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Sun May 01, 2005 5:00 pm

Has anyone here tried to boost the performance of their 1975+ Fuel Injection Beetle? I'm hoping to keep the FI system intact since it works great, responds OK, and is original to the car. But I'd like it to have another notch of pep. I already installed slip-in pistons and cylinders to 1641cc's and that made little difference. Could I install a slightly more aggressive cam and gain some HPs?

Has anyone tried this with a stock Bosch FI system?

Sun May 01, 2005 5:45 pm

This would be a better question for Ray Greenwood over at http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewforum.php?f=23&topicdays=0&start=0 I have been over there a few times reading various stuff and he is pretty sharp.

The dose comes down to the "pressure of the fuel shot" and "how long the shot is".

I think a couple of options are to :

Clean and calibrate your injectors so that they are 100%
Install a second fuel pump
Install a rising rate regulator
Go to a CIS system
Go to one of the other FI systems - plenty of them out there and they are real money.

I don't think installing 1641 cc pistons is going to require you to do anything though, you would have to get a lot bigger than you are. I don't think the lack of fuel is your power problem, it is in the heads.

Just my 2 cents

Sun May 01, 2005 6:06 pm

That's kind of why I was looking at the cam. If the intake and the exhaust valve openings are lengthened, the engine may be able to use more air. I've thought about a less restricting flow regulator too.

I know moving to a dual carb setup should allow more intake, and smoother flow.

I'll check your link, thanks.

Sun May 01, 2005 7:14 pm

I don't think dual carbs is going to give you much more power either. The engine just can't use the extra fuel to make more power as a 1641 or even a 1776 probably. I would guess if you went to 1900+ you would need more.

Suggestion:

Send that FI system to me and I will put it in a box in the shop attic with your name on it. You will be back for it.

Sun May 01, 2005 7:59 pm

Hehheh... I'm just looking for 10HP. Exhaust and fuel aren't the issue.

Mon May 02, 2005 1:53 am

Easier than swapping the cam, install 1.25:1 rockers. You could even use 1.4s. Before you do that, I would get some HD single valve springs and better retainers. Then mount the rockers on solid rocker shafts.
You can replace your entire exhaust system with a 4-into-1 header.
When I ran my FI engine, I put a mild cam in it, increased the CR slightly, installed heads with bigger valves (35x32 instead of 35x30) and smoothed out the ports slightly. An 009 gave it a faster advance curve, giving better acceleration.

Mon May 02, 2005 4:23 am

Thanks. I already installed the 4 into 1 header. I'll look into upgrading my rockers and shafts.

Would the 009 distributor help the acceleration without any other mods?

Mon May 02, 2005 5:05 am

If you want to upgrade your dizzy go for a Mallory Unilite.

The 009 would be a downgrade.

Mon May 02, 2005 5:36 am

Is that what is sold as Pertonix? I'm searching and coming up empty. Do you have a link to a vendor that carries them?

EDIT:
http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=C15%2D45090

CIP is out of stock, but their description says "Will not work on fuel injection models"...

Mon May 02, 2005 1:02 pm

The CIP description is not quite accurate. The Mallory, 009, MSD or any other non-stock distributor will not work on Type 3s with their original D-Jetronic FI. Those distributors will work fine on Beetle FI. I personally ran an 009 on my Beetle with its stock FI for a couple of years.

If you find a 009 in good shape you will get better acceleration than if you use the stock vacuum advance/vacuum retard/centrifugal distributor. The centrifugal advance curve of an 009 is all in at a much lower rpm than that of the stock dist, giving you much better bottom end torque.

To all those parrots who say 009s suck and will cause a flat spot, this is EFI, not a 34PICT carb.

Mon May 02, 2005 1:22 pm

Keep your stock dizzy for your pretty stock engine. Unless you are going to buy a Mallory Unilite for $300, keep your money in your pocket.

Bruce is a hell of a mechanic and could make a 009 run on a lawnmower and probably a blender at the same time. :shock:

I am not. I am guessing you are not either.

Keep the stock dizzy on there and do not futz around too much with the FI. If you feel the need to spend money, buy a set of petronics points or something so that you don't have to dink around setting the dwell.

Mon May 02, 2005 7:57 pm

Getting an 009 to work well with stock EFI is not difficult. There isn't a potential flat spot to worry about like there is with a carb.

A pertronix is a must on any car that is driven daily.

Tue May 03, 2005 4:14 am

Thanks guys! I am not a master mechanic and this is more of a hobby car than a daily driver. I certainly didn't want to start any arguments with this thread. :wink:

I have been looking at replacing the points with a solid-state replacement for a while. And in that thinking I also thought it might be nice to upgrade the entire ignition system. If it doesn't work out for me, it isn't like I'll throw the stock part away... I don't mind tinkering one bit. Matter of fact that my wife almost forced me to buy this car so I would be puttering about outside rather than playing on my computer through all my time off.

The rockers might have to wait until I get the results of the distributor...

Tue May 03, 2005 4:38 am

Bruce,

Next question... Would one of the "screamer" kits be worth the $130 at CIP?

http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=NFD%2D5600%2DBL

The kit includes the Bosch 009 distributor, the appropriate points replacement kit, a new coil and wires.

EDIT:
Or would I be happier with an 009 dizzy, and one of these kits?
http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=C22%2D11100%2DB

Tue May 03, 2005 12:39 pm

I've never used the accufire, I always use a Pertronix.

Tue May 03, 2005 12:52 pm

Sounds like a recomendation... Thanks.

Wed May 04, 2005 2:05 am

Maybe they will make a substitution of the Pertronix instead of the accufire. Can't hurt to ask.

Wed May 04, 2005 3:55 am

I'll give it a try.

Wed May 18, 2005 2:57 pm

I did note that you were going bigger than I had thought to, but the advice Randy and Bruce gave helps, and the link from Randy's post may shed a little light on the subject for you.

Wed May 18, 2005 7:06 pm

I'm in the same boat with a 1977 vert. Wanna keep it Mostly stock. I was going to bolt in new cyls and pistons to bring up to 1641 too. I see CIP1 has FI heads wiith slighly bigger valves:

Hi The VWC heads are 35.5x32 valed heads and are produced in Brazil. They can be used on FI engines by drilling and tapping a boss for the head temp sensor. The C24-heads are more like the origional FI heads with 33x30 valves in them these also have to be drilled and tapped for FI head temp sensor.
Gary.

So any thoughts on 1641 cc plus the 35.5x32 valves with a4-1 header. Then the question is what muffler are you using and did you reconnect the EGR??

ericatty@aol,com