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oodeftone Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2004 Posts: 65 Location: Carlsbad, CA
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Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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I'm dyin' over here... I have an adjustable beam that I just set all the way down (highest ride height) and I just installed dropped spindles. I want it lowered but not slammed. I have 15" stock bug smoothies w/ 165/80/15 tires. I only have about 3/4" of an inch of clearance inside the wheel well. I'm pretty sure that's gonna rub like a mofo. I know I need low profile tires like 45's. Any other tips? Does that amount of clearance sound about right for dropped spindles on a "stock" height adjustable beam. I really don't want to go back to stock height spindles on a lowered beam, I didn't like the ride. |
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cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20275 Location: Sandpoint, ID
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Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2014 7:55 pm Post subject: |
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Those beetle tires are really tall. Smaller tires will make a big difference. _________________ nothing |
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cage66 Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2005 Posts: 2039 Location: reno,nv. cultwagen.com
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:26 am Post subject: |
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80 profile is huge. For your setup I am sure a 60 would be fine. Any smaller and it will likely look funny without being slammed. A little sidewall will also help give you a little softer ride than a real low profile tire. |
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mandraks Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2004 Posts: 7050 Location: Lawrenceville, Ga
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:32 am Post subject: |
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oodeftone wrote: |
I'm dyin' over here... I have an adjustable beam that I just set all the way down (highest ride height) and I just installed dropped spindles. I want it lowered but not slammed. I have 15" stock bug smoothies w/ 165/80/15 tires. I only have about 3/4" of an inch of clearance inside the wheel well. I'm pretty sure that's gonna rub like a mofo. I know I need low profile tires like 45's. Any other tips? Does that amount of clearance sound about right for dropped spindles on a "stock" height adjustable beam. I really don't want to go back to stock height spindles on a lowered beam, I didn't like the ride. |
bug wheels push the tires out a good bit farther than bus wheels. So much so that a bus wheel will not fit on the rear of a bug without rubbing on springplates and body.
165/80s are still much smaller in diameter than a stock bus wheel
25 inch diameter versus almost 27 inches, we know 28 inches will fit a stock bus...
This means you will gain about an inch of clearing in the wheel house using the tires you have.
seems to me that your bus is either lower than you think or you might consider bus wheels depending on where your rubbing happens
i recommend a visit to one of the tire calculators and plugging in some sizes to see what you need _________________ regards
Uli
----------------------------------------
'53 3-Fold Oval, L35 Metallic Blue, looking for a narrow hatch panel |
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electronictofu Samba Member
Joined: May 13, 2009 Posts: 935 Location: Sacramento
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:51 am Post subject: Trans Wrap Up! |
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I have a couple questions, as It's almost time to throw the transaxle in! This is on a 65' deluxe with offset spring plates.
I am picking up my long axles and tubes this evening. And the trans that came with my bus actually had a hockey puck and nose cone on it. One less thing to buy.
A few questions:
1) Is this nose cone and hockey puck the right style for this swap?
2) I have 2 different couplers! Which one should be used? The new one I got from Wolfsburg has two spots for screws, one of the holes; a screw wont fit because the edge of the coupler itself is in the way?
3) Last question, the last photo I posted here is the rear of the bus, obviously. Are any special brackets needed from what it shown here to mount the trans? I am assuming I buy BUG or TYPE 1 Trans mounts? Currently I have a 4.12 Ghia trans but may be coring it out for something similar (another 4.12) or a FF 3.88 bug trans I found online with low miles. (I am shooting for a 1776) Current trans seems fine, but it's unknown and I'd hate to pull it again right away.
4) I owe ya you some beers
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joe56vw Samba Member
Joined: June 24, 2004 Posts: 3202 Location: Olympia wa
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 11:18 am Post subject: |
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1) Is this nose cone and hockey puck the right style for this swap?
--you need a bus nosecone and hockey stick the one you have does have a bus part# but the mount is not the right one you can use a stock bus one for your year
2) I have 2 different couplers! Which one should be used? The new one I got from Wolfsburg has two spots for screws, one of the holes; a screw wont fit because the edge of the coupler itself is in the way?
--one of them is broken in half and the other looks like it's been damaged but it is the right style of one you need
3) Last question, the last photo I posted here is the rear of the bus, obviously. Are any special brackets needed from what it shown here to mount the trans? I am assuming I buy BUG or TYPE 1 Trans mounts? Currently I have a 4.12 Ghia trans but may be coring it out for something similar (another 4.12) or a FF 3.88 bug trans I found online with low miles. (I am shooting for a 1776) Current trans seems fine, but it's unknown and I'd hate to pull it again right away.
