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Tue May 01, 2007 1:31 pm

i was just curious how fog lights are mounted on a late bay? Seems like bumper reinforcement is in the way?

Tue May 01, 2007 1:42 pm

someone suggested turning the bumper upside down and using existing holes to mount lights.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:10 am

chase wrote: i was just curious how fog lights are mounted on a late bay? Seems like bumper reinforcement is in the way?

Are you referring to front fog lights (white or yellow) or rear fog lights (red – sometimes called rear guard lights!)?

I retro-fitted some Toyota Corolla rear fog lights, which recess into the vertical engine-compartment hatch, on either side of the licence plate.

Regards.

Nigel A. Skeet

Wed May 02, 2007 8:04 am

I just took the bumper off, flipped it over and mounted them using the two existing holes. You'll need shorter bolts than most foglights come with though.

I'm going to switch to round lights this summer though as I think they look better.

Wed May 02, 2007 8:33 am

i just drilled holes in my bumper on my 77 and mounted them before installing the bumper. after drilling the first hole i discovered the holes on the bottom side.

Wed May 02, 2007 9:04 am

Can't you just hang the lights below the bumper?

Wed May 02, 2007 9:06 am

i don't think it would look as good...but then again it depends on the light. the big round ones look better on top of the bumper but itty bitty ones would look better below

Wed May 02, 2007 9:17 am

I purchased a set of the Hella's, drilled the holes and set em in place. Love these things at night in the mountains. Helps me see those Jihadist type deer. :twisted:

Wed May 02, 2007 10:31 am

mook wrote: Can't you just hang the lights below the bumper?

Yes, but they aren't protected, they look kinda goofy hanging down, and the front of the bus kinda bounces so depending on where you drive that could be a problem. They'll also hit if you ever get on a steep angle like a rollback towtruck.

Wed May 02, 2007 10:52 am

does the look of the bumper change when you turn it over?

are there any extra steps to take or do you just pull it, turn it over, and attach it?

ive been thinking of adding some foglights after i get a few other little thigns taken care of but would prefer an option like this where i could remove them and turn the bumper back over without making any extra holes.

Thu May 03, 2007 6:19 am

NASkeet wrote: chase wrote: i was just curious how fog lights are mounted on a late bay? Seems like bumper reinforcement is in the way?

Are you referring to front fog lights (white or yellow) or rear fog lights (red – sometimes called rear guard lights!)?

I retro-fitted some Toyota Corolla rear fog lights, which recess into the vertical engine-compartment hatch, on either side of the licence plate.

Regards.

Nigel A. Skeet

When I finally finish the present series of modifications & reburbishment projects, on my 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 Westfalia Continental campervan, I hope to transfer the four Lucas 20/20 Homofocal, 7 inch diameter, front rally lamps (two fog lamps & two auxiliary driving lamps), from my modified, hybrid 1974 Triumph Toledo 1300. They presently have 55W H3 bulbs, but I might later use 100W H3 bulbs instead.

I anticipate, fitting these as two matching pairs, above & below the front bumper, but it might be necessary to use some thick spacers between the front bumper and its energy-absorbing, bodywork mounting. I also want to fit to the rally lamps, some 7 inch, stainless-steel wire stone guards, if there are any, compatible with these lamp units.

These bumper spacers, would also reduce the overlap of the front panel-mounted spare wheel, which might later be a 16 x 6, 16 x 6½ or 16 x 7 inch rim, with either 195 mm, 205 mm, 215 mm or 225 mm section-width tyres, dependent upon what Ieventually decide.

Regards.

Nigel A. Skeet

Thu May 03, 2007 7:53 am

RedNail wrote: does the look of the bumper change when you turn it over?

are there any extra steps to take or do you just pull it, turn it over, and attach it?

ive been thinking of adding some foglights after i get a few other little thigns taken care of but would prefer an option like this where i could remove them and turn the bumper back over without making any extra holes.

The bumper just flips, it looks the same except for the two holes.

I would recommend upgrading the factory headlights with some modern H4s and adding an in-line relay. Most sealed beam lights I see on buses seem to be well past their prime- they aren't geting enough juice and the reflective backing in them is fading.

Nigel- sounds cool, but I question whether you'll have enough voltage to power the bus and that many lights (especially if you add the 100watt bulbs). I have no idea what alternator Euro buses have but you'll definitely have to run heavier gauge wire to the front of the bus. The factory system generally can't even put full voltage to the stock headlights without some upgrades.

Thu May 03, 2007 8:11 am

Here's our '79 -- I drilled holes on the top in the same location as the holes on the bottom. I mounted the lights before I put the bumper back on because there isn't a lot of room to get your fingers and a wrench in there.

Thu May 03, 2007 3:58 pm

<-----

Drilled holes on top. I've come to respect any original hole I come across. The engineers put them there for drainage. You will need to install them with the bumper off.

-John

Fri May 04, 2007 6:29 am

Bajatacoma wrote: I would recommend upgrading the factory headlights with some modern H4s and adding an in-line relay. Most sealed beam lights I see on buses seem to be well past their prime- they aren't geting enough juice and the reflective backing in them is fading.

Nigel- sounds cool, but I question whether you'll have enough voltage to power the bus and that many lights (especially if you add the 100watt bulbs). I have no idea what alternator Euro buses have but you'll definitely have to run heavier gauge wire to the front of the bus. The factory system generally can't even put full voltage to the stock headlights without some upgrades.

