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Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:09 pm

Hey Linda, I was the guy with the 67 Westy at the Flanders show last September. (It was a pleasure to meet you!) I do have that bubble wrap installed on all walls. I did use under the insullation something called Gutter Guard. It is a tar like substance with an aluminum cover. My bus is nicely quiet and is MOST definately warmer in winter and cooler in Summer. I bought both product at Home Depot. I just cut the bubble wrap to size in between the horizontal supports. NO glue or tape. I am very happy with the results and feel it will not trap moisture.

Tue Jan 13, 2009 4:29 am

llovette wrote: Hey Linda, I was the guy with the 67 Westy at the Flanders show last September. (It was a pleasure to meet you!) I do have that bubble wrap installed on all walls. I did use under the insulation something called Gutter Guard. It is a tar like substance with an aluminum cover. My bus is nicely quiet and is MOST definitely warmer in winter and cooler in Summer. I bought both product at Home Depot. I just cut the bubble wrap to size in between the horizontal supports. NO glue or tape. I am very happy with the results and feel it will not trap moisture.

Hey you're the guy who bought the Westy off a gal right? She had a bad linkage or something like that in the gear box am I right? I have seen reading tons of posts and I just don't feel comfortable with applying any type of glue like substance on the inside body even though I like the sound deading effects. I also don't like having any toxic plastics in there ether just because of the toxic effects if it gets hot, melts etc.

The closest thing I liked was the bubble sheets with the foil on it as in this post but I haven't been to the store yet to look at it up close. When a glue is added and you have to do body work it is one big mess especially if some butt-head dents your bus and you need to weld a panel in. But the method you used is great for a quiet ride. I will test out the sheets and pack in tightly perhaps I'll get the effect I want. Any shows around us coming up early spring?
Lin

Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:53 am

I have the foil backed bubble insulation in my metal garage.

It does not trap moisture but it will dry out and flake, and the bubbles pop over time.

Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:12 am

tonyc9928 wrote: I have the foil backed bubble insulation in my metal garage.

It does not trap moisture but it will dry out and flake, and the bubbles pop over time.

Very good to know thanks, I guess the search continues.
Lin

Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:00 pm

Check out this multi-layer aluminized bubble wrap at McMaster-Carr.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#9367k65/=mes1n

Al

Mon Feb 16, 2009 7:46 am

alikatcraig wrote: Check out this multi-layer aluminized bubble wrap at McMaster-Carr.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#9367k65/=mes1n

Al

Cool this is it. Now I understand I should not glue it in perhaps a dab of glue in the corners to hold it up and if I need to remove a section it will be easy. What do you think?
Lin

Mon Feb 16, 2009 9:02 am

fwiw, the og insulation on the roof of so-42's, and standards/deluxes for that matter, are glued to the sheet metal.

i left the og fiberglass insulation on the roof of my so-42; just make sure your overhead vent area is re-sealed using seam sealer.

Fri Oct 10, 2014 11:34 am

Hey all, coming over from the bay window section as this was not discussed there and dont want to start a new thread but resurrect an old one.

I want to insulate my bus, and I was going to use the aluminum bubble stuff, apparently it works as a vapor barrier as well which is good. I was going to remove the vapour barrier that is currently behind the side panels and doors and replace it with this stuff.

Do you put it on the inside of the panels or over the outside, completely covering them?

There are two products im looking at:
http://www.resisto.ca/en/product/a2a-2/ - Normal bubble foil

http://www.resisto.ca/en/product/a2v-2/ - Bubble foil with a white polyethylene film on one side.

Im wondering if using the one with the white polyethylene film is a better idea, as it will seal tighter vs the bubbles. Thoughts? I was going to use that underfloor stuff but I feel it might trap moisture and thats the last thing I want.

Fri Oct 10, 2014 12:31 pm

#1. Cut up into panels the mylar coated bubble insulation should not act as a vapor barrier.

#2. You do not want a vapor barrier! It will trap moisture in there. Check out the VW Beetle owners manuals on this website and how you were to store it for long periods with front door windows cracked open to prevent the interior from mildewing. This due to how air tight the VW Beetle was, but even so moisture in the form of vapor will still get into the almost air tight of places.

If one insists on vapor barrier, then one must cut and install vents on the outside of the bus to allow moisture to have an exit. Just as you do with a house that is heated most of the year.

Personally prefer the idea of keeping the mylar bubble insulation away from the sheet metal as possible. That way air movement can carry away any moisture that condensates on the outer sheet metal.

Have a chunk of the Home Depot MBI in the front passenger over head panel that still looks like new after about 20 years.