-- the trans cradle is pretty much the same for bug or bus so a stock one will work fine
personally I like the gearing of the 4:12 tranny better then the 3:88 for a bus when using a engine less then 2L because the gearing/power ratio is better for climbing hills when loaded down _________________ '60 15 window walkthrough
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=559931&highlight=
why is there no sarcasism button on here? |
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electronictofu Samba Member
Joined: May 13, 2009 Posts: 935 Location: Sacramento
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 11:47 am Post subject: |
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joe56vw wrote: |
1) Is this nose cone and hockey puck the right style for this swap?
--you need a bus nosecone and hockey stick the one you have does have a bus part# but the mount is not the right one you can use a stock bus one for your year
2) I have 2 different couplers! Which one should be used? The new one I got from Wolfsburg has two spots for screws, one of the holes; a screw wont fit because the edge of the coupler itself is in the way?
--one of them is broken in half and the other looks like it's been damaged but it is the right style of one you need
3) Last question, the last photo I posted here is the rear of the bus, obviously. Are any special brackets needed from what it shown here to mount the trans? I am assuming I buy BUG or TYPE 1 Trans mounts? Currently I have a 4.12 Ghia trans but may be coring it out for something similar (another 4.12) or a FF 3.88 bug trans I found online with low miles. (I am shooting for a 1776) Current trans seems fine, but it's unknown and I'd hate to pull it again right away.
-- the trans cradle is pretty much the same for bug or bus so a stock one will work fine
personally I like the gearing of the 4:12 tranny better then the 3:88 for a bus when using a engine less then 2L because the gearing/power ratio is better for climbing hills when loaded down |
Cool, I'll stick with the 4:12 then. Thanks for the quick replies you're always on it! So, the nose cone and puck I have now, will work? But it's the bracket bolted to the nose cone that's wrong? It looks like it would mount up ok, not sure... Rough mock up. Fits?
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joe56vw Samba Member
Joined: June 24, 2004 Posts: 3202 Location: Olympia wa
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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electronictofu wrote: |
joe56vw wrote: |
1) Is this nose cone and hockey puck the right style for this swap?
--you need a bus nosecone and hockey stick the one you have does have a bus part# but the mount is not the right one you can use a stock bus one for your year
2) I have 2 different couplers! Which one should be used? The new one I got from Wolfsburg has two spots for screws, one of the holes; a screw wont fit because the edge of the coupler itself is in the way?
--one of them is broken in half and the other looks like it's been damaged but it is the right style of one you need
3) Last question, the last photo I posted here is the rear of the bus, obviously. Are any special brackets needed from what it shown here to mount the trans? I am assuming I buy BUG or TYPE 1 Trans mounts? Currently I have a 4.12 Ghia trans but may be coring it out for something similar (another 4.12) or a FF 3.88 bug trans I found online with low miles. (I am shooting for a 1776) Current trans seems fine, but it's unknown and I'd hate to pull it again right away.
-- the trans cradle is pretty much the same for bug or bus so a stock one will work fine
personally I like the gearing of the 4:12 tranny better then the 3:88 for a bus when using a engine less then 2L because the gearing/power ratio is better for climbing hills when loaded down |
Cool, I'll stick with the 4:12 then. Thanks for the quick replies you're always on it! So, the nose cone and puck I have now, will work? But it's the bracket bolted to the nose cone that's wrong? It looks like it would mount up ok, not sure... Rough mock up. Fits?
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I guess wrong might not be the right word for the mount it's a solid mount which will make a lot of noise and vibrations
personally I don't like solid mounts because of the noise and I have had them break the nosecone before _________________ '60 15 window walkthrough
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=559931&highlight=
why is there no sarcasism button on here? |
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electronictofu Samba Member
Joined: May 13, 2009 Posts: 935 Location: Sacramento
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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joe56vw wrote: |
electronictofu wrote: |
joe56vw wrote: |
1) Is this nose cone and hockey puck the right style for this swap?
--you need a bus nosecone and hockey stick the one you have does have a bus part# but the mount is not the right one you can use a stock bus one for your year
2) I have 2 different couplers! Which one should be used? The new one I got from Wolfsburg has two spots for screws, one of the holes; a screw wont fit because the edge of the coupler itself is in the way?