The British & European, 1972~79 VW 17/18/2000 Type 2 buses and VW 411 & 412 cars, generally had the 55A Bosch alternator, although there might have been some with a 75A alternator, for which I'm still on the lookout.

In 1976, I replaced the puny 45/40W glass-envelope, headlamp bulbs, with 60/55W, quartz-halogen H4 bulbs, but later upgraded to 100/80W, quartz-halogen H4 bulbs, in 1989, upgrading the electrical cables at the same time.

My VW Type 4 engined, 1973 VW "1600" Type 2 Westfalia Continental, has double front-to-rear, red/white, 6·0 mm² cable and all moderate to high-current circuits, are operated through relays. I presently have provision for about 19 relays in the cab and 7 relays in the engine compartment.

Very seldom does one have the opportunity to continuously use headlamp main beams & auxiliary driving lights, for more than a few minutes at a time. Except for the 2 x 5W front parking lights, low-mounted front fog lights, are normally used on their own, to give exceptional night-time vision, even in quite thick fog.

On windy, country roads, I have sometimes used them to improve illumination of the verges, under non-foggy conditions, but I doubt whether I would use both front fog lights and auxiliary driving lights together.

Regards.

Nigel A. Skeet

Fri May 04, 2007 7:53 am

the look of the bumper WILL change when you flip it over. Rember that time you go too close to the high curb, and it crunched abit, or that time a big ol hunk of tire came your way, ricoceting under the bus? Or that time you lent the bus to some crazy kids? Well when you flip it over, youll see all the evidence of these exciting forays into newtonian physics. I discoverdd those bottom holes when I removed my bumper and thought that a PO had had lights, taken them off, and flipped the bumper. I flipped it back over and mounted my lights in the holes. However, on one side it was bent up enough to fit the bolt, but on the other it was still flat, and the bolt was too tall and hit the frame underneah. I used a crushed rubber spacer from my spare tire mount to space between the light and the bumper, giving me more clearence under neath.
My word of warning, paint is missing on that bottom side, and there is rust and dents. However the shape of the bumper seems to be complelty symmetrical. Do we need drain holes in the bottom of the bumper? If thats what those four were for, I'm going to say yes, and tonight Ill drill some.
anyone else know if those are drain holes?

Fri May 04, 2007 8:26 am

glossywhite wrote: i don't think it would look as good...but then again it depends on the light. the big round ones look better on top of the bumper but itty bitty ones would look better below

I agree. I have rectangular Hella Comet 550's mounted below the front bumper, using the stock bumper drain holes. I thought in general that the closer to the road surface they are mounted, the better. They provide pretty good light, once they're adjusted, but they don't look nearly as good as the round ones do.

I'll probably just take mine right off and do without.

Sat May 05, 2007 2:28 pm

These Hella Halogens work great. They fit in the holes under the bumper and do not hang below the belly pan. Situated under the bumper, on the sides, they put out a bright wide fan of light that lights the road under the fog.

Sat May 05, 2007 8:52 pm

NASkeet wrote: "Except for the 2 x 5W front parking lights, low-mounted front fog lights, are normally used on their own, to give exceptional night-time vision, even in quite thick fog."

Nigel, over here in the former colonies, most states(actually all AFAIK) demand by law that the regular headlights be switched on, anytime a vehicle is in use[edit, thanks, Baja] at night on a public road, regardless of auxiliary fog lights, or even foggy conditions, for that matter. Given the sloppy beam patterns of most U.S. DOT-approved headlights, that almost cancels out good fog lights' ability to prevent stray upward-bound light from blinding the driver (any driver!).

Those (no names) here who have in truly foggy conditions, used good fog lights without the headlights being switched, on have experienced safer driving at the risk of a serious traffic citation.

Most "fog lights" on U.S. vehicles, including OEs, are merely cosmetic affectations, and many drivers leave them switched on whenever it's dark outside, regardless of weather conditions. Some are even green, blue, pink, or purple! Especially in the southwestern states, the enforcement of private vehicle lighting laws is very lax. There apparently is NO law against selling lights that don't carry DOT approval, or meet individual state regulations. So, unfortunately it may be best to require the headlights to be switched on.

OTOH my '68 Westy has CIBIE "Z-Beam" H4 headlights (legal for motorcycles), and their flat low beam cutoff allows the covers to remain on the CIBIE fog lights in all but the thickest fog.

J.R.
68 Westy
(+ others)

Sat May 05, 2007 9:56 pm

WestyPop wrote:
Nigel, over here in the former colonies, most states(actually all AFAIK) demand by law that the regular headlights be switched on, anytime a vehicle is in use on a public road, regardless of auxiliary fog lights, or even foggy conditions, for that matter.
(+ others)

Eh? Are you saying that the headlights have to be on any time you are driving or just when you are operating the foglights?

You are right about actual foglights though- most folks, me included, have driving lights not foglights. I run H4 lights with upgraded bulbs for normal driving; I have the extra lights (with 100watt bulbs in them) for dark mountain/back roads. If I had to do a lot of driving in serious fog I'd put some foglights on, but it's not worth my time or trouble for the few times they'd be useful (and yes, I've been in serious fog).