gary

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60ragtop
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 9:05 am    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

maybe this thread will help. 68-69 had a unique MC which hasn't been available for years and were replaced with 69> parts.
which one do you have?
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=525439&highlight=69+master+cylinder+switch
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Rick
Certified Mechanic by the State of Michigan in 1977
ASA certified in 1987
Certified Hunter Wheel Alignment Master Technician 1986

tasb wrote:
I've restored a large number too, but I don't toot my horn quite as loud.


sb001 wrote:
maybe he just snapped cause his car sucked Wink
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49gary
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 12:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

Rick,
Thank you found the help. Mine is a three prong and my guess is each of my 6 wires goes somewhere. Thanks again.
Gary
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ashman40
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2016 1:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

First off... your wire colors are all messed up. Shocked Sad
The stock Beetle brake wiring only used three color wires in '68:
    black - 12v+ source from fuse box
    black/red - output to rear brake lights
    red - output to the brake warning lamp in the dash

Each brake switch had the same color wires and they were in parallel. This means either switch could make the brake lights work. This allowed for one switch to fail and you would still have brake lights.

This pic from Speedy Jim's site shows how the 3-prong brake switches should be wired and how they work:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


What you need to do is determine which wire is which.
    Start with a voltmeter set to read 12v+ (or a test lamp). Disconnect all the wires from the brake switches and turn the ignition switch ON. Two of the wire connectors should have 12v+. Consider these the "black" wires in the above diagram. Make sure they are not touching anything but leave them powered ON, we will use them to test the output circuits.
    The other 4 wires will not have power on them. These are the OUTPUT wires.

    If you have a test lamp it may come in handy here. If you don't you can use a simple jumper wire. We will use the "black" wire to power the output wires and test to see which lights they turn ON.
    Connect the test lamp (or jumper wire) between one of the powered "black" wires to one of the non-powered wires. The test lamp should light up indicating there is a path to ground thru the output wire. Go to the rear of the car and check if the brake lights are ON. (They may be very dim as the test light will restrict the current flow. If they are too dim, switch to a jumper wire which will fully power the brake lamps). If the brake lights are ON, consider this wire a "black/red" wire. If the brake lights are NOT on check the brake warning lamp in the dash. Consider this wire a "red" wire if it lights up the brake warning lamp. Test the remaining wires the same way.

    At this point your should have:
    - two (2) "black" wire with 12v+ coming from the fuse box
    - two (2) "black/red" wires which power both rear brake lights
    - two (2) "red" wires that power the brake warning lamp in the dash


Using Speedy Jim's diagram connect the correct wires to the correct terminals on brake switches. Each switch is wired the same. They are NOT mirror images of each other.
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AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road Sad }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!}
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49gary
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2016 6:56 am    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

AshMan40,
Thank you for the help. I will try to figure out what each wire does and go from there. Do you have any thoughts as to why my wiring is so different? It seems to be original to the car.

Again, thanks for the help.
Gary
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49gary
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2016 7:16 am    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

AshMan40,

I did what you suggested and after a few tries I was able to figure out what wire does what regardless of the color and it worked. I really appreciate the help.

Thanks again,
Gary
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ashman40
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2016 8:28 am    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

Glad you got it worked out.

49gary wrote:
Do you have any thoughts as to why my wiring is so different? It seems to be original to the car.

From the '76~ Beetle the wiring color changed, but you said your Beetle was '73, right?
    The black (12v) source was replaced with a red/yellow wire starting from the junction in the trunk where the horn and brake lights split off.

    The red wire to the brake warning lamp was replaced with a blue/brown wire (at least part way).

    The black/red output to the brake lights remained the same color.

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AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road Sad }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!}
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49gary
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2016 1:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

I am working in a 1968 vw conertible and could not find a wiring diagram that matched the stop switch wI ring that I had.
Thanks,
Gary
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ashman40
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2016 7:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Brake stop light switch Reply with quote

Maybe the PO swapped the brake wires with a set from a '76~later? Who knows what changes have been made 38-years after the car rolled off the assembly line?
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AshMan40
---------------------------
'67 Beetle #1 {project car that never made it to the road Sad }
'75 Beetle 1200LS (RHD Japan model) {junked due to frame rot}
'67 Beetle #2 {2019 project car - Wish me luck!}
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