--one of them is broken in half and the other looks like it's been damaged but it is the right style of one you need
3) Last question, the last photo I posted here is the rear of the bus, obviously. Are any special brackets needed from what it shown here to mount the trans? I am assuming I buy BUG or TYPE 1 Trans mounts? Currently I have a 4.12 Ghia trans but may be coring it out for something similar (another 4.12) or a FF 3.88 bug trans I found online with low miles. (I am shooting for a 1776) Current trans seems fine, but it's unknown and I'd hate to pull it again right away.
-- the trans cradle is pretty much the same for bug or bus so a stock one will work fine
personally I like the gearing of the 4:12 tranny better then the 3:88 for a bus when using a engine less then 2L because the gearing/power ratio is better for climbing hills when loaded down |
Cool, I'll stick with the 4:12 then. Thanks for the quick replies you're always on it! So, the nose cone and puck I have now, will work? But it's the bracket bolted to the nose cone that's wrong? It looks like it would mount up ok, not sure... Rough mock up. Fits?
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I guess wrong might not be the right word for the mount it's a solid mount which will make a lot of noise and vibrations
personally I don't like solid mounts because of the noise and I have had them break the nosecone before |
Makes sense. So many mixed parts I get tricked up...
So, the other style mount. Would that be a bug mount or a bus mount? This is the bracket that mounts on the cone, to the frame of the bus? |
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joe56vw Samba Member
Joined: June 24, 2004 Posts: 3202 Location: Olympia wa
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 12:34 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="electronictofu"]
joe56vw wrote: |
electronictofu wrote: |
I guess wrong might not be the right word for the mount it's a solid mount which will make a lot of noise and vibrations
personally I don't like solid mounts because of the noise and I have had them break the nosecone before |
Makes sense. So many mixed parts I get tricked up...
So, the other style mount. Would that be a bug mount or a bus mount? This is the bracket that mounts on the cone, to the frame of the bus? |
this style of mount will work for your bus
http://www.wolfsburgwest.com/cart/DetailsList.cfm?ID=211301265A _________________ '60 15 window walkthrough
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=559931&highlight=
why is there no sarcasism button on here? |
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oodeftone Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2004 Posts: 65 Location: Carlsbad, CA
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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mandraks wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
I'm dyin' over here... I have an adjustable beam that I just set all the way down (highest ride height) and I just installed dropped spindles. I want it lowered but not slammed. I have 15" stock bug smoothies w/ 165/80/15 tires. I only have about 3/4" of an inch of clearance inside the wheel well. I'm pretty sure that's gonna rub like a mofo. I know I need low profile tires like 45's. Any other tips? Does that amount of clearance sound about right for dropped spindles on a "stock" height adjustable beam. I really don't want to go back to stock height spindles on a lowered beam, I didn't like the ride. |
bug wheels push the tires out a good bit farther than bus wheels. So much so that a bus wheel will not fit on the rear of a bug without rubbing on springplates and body.
165/80s are still much smaller in diameter than a stock bus wheel
25 inch diameter versus almost 27 inches, we know 28 inches will fit a stock bus...
This means you will gain about an inch of clearing in the wheel house using the tires you have.
seems to me that your bus is either lower than you think or you might consider bus wheels depending on where your rubbing happens
i recommend a visit to one of the tire calculators and plugging in some sizes to see what you need |
Thanks everyone for the input. I have been researching tires here on Samba. I'm thinking about putting some 185/55/15 on there. As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? Here are some pictures for reference. Adjustable beam all the way up, 3.5" dropped spindles from Wide Five, 165/80/15 tires...
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durfeec Samba Member
Joined: May 03, 2010 Posts: 1279 Location: Mio, MI
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:10 pm Post subject: |
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electronicfu, look at the part number on the nosecone and hockey stick. Its should start with a 211. That is a bus one. I would highly suggest also getting new rubber mounts for the rear and the nosecone if you don't have them. _________________ 1960 Bus Panel/Camper |
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cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20275 Location: Sandpoint, ID
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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oodeftone wrote: |
As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? |
Why waste time and resources on beetle wheels? Get some bus wheels to modify, or buy aftermarket wheels that are already wide, and are brand new. You can buy new wheels for $100 each, or less. You can buy bus wheels for less than half that, have them powdercoated and be on your way.
