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Thu Nov 16, 2006 1:22 pm

Any of y'all (sp?) electricians? I am starting an apprenticeship and would like some advice. :twisted:

Thu Nov 16, 2006 1:39 pm

Yeah. Don't touch any bare wires unless the circuit has been turned off.

Thu Nov 16, 2006 1:40 pm

don't touch wires
lol

always treat any line as if it was hot

it's not the voltage that will kill you
its the amp's

Thu Nov 16, 2006 2:02 pm

spook wrote: always treat any line as if it was hot

Along those lines - don't assume because you turned off a switch or breaker that it's really off...or that the breaker even turns off what it says it does.
And also be aware that another circuit may be running through the same junction box that you turned off one thing for- that one got me good one time - burned through a set of good wire cutters when it tried to weld them together.
:shock:
Basically be really careful, be safety conscious, and listen to the person you're apprenticing with.

Thu Nov 16, 2006 2:11 pm

spoon wrote: Any of y'all (sp?) electricians? I am starting an apprenticeship and would like some advice. :twisted:

Still time to get smart and switch to plumbing.

Plumbers have it way better. Both make good money but no one ever calls an electrician at 10pm on a saturday night with an electrical emergency like they do plumbers. Electricians never get that shot at sticking it to the customer like a plumber does.

Just look at the rigs they drive-- plumbers have nice new extended cab pickups with hitches for their boats. Electricians have shitty old white vans they buy used from the phone company.

Besides, sewage can't kill you.

Thu Nov 16, 2006 2:15 pm

spoon wrote: Any of y'all (sp?) electricians? I am starting an apprenticeship and would like some advice. :twisted:

which kind, residential or industrial?

Thu Nov 16, 2006 2:32 pm

spoon wrote: Any of y'all (sp?) electricians? I am starting an apprenticeship and would like some advice. :twisted:

Don't do drugs, be on time to work, be reliable, and care about what you are doing and you will be more successful than you can imagine.

Thu Nov 16, 2006 2:57 pm

Sure -- remember "BB"

Black Bites - the black wire you really don't want to touch. White is usually ok, if it is all wired correctly.
Black goes to Brass - that's what the brass screws on fixtures are for. White wires go to the silver colored screws.

That's almost all you need to know.
(just kidding)

Matt K. wrote: You know what bugs me, i have a light in the pool and spa. I realize that they are sealed..............but still.................

Besides being sealed, they are probably also isolated (no reference to ground) and/or low voltage.

Thu Nov 16, 2006 4:59 pm

Ubergoober wrote: which kind, residential or industrial?

The company I have the apprenticeship with is not a large company, but is run by a very well known and liked name in town. They are never without work, and all of their trucks are newer F250's. They are making money, so I figure I am getting involved with the right place.

They are mainly commercial but occasionally they do residential. The owner tries to keep his residential jobs in the "high-end" spectrum (i.e. Pebble Beach & Laguna Seca homes). They DO NOT do track homes and they just won a bid for a shopping center in the next city over, an 8-month job. My brother-in-law has been in the trade for about 12yrs. and he says that I am lucky to start there.

Like Barnes say... be on time, be reliable, and care about the job. Those three are easy for me, and I waived byebye to drugs long ago. Any books/magazines/publications y'awle (sp?) think I should get my hands on?

Thu Nov 16, 2006 9:21 pm

Actually coW, white can bite too. Even the ground can.

As for good reading material, first a code book.
Mike Holt has many good teaching programs, from books to online classes.

The best advice I could give would be don't get too overwhelmed. It will be pretty confusing for a while, just pay attention, and take your time.

I think it's a great profession, and if your good, you can become a true craftsman.
Unlike a plumber. :wink:

Fri Nov 17, 2006 4:34 am

spook wrote:
it's not the voltage that will kill you
its the amp's

Sure the Voltage WILL kill you too, if you have enough AMP in it. :lol:

Voltage and Amperage go hand in hand. You cannot just run any AMP setting without the corresponding voltage.

