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Colt 45. Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:28 pm

I dont even have a bug yet but im trying to get a game plan going and im trying to gather info because i know very little about vws (or any autos) lol. How do you widen the front and rear axles?

sammyphsyco Wed Aug 20, 2008 7:30 pm

The search function at the top of this page is your friend. Ha beat you all to it!

dune_dude Wed Aug 20, 2008 7:39 pm

Colt 45. wrote: I dont even have a bug yet but im trying to get a game plan going and im trying to gather info because i know very little about vws (or any autos) lol. How do you widen the front and rear axles?

That really depends on a few things. If you have a swing axle rear, you most likely will not be able to widen it.

IRS is another story. The main way to do this is to buy a set of aftermarket trailing arms, usually 3x3 (3inches wider and longer). When you do this, you will have to change your axles and CV joints.

The front depends on if it is a link pin beam (66 or older) or a ball joint beam. I have never seen a wider ball joint beam, but my guess is that they are out there some where. If you have a link pin beam, you can purchase a wider beam. Ive seen them up to 12" wider than stock. You can also purchase aftermarket arms that are longer and wider. They used to make 4 inch longer x 4 inch wider arms, but I havent seen those in a few years. The car im building has a 6" over beam with 4x1 3/4 arms. From what I understand, this setup will put my front tires even with the back running 3x3 arms.

Colt 45. Wed Aug 20, 2008 8:06 pm

Thank ya sir. The main reason i asked i guess is for looks more than praciticality. lol...which is proubly bad but ive grown up around 4x4s and i like the look of those wide off-road gnarly tires that stick out past the fenders with the same size tires all the way around. You know what i mean? So would it be easier to use spacers and a deeper dish on the wheels? Is this look even possible on a beetle or is it so unpractical that its not even worth doing even if it does look good? thanks :D

aquamanx Thu Aug 21, 2008 5:08 am

Colt 45. wrote: Thank ya sir. The main reason i asked i guess is for looks more than praciticality. lol...which is proubly bad but ive grown up around 4x4s and i like the look of those wide off-road gnarly tires that stick out past the fenders
Im the same way here's a pic of my buggy (not a bug but you get the idea) Up front I widened the ball joint front 5" and running lift spindles, on the rear its got 3x3s and 33" tires.

Here's a shot of the widened beam top one is stock it donated some tubing.

neanders Thu Aug 21, 2008 5:37 am

Interesting! I'd like to see some more closeups of your beam. I picked up another BJ beam this week, and I am going to widen it about 4 inches (match my 2x3's on the back). My plan is to place the adjusters to the oustide of the mounting braces for two reasons: first, I don't hafta relocate the brackets, and second, I figure the shorter torsion leaves will increase spring rate. I am also going to reinforce the shock towers (a la Birddog), add hook stops, and weld up all the seems. I have a pair of Tweeds lifted spindles and disc brakes already, which is why I'm staying with the BJ beam.

runslikeapenguin Thu Aug 21, 2008 7:34 am

[quote="neanders"]Interesting! I'd like to see some more closeups of your beam. I picked up another BJ beam this week, and I am going to widen it about 4 inches (match my 2x3's on the back). My plan is to place the adjusters to the oustide of the mounting braces for two reasons: first, I don't hafta relocate the brackets, and second, I figure the shorter torsion leaves will increase spring rate. I am also going to reinforce the shock towers (a la Birddog), add hook stops, and weld up all the seems. I have a pair of Tweeds lifted spindles and disc brakes already, which is why I'm staying with the BJ beam.[/quote

putting the adjusts so far out may yield some undesirable effects. i would just hate to see you spend the time and effort on something that would not really work out. more than just changing the spring rate it would limit the over all travel of the torsion bars.

shred625 Thu Aug 21, 2008 7:38 am

Putting adjusters on might create some bad effects period. I know this is a big controversy but if you plan to punish your car at all its a bad idea in my opinion.

neanders Thu Aug 21, 2008 10:29 am

RLAP, I'm not sure I follow you. My idea came from the pic of the front end Bugzyla posted last week. On that front end, the adjusters are outboard of the mounting brackets. Given that I went from ~26 inch, 22mm to ~21 inch, 26mm torsions on the back, I don't see how the 3 inch difference in length (inside vs outside) is going to do much to a stock spring stack except increase the spring rate. Am I missing something?