Fri Oct 10, 2014 1:12 pm

Eric&Barb wrote: #1. Cut up into panels the mylar coated bubble insulation should not act as a vapor barrier.

#2. You do not want a vapor barrier! It will trap moisture in there. Check out the VW Beetle owners manuals on this website and how you were to store it for long periods with front door windows cracked open to prevent the interior from mildewing. This due to how air tight the VW Beetle was, but even so moisture in the form of vapor will still get into the almost air tight of places.

If one insists on vapor barrier, then one must cut and install vents on the outside of the bus to allow moisture to have an exit. Just as you do with a house that is heated most of the year.

Personally prefer the idea of keeping the mylar bubble insulation away from the sheet metal as possible. That way air movement can carry away any moisture that condensates on the outer sheet metal.

Have a chunk of the Home Depot MBI in the front passenger over head panel that still looks like new after about 20 years.

Makes sense to me, but I read that people re-install vapour barrier on the doors, maybe that is different.

Ok so Ill get the version without the polyethylene film. Are you saying you just let it 'float' in there? I guess that makes sense as well, if it does get moisture its not trapped against the metal panels. I dont want to stick it down with 3M adhesive, I was just thinking foil ducting tape every now and then, and placing it on the inside of the panels (so you see the metal with the bubble behind).

Fri Oct 10, 2014 3:07 pm

Yes, float in there should work. As posted before, thinking of gluing velcro to hold corners of the MBI in place. Plus it could be done to pull the plastic away from the outer sheet metal.

Front doors are designed for water to pour right thru them. So putting plastic in them is so the water does not drip on the outer side of the panels and into the interior. The slider windows have drains in them to drop the water thru each front door.

Fri Oct 10, 2014 10:33 pm

Eric&Barb wrote: Yes, float in there should work. As posted before, thinking of gluing velcro to hold corners of the MBI in place. Plus it could be done to pull the plastic away from the outer sheet metal.

Front doors are designed for water to pour right thru them. So putting plastic in them is so the water does not drip on the outer side of the panels and into the interior. The slider windows have drains in them to drop the water thru each front door.

Good idea I've used that 3M self adhesive Velcro strip and it works awesome. It comes in a roll about a 3' long that you cut and stick. Think I'll do that. Thanks.

Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:03 am

Anyone ever consider using ice and water shield on the inside of the metal panels? It sticks like a sonovabitch and I can't see how moisture could get between it and the outer panels. Seems like it would sound deaden vibration and it may not be as good as Dynamat but considerably less $. Then perhaps toss the bubble shit in loose followed by painters plastic before you're door panel or westy wood paneling. Any thoughts?

Sat Oct 11, 2014 9:29 am

Definitely use a vapour barrier on the front doors, as water runs through them. Otherwise, when it rains the water will hit the inside of the cab door panel and make it soggy. This may be why the front door panels are generally more thrashed that the other pieces.
Pre 68 VW used either no vapor barrier, or waxed paper glued to the door panel.
In 68 they started using plastic glued to the front door.

I cut up a shower curtain or plastic sheet and tape it to the door or to the back side of the door panel.

After installing the door panels, the front floor is not wet after it rains.
Without the front door panels, the rain bounces off the inside of the front door onto the front floor.

Why use vapor barrier anywhere else? Just let it breathe.
I like to put the reflectix insulation under the interior panels. It's about 1/8" thick, thinner than the 8mm stuff linked to in a recent post.
I've used this stuff: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Reflectix-48-in-x-25-ft-Double-Reflective-Insulation-BP48025/100052556
Sometimes I use two layers.
I might use loops of masking tape to hold it in place till I get the panels in.

Joe's old truck:

Joe said the bus was a lot quieter after installing the insulation and paneling in the roof.

Sat Oct 11, 2014 12:48 pm

Roscoe wrote: Anyone ever consider using ice and water shield on the inside of the metal panels? It sticks like a sonovabitch and I can't see how moisture could get between it and the outer panels. Seems like it would sound deaden vibration and it may not be as good as Dynamat but considerably less $. Then perhaps toss the bubble shit in loose followed by painters plastic before you're door panel or westy wood paneling. Any thoughts?

Anything against the metal can cause rust. Have seen bed liner/undercoating turn bad and cause more rust.

Heck, have seen a decent paint job on VW rims turn nasty from veins of rust working up under the very paint after the rust got under thru some scratches...