Easy as "PIE" .... Power = I x E

Memorize this and you learn Electricity.

And do NOT touch any bare wire. And don't be the ground either.

Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:48 am

spoon wrote: Any of y'all (sp?) electricians? I am starting an apprenticeship and would like some advice. :twisted:

Good luck to you. It's great to hear someone getting into the trades. Some one mentioned the code book (must have), also think about learning to read blueprints., especially if you get into doing commercial jobs.

As for plumbing...I wear that hat, too.

pete

Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:02 am

nsracing wrote:
Easy as "PIE" .... Power = I x E

Memorize this and you learn Electricity.

You might want to learn about the "R" also...

Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:17 am

joe h. wrote: Actually coW, white can bite too. Even the ground can.

Well, that's true. When I first bought my present house, it looked like it was wired by Edison himself. I could have gotten bitten more times than I can count, if I was never careful.

If the white wire is hot, usually the run is either too long, is wired incorrectly, has bad splices in it or has too much load on it.
E=IR so clearly you'd have to have a decent resistive path to ground for it to drop a voltage across it - that's what I meant with it being wired correctly.
One time I got a jolt touching just two boxes at the same time (120VAC across). Sure, you can have a voltage across a ground but you're not supposed to - clearly wired wrong.

Code certainly does not allow for a white wire to be hot in a single phase (120VAC) application, unless clearly marked.
Multiphase (240VAC) is obviously different.

Just in case, I always use one of those non-contact voltage finders to make sure any wire isn't live. Cheap investment.

(edited: had to clarify singlephase)

Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:54 am

joe h. wrote: Actually coW, white can bite too. Even the ground can.

As for good reading material, first a code book.
Mike Holt has many good teaching programs, from books to online classes.

The best advice I could give would be don't get too overwhelmed. It will be pretty confusing for a while, just pay attention, and take your time.

I think it's a great profession, and if your good, you can become a true craftsman.
Unlike a plumber. :wink:

If the ground wire bites, then something is not wired correctly. Want to get crazy, start talking about "floating neutral".

Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:02 am

Just assume ANY wire can bite - all it takes is a loose wire in a tight junction box, something crossed over, wired in backwards, etc, and they'll all bite...True, they're not supposed to, but after getting bit a couple times myself, I'm a lot more careful now.

And in my job, I do a little bit of everything -electrical, plumbing, hvac, carpentry, paint, etc...and if nothing else it makes owning & maintaining your home a lot easier...and you'll always have friends...
:)

Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:13 am

Your neutral (white) is your return path to ground. If a circuit has a load and the neutral is removed, it will find the path of least resistance (you),if you are grounded well enough.
As for the ground I learned the hard way. Yes, bad electrical work. Someone used the ground wire as a neutral and when I removed it from the ground bar I became the path of least resistance. :shock:
Floating the neutral simply means separating the neutrals and grounds in a sub-panel.

Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:45 am

Yup - assume all wires are live before you touch them, definitely.

If you work on electrical stuff, get one of these if you don't have one already:

This particular non contact voltage detector is made by Greenlee, a company that makes excellent tools. Others make them as well - Home Depot has them.

It bleeps when close to a live wire.
It is also quite handy for finding out what breaker is hooked up to what outlet, if you can hear the bleeping from the breaker panel.

Fri Nov 17, 2006 8:14 am

Oh and by the way, never have your friends or wife turn the circuit breaker OFF............do it yourself..........i have been biten a couple of times from someone who has either not enough knowledge or wants to be a jackass.

Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:09 am

coW wrote:
If you work on electrical stuff, get one of these if you don't have one already:

<snip>
It bleeps when close to a live wire.
It is also quite handy for finding out what breaker is hooked up to what outlet, if you can hear the bleeping from the breaker panel.

This tool should NOT be used as a definitive test! We banned their use in our mill after someone assumed his wand would warn him, and failed. there's no substitute for lockout and a real meter

Sorry...had to say something serious. I'll get better.