CBDZ_CBDZ Thu Aug 21, 2008 10:38 am

HIJACK:

If I were to get a 6" wider beam, that means the tires would be pushed out 3" on each side.

3+3=6, right?

aquamanx Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:32 am

neanders wrote: Interesting! I'd like to see some more closeups of your beam.
This is the only other pic I have..
Mine is on a tube chassis so I didn't have to worry about moving the mounting brackets but you also have to lengthen the tie rods move the steering box and stabilizer mount

caromin Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:13 pm

Just adding the additional adjusters and using the (cut) short spring stacks on the front will significantly stiffen the front suspension. If you shorten the distance from the adjuster to the arm much, not only will you be twisting the torsions allot due to the offroad suspension, you'll also be doing it over a much shorter distance. Read up on the different effects of the rear torsion lengths and it will give you some idea what you'll be dealing with.

IMO, some designs are tried and proven and when it comes to building offroad suspension I try to stick to a proven design, way out in the desert isn't the place to realize your design needs work. That being said, go for it and let us now how it turns out.

neanders Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:32 pm

I figure it's just like the back. I went from longer (26in), thinner (22mm) torsion bars to shorter (21 in), thicker (26mm) bars on the back, I figure the result up front will be similar, though I am only shortening the torsion leaves, not adding thickness. I figure they make narrowed (4 inch) adjustable street beams, this shouldn't be much different. I figure I got the beam for almost nothing, so the only real expense will be the adjusters.

rterfert Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:34 pm

I just caught a view of these on ebay :roll: :roll: :roll:

THIS IS NOT mine :lol:

Ths iis NOT how you lift a buggy either :lol:

This is not something I would want to ride in.....




HamburgerBrad Fri Aug 22, 2008 11:23 am

the longer a torsion spring is, the more flex it will be able to go through. by shortening it so much, you'll severely limit the range of motion that your front arms will go through. On the beam I built for my 68, I'm only shortening the torsion leaves by about 3/4" on each side, and that's only so I don't have to come up with another set of torsion leaves to cut up. It's really not that difficult to relocate your beam mounts, and definitely worth it in my opinion to do so.

here's a narrowed beam that i'm building for a friend where I moved the beam mounts. not all that difficult to do


shok Fri Aug 22, 2008 11:43 am

rterfert wrote: I just caught a view of these on ebay :roll: :roll: :roll:

THIS IS NOT mine :lol:

Ths iis NOT how you lift a buggy either :lol:

This is not something I would want to ride in.....





The rear doesn't bother me too much, its that front lift spindle that makes me go yikes :shock:

xirxious Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:01 pm

You usually need some donated torsion bars right? You cut 2 upper at about %55 . They split in the middle, thats why the 4 adjusters or is that to limit the torsion?

Nicksan Fri Aug 22, 2008 10:07 pm

rterfert wrote: I just caught a view of these on ebay :roll: :roll: :roll:

THIS IS NOT mine :lol:

Ths iis NOT how you lift a buggy either :lol:

This is not something I would want to ride in.....






WOW!

And I thought my cage was a hack job, Theres always something worse........ :lol:

aquamanx Sat Aug 23, 2008 5:02 am

xirxious wrote: You usually need some donated torsion bars right? You cut 2 upper at about %55 . They split in the middle?
Yep thats the way I did it, used two sets of spring packs split in the middle.

neanders Sat Aug 23, 2008 6:47 am

I just noticed that you have Thing spindles and trailing arms. Is that a bug front end?



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