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sgraham602 Samba Member
Joined: August 10, 2016 Posts: 140 Location: Chapel Hill, NC
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:24 am Post subject: intake manifold gaskets |
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going to be replacing my intake manifold gaskets. looks like both of these would fit. does it make a difference which one i go with? (is one any better than the other?)
*bus is a '75 with progressive carb.
4 of these:
http://www.jbugs.com/product/021129707D.html
vs
2 of these:
http://www.jbugs.com/product/022129707F.html _________________ What a long strange trip it's been. |
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hazetguy Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2001 Posts: 10773 Location: iT StiNgeD iTseLf tO dEAd
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:31 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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neither.
get these: http://www.jbugs.com/product/3227.html _________________ thebucket: I invested in hoodride, now DBD won't return my call?
hazetguy: invested?
thebucket: Yeah Haze, its where people put money into a company in hopes of a return on their money |
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williamM Samba Member
Joined: August 07, 2008 Posts: 4333 Location: southwest Arizona
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 11:19 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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Haz is right- the first ones are ??? but not bus- the second is the insulator block for FI- the recommended one is need for heat transfer- as those long pipes are murder in cold weather. _________________ some days I get up and just sit and think. Some days I just sit.
opinion untempered by fact is ignorance.
Don't step in any! |
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Ian Samba Moderator
Joined: August 28, 2002 Posts: 4930 Location: 713
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:51 pm Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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williamM wrote: |
Haz is right- the first ones are ??? but not bus- the second is the insulator block for FI- the recommended one is need for heat transfer- as those long pipes are murder in cold weather. |
first ones are original style for dual carb'ed type 4 buses
one per hole on intake _________________ All your Buses are belong to us.
Love and good roads!
IN LOVING MEMORY OF ROB CRESS 1968-2012 |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 4:35 pm Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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Although the metal ones improve heat transfer the thin flimsy metal the flanges on those EMPI runners is made from will warp and never seal well, the thick paper ones HG linked offer a better chance of sealing. I've had good results cutting my own from cork on the really mangled ones. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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rastomas Samba Member
Joined: April 05, 2007 Posts: 258 Location: rosendale, ny
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:21 pm Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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When I switched back to duals the thick bakelite ones were already on the manifold.
Should they be on there? Does it screw with the mounting geometry if that 1/4 inch of height is not there?
The old ones crumbled when I took 'em off. _________________ "It's not 'You are what you eat', it's 'You are what you don't SHIT". Wavy Gravy.
'74 Westy |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:33 pm Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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rastomas wrote: |
When I switched back to duals the thick bakelite ones were already on the manifold.
Should they be on there? Does it screw with the mounting geometry if that 1/4 inch of height is not there?
The old ones crumbled when I took 'em off. |
The bakelite ones are only for FI, for dual carbs you want to conduct as much heat from the head into the manifold as you can, the single hole metal ones are best for that, use a phenolic isolator under the carb itself, but metal on metal at the heads. It shouldn't alter the geometry enough that you can't readjust.
In a perfect world the extra heat would help with the single Progressive runners as well, but the flanges on those runners just aren't up to the task. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50261
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Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 11:06 pm Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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You can just use a thin smear of high temperature silicone between the heads and the manifold. This will give the highest level of heat transfer between the heads and the manifolds while making up for any irregularities. You don't want to have any silicone squirting into the airways when you do this as it will disrupt air flow. One way to do this is to put the silicone on the manifold surface, install the manifold, and snug it down. Now remove and scrape off any silicone that squished to the inside and reinstall.
Not sure why BD said to use a phenolic gasket between the carb and in the intake as there is almost no difference in their temps on most any progressive carb setups out there. |
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Xevin Samba Member
Joined: January 08, 2014 Posts: 7599
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 12:17 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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And since you all up in that. I don't recommend you use either the black or red EMPI intake boots (sleeve). I had a set of those fail within a week. Use something heavy duty like these for FI Vans. Not saying to use the ones in the link. But ones that will fit. Sorry I don't recall diameter and specifics. I had an ACVW shop in town hand them to me. They are beefy and strong. I've run several thousand miles with them. No problem. If someone here doesn't know the proper diameter and specs. I can call the shop and find out for you.