Bro in law picked up a nice 1967 Beetle a few years back. Had a weird thin horizontal line of rust bubbling thru the paint about 3/4 up the doors. Removed the interior panels and found someone had installed sound deadener in the doors. Problem was the top of the SD acted like a tiny shelf collecting a line of dirt/dust on it and the water that came thru the windows then soaked this area and the dirt/dust acted like a sponge. The dirt/dust in turn keep the water there for longer so it could rust faster thru the door sheet metal.

VW in the later 1970s did install a sound deadener panel in each Beetle door. It was a thick square tar paper material and glued in place with something that looks and acts like roofing tar (plus this glue is spread farther out than the edges of the SD to prevent dirt/dust collecting edge against the painted metal), and never seems to rust in that area.

In the 1960s and later Beetles VW installed SD panels on the pan halves and glued them down with roofing tar. Have taken these SD panels up to find lots of rust except for under the tar spots and for a few inches around.

Have thought about SD against the outer sheet metal, but would only do it like VW did with tar which repels rust from the area. Like posted before, the other problem with something glued to the sheet metal is later you might need to do body work due to outside damage and have to deal with all the stuff you glued in....

So for now will try the full interior with MBI with sound deadener in it, for our 1960 walk thru panel camper conversion.

EZ Cool Insulation:
http://www.lobucrod.com/

Sat Oct 11, 2014 1:19 pm

matt94gt wrote:
There are two products im looking at:
http://www.resisto.ca/en/product/a2a-2/ - Normal bubble foil

http://www.resisto.ca/en/product/a2v-2/ - Bubble foil with a white polyethylene film on one side.

Im wondering if using the one with the white polyethylene film is a better idea, as it will seal tighter vs the bubbles. Thoughts? I was going to use that underfloor stuff but I feel it might trap moisture and thats the last thing I want.

Those two links are the same product. Do you have the other link?
What under floor stuff?

Sat Oct 11, 2014 2:14 pm

The EZ Cool Insulation looks like it works best with 1/2" air gap between it and the outer sheet metal for best R value:

http://www.astrosafari.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=8725

Over 3300 positive feed backs for the product thru Ebay, and no negatives so far:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-x-50-EZ-Cool-Automotive-...mp;vxp=mtr

Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:04 pm

Eric&Barb wrote: The EZ Cool Insulation looks like it works best with 1/2" air gap between it and the outer sheet metal for best R value:

http://www.astrosafari.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=8725

Over 3300 positive feed backs for the product thru Ebay, and no negatives so far:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/4-x-50-EZ-Cool-Automotive-...mp;vxp=mtr

I've been eyeing this as well. What is the real difference between it and the reflectix/foil bubble insulation? Instead of air it has foam pockets?!

I pulled my panels today to inspect and plan. The last owner put paper backed fiberglass insulation in 40 years ago. It showed no signs of moisture (but it was a Cali bus). Wish I took picks before I pulled it out but here it is 40 years later:

I'm debating now (after seeing how good shape it was in, and knowing how well it insulated and deadend) putting in roxul insulation (it's a organic based home insulation that's great at sound proofing and has a higher fire resistance) the other benefit is its a great sound deadener. I know people that have used it in their homes and it works very well. It's also supposed to be much better then fiberglass at not absorbing moisture. So I'm thinking of doing roxul with bubble foil insulation or ez cool and sandwiching it between two layers, or just the bubble foil/ez cool on the panel side with the roxul on top.

Ps: hope you guys don't mind a bay guy posting here. Here is a link to read more about roxul, I know contractors swear by it:
http://www.roxul.com/residential/overview

Sun Oct 12, 2014 5:14 am

Roscoe wrote: Anyone ever consider using ice and water shield on the inside of the metal panels? It sticks like a sonovabitch and I can't see how moisture could get between it and the outer panels. Seems like it would sound deaden vibration and it may not be as good as Dynamat but considerably less $. Then perhaps toss the bubble shit in loose followed by painters plastic before you're door panel or westy wood paneling. Any thoughts?

Roscoe, That is exactly what I did. The ice and water shield roll is cheap and enough for two busses. It is roofing tar (basically) and won't trap water. I then covered it with EZ Cool insulation. Big difference in noise level when driving and temperature/condensation when camping.

Sun Oct 12, 2014 7:00 am

The principles of applying insulation to bus should be similar to that of a basement. You want it to breath and not to trap moisture. A basement it's now recommended to use XPS (rigid foam) against concrete, your stud wall, then drywall. The XPS is won't trap moisture, it's breathable and it's got great insulating properties.

I would think this would work with a bus on the flat panels. Basically if you're trapping moisture in there, it won't breath and rust will start.

Any thoughts?