Get rid of the beetle wheels and tires. Get some bus wheels and some smaller tires on your bus. Front could be 185/50R15 and rear could be 195/50R15. Then you get to drive your bus. _________________ nothing |
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oodeftone Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2004 Posts: 65 Location: Carlsbad, CA
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Posted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? |
Why waste time and resources on beetle wheels? Get some bus wheels to modify, or buy aftermarket wheels that are already wide, and are brand new. You can buy new wheels for $100 each, or less. You can buy bus wheels for less than half that, have them powdercoated and be on your way.
Get rid of the beetle wheels and tires. Get some bus wheels and some smaller tires on your bus. Front could be 185/50R15 and rear could be 195/50R15. Then you get to drive your bus. |
Ahhhh, if it were only so pure and easy. First, I can't really run bus wheels up front, from what I understand, because I installed the Airkewld disc conversion kit. Second, I like the look of smoothies (I know, blasphemy). Third, I didn't see any aftermarket wheels I liked, plus I want whitewalls which don't really go with alloys. 4th, it's hard to find a nice, proper bus rim for $50. Anyway, too late now, I'm sinking another $170 into the bug rims. If it doesn't work out you might see them for sale here on The Samba soon. 15"x5" smoothies with a -3/8" offset, we'll see. |
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cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20275 Location: Sandpoint, ID
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Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:13 am Post subject: |
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oodeftone wrote: |
cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? |
Why waste time and resources on beetle wheels? Get some bus wheels to modify, or buy aftermarket wheels that are already wide, and are brand new. You can buy new wheels for $100 each, or less. You can buy bus wheels for less than half that, have them powdercoated and be on your way.
Get rid of the beetle wheels and tires. Get some bus wheels and some smaller tires on your bus. Front could be 185/50R15 and rear could be 195/50R15. Then you get to drive your bus. |
Ahhhh, if it were only so pure and easy. First, I can't really run bus wheels up front, from what I understand, because I installed the Airkewld disc conversion kit. Second, I like the look of smoothies (I know, blasphemy). Third, I didn't see any aftermarket wheels I liked, plus I want whitewalls which don't really go with alloys. 4th, it's hard to find a nice, proper bus rim for $50. Anyway, too late now, I'm sinking another $170 into the bug rims. If it doesn't work out you might see them for sale here on The Samba soon. 15"x5" smoothies with a -3/8" offset, we'll see. |
If that is the look you are after, then that is the way you should go. But if you installed Airkewled bus brakes, they should fit bus 15" wheels.
Also, you likely won't find a whitewall tire in a small enough profile to fit the front of your lowered bus. _________________ nothing |
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flemcadiddlehopper Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2011 Posts: 2332 Location: Kelowna, BC. Canada.
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Posted: Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? |
Why waste time and resources on beetle wheels? Get some bus wheels to modify, or buy aftermarket wheels that are already wide, and are brand new. You can buy new wheels for $100 each, or less. You can buy bus wheels for less than half that, have them powdercoated and be on your way.
Get rid of the beetle wheels and tires. Get some bus wheels and some smaller tires on your bus. Front could be 185/50R15 and rear could be 195/50R15. Then you get to drive your bus. |
Ahhhh, if it were only so pure and easy. First, I can't really run bus wheels up front, from what I understand, because I installed the Airkewld disc conversion kit. Second, I like the look of smoothies (I know, blasphemy). Third, I didn't see any aftermarket wheels I liked, plus I want whitewalls which don't really go with alloys. 4th, it's hard to find a nice, proper bus rim for $50. Anyway, too late now, I'm sinking another $170 into the bug rims. If it doesn't work out you might see them for sale here on The Samba soon. 15"x5" smoothies with a -3/8" offset, we'll see. |
If that is the look you are after, then that is the way you should go. But if you installed Airkewled bus brakes, they should fit bus 15" wheels.
Also, you likely won't find a whitewall tire in a small enough profile to fit the front of your lowered bus. |
On that bit...has anyone tried to install portawall whitewalls on 50 series tires?
Gordo. _________________ Everybody Dies....Some Never Live.
Retrograde Garage. Vintage Aircooled, and others. |
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oodeftone Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2004 Posts: 65 Location: Carlsbad, CA
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Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:15 pm Post subject: |
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cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? |
Why waste time and resources on beetle wheels? Get some bus wheels to modify, or buy aftermarket wheels that are already wide, and are brand new. You can buy new wheels for $100 each, or less. You can buy bus wheels for less than half that, have them powdercoated and be on your way.