Remember this link is just for reference. I only remember dude telling me they are used on Fuel injected Vanagon's. But they look like what's in the link. Wildthings will know the best stuff to use.
http://www.busdepot.com/043133241 _________________ Keep on Busin'
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
Clatter wrote: |
Damn that Xevin... |
skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
I respect Xevin and he's a turd |
SGKent wrote: |
My God! Xevin and I 100% agree |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50261
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 2:12 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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Xevin wrote: |
Remember this link is just for reference. I only remember dude telling me they are used on Fuel injected Vanagon's. But they look like what's in the link. Wildthings will know the best stuff to use.
http://www.busdepot.com/043133241 |
If someone made a reinforced boot for a 1600 Type 1 manifold it would be great.
I don't pretend to know the best Type 1 replacement boot, but would recommend buying from a top of the line vendor, like CB Performance or J Bugs. I see that J Bug offers a kit with two urethane boots and the necessary clamps to do a 1600 Type 1 engine. Can't say that these are good or bad, but I would be tempted to try them.
http://www.jbugs.com/product/113198729B.html
Looks like Mamotorworks has urethane boot kits that also include the manifold gaskets, but they are on back order at present.
These are listed as being EMPI brand though.
http://www.mamotorworks.com/VW/product/red-urethane-intake-manifold-boots-with-clamps-pair-321167 |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 8:17 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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Wildthings wrote: |
Not sure why BD said to use a phenolic gasket between the carb and in the intake as there is almost no difference in their temps on most any progressive carb setups out there. |
That was in reply to Rastomas' question regarding duals, the single centermount doesn't need it. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
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rastomas Samba Member
Joined: April 05, 2007 Posts: 258 Location: rosendale, ny
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 10:30 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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Begs the question (for me) why were the spacers only for FI? _________________ "It's not 'You are what you eat', it's 'You are what you don't SHIT". Wavy Gravy.
'74 Westy |
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busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51057 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 11:08 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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rastomas wrote: |
Begs the question (for me) why were the spacers only for FI? |
Because the injectors don't like getting hot and being mounted close to the heads results in a heat soak when you shut it off. Carbed manifolds need to be warm so the vaporized fuel remains a vapor and even evaporates more on it's way to the cylinder, FI breaks the fuel up finer and squirts it directly onto the hot valve, no need for a hot runner. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
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CheapBusForSale Samba Member
Joined: May 08, 2005 Posts: 496
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Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:13 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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Does any know where I can get thinner metal gaskets which I was told in a different thread I need for a 1975 bay window I'm installing a set of Weber dual carbs on? thanks _________________ Looking for Groovy Bumper Stickers? Check out my Ads! |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:40 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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busdaddy wrote: |
rastomas wrote: |
Begs the question (for me) why were the spacers only for FI? |
Because the injectors don't like getting hot and being mounted close to the heads results in a heat soak when you shut it off. Carbed manifolds need to be warm so the vaporized fuel remains a vapor and even evaporates more on it's way to the cylinder, FI breaks the fuel up finer and squirts it directly onto the hot valve, no need for a hot runner. |
No...actually the injectors do not make ANY contact with the manifolds at all. The injector tip seal and rubber mounting grommet insure that they dont.
The phenolic part is purely a spacer for injector aim and distance from the valve.
Ray |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50261
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Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 10:52 am Post subject: Re: intake manifold gaskets |
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raygreenwood wrote: |
busdaddy wrote: |
rastomas wrote: |
Begs the question (for me) why were the spacers only for FI? |
Because the injectors don't like getting hot and being mounted close to the heads results in a heat soak when you shut it off. Carbed manifolds need to be warm so the vaporized fuel remains a vapor and even evaporates more on it's way to the cylinder, FI breaks the fuel up finer and squirts it directly onto the hot valve, no need for a hot runner. |
No...actually the injectors do not make ANY contact with the manifolds at all. The injector tip seal and rubber mounting grommet insure that they dont.
The phenolic part is purely a spacer for injector aim and distance from the valve.
Ray |
If this were true, then VW would have just resigned the manifold to allow this to happen using only a thin gasket. The thick and relatively expensive insulating gasket is there to do something and that something it likely to keep the temperatures of the manifolds down. |
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