Get rid of the beetle wheels and tires. Get some bus wheels and some smaller tires on your bus. Front could be 185/50R15 and rear could be 195/50R15. Then you get to drive your bus. |
Ahhhh, if it were only so pure and easy. First, I can't really run bus wheels up front, from what I understand, because I installed the Airkewld disc conversion kit. Second, I like the look of smoothies (I know, blasphemy). Third, I didn't see any aftermarket wheels I liked, plus I want whitewalls which don't really go with alloys. 4th, it's hard to find a nice, proper bus rim for $50. Anyway, too late now, I'm sinking another $170 into the bug rims. If it doesn't work out you might see them for sale here on The Samba soon. 15"x5" smoothies with a -3/8" offset, we'll see. |
If that is the look you are after, then that is the way you should go. But if you installed Airkewled bus brakes, they should fit bus 15" wheels.
Also, you likely won't find a whitewall tire in a small enough profile to fit the front of your lowered bus. |
You're right about the whole thing, I probably should have tried some bus wheels first. Too late for now, hopefully my bug wheel experiment works out. As for tires, I've been looking at these for fronts... http://www.cokertire.com/american-classic-1-6-inch-whitewall-185-55r15.html |
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cdennisg Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004 Posts: 20275 Location: Sandpoint, ID
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Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 2:59 pm Post subject: |
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oodeftone wrote: |
cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
cdennisg wrote: |
oodeftone wrote: |
As a side note, I took 2 of the 15x4 smoothies in to have them widened to 5" and I also had them change the offset by -3/8". He said that was pushing the limit. Thoughts on that? |
Why waste time and resources on beetle wheels? Get some bus wheels to modify, or buy aftermarket wheels that are already wide, and are brand new. You can buy new wheels for $100 each, or less. You can buy bus wheels for less than half that, have them powdercoated and be on your way.
Get rid of the beetle wheels and tires. Get some bus wheels and some smaller tires on your bus. Front could be 185/50R15 and rear could be 195/50R15. Then you get to drive your bus. |
Ahhhh, if it were only so pure and easy. First, I can't really run bus wheels up front, from what I understand, because I installed the Airkewld disc conversion kit. Second, I like the look of smoothies (I know, blasphemy). Third, I didn't see any aftermarket wheels I liked, plus I want whitewalls which don't really go with alloys. 4th, it's hard to find a nice, proper bus rim for $50. Anyway, too late now, I'm sinking another $170 into the bug rims. If it doesn't work out you might see them for sale here on The Samba soon. 15"x5" smoothies with a -3/8" offset, we'll see. |
If that is the look you are after, then that is the way you should go. But if you installed Airkewled bus brakes, they should fit bus 15" wheels.
Also, you likely won't find a whitewall tire in a small enough profile to fit the front of your lowered bus. |
You're right about the whole thing, I probably should have tried some bus wheels first. Too late for now, hopefully my bug wheel experiment works out. As for tires, I've been looking at these for fronts... http://www.cokertire.com/american-classic-1-6-inch-whitewall-185-55r15.html |
Someone asked about that tire recently. (maybe you?) Not sure of the diameter, but it looks like it might work. But $225/each!? Wow. Gotta pay to play I suppose. I prefer tires under $100/each. _________________ nothing |
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oodeftone Samba Member
Joined: November 08, 2004 Posts: 65 Location: Carlsbad, CA
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Posted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:41 pm Post subject: |
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It wasn't me asking about those tires before. Yes, they are expensive, but they should look real nice... |
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firula Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2010 Posts: 181 Location: Argentina, Prov Bs As
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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Hello everybody! I'm doing some purchases for my restoration project, and I wanted to know if does it worth to buy the beam adjusters in case i want to lower the bus just a little in the future.
Maybe to be able to put bigger radius tires on the rear because the reduction boxes without increasing bus height or any other think that could bring up after I complete the restoration.
I don't want to lower it a lot, I just think to lower it just few inches, like 2 or 3.
My questions are:
- Does it worth to lower it just 2 or 3 inches?
- Will I feel better driving?
- How much can I low the bus without modifying anything, just with beam adjusters and rear torsion bar angle adjustment?
- How much is the space between ground and steering box on stock setup?
Any help and opinion is appreciated! You have lot of experience, and i don't know any other split bus to compare, plus my bus is all in pieces
Thanks! _________________ Restoring "La Macarena"! |
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