TheSamba.com :: View topic

Tue Jan 27, 2009 7:08 pm

westcoast paul -

Here are some photos of the tank i made for the B2 in my bus...

The fuel enters thru the copper fitting at the top of the "tank"... in my case, i have an electric fuel pump in the back feeding the engine... I put a "T" in the line right after the pump so that it could also push fuel up to the heater "tank". The large diameter hose (5/8") on the right side of the tank is the return from the heater. I like the clear hose... it allows me to see the level of the fuel in the tank. The hose coming off the left side of the tank goes to the heater's fuel pump. As i have it set, the tank stays at about half full at all times (at that, it has a constant fuel level of about 4oz).

I made the tank out of regular black pipe and adapters from the local home center... the main body of the tank is 1 1/2" diameter pipe (i believe)... All of the threaded connections for the tank were sealed up with permatex#1. I had an old sender for a beetle tank lying around, which i used the float from, and i had some extra carb float valves lying around...

the threaded copper fitting had to be filed out on the inside so the 1/2" copper pipe would fit in... the float valve was a near perfect fit inside the copper pipe.... the valve was soldered into the pipe, and the pipe into the top fitting... and tested it for any leaks around the valve...

one thing I didn't initially think about was a place for the air to escape so the float could rise... I drilled a hole in the top copper fitting and soldered in a fitting to allow a breather line to be connected... (this doesn't really need a hose connection, but I like it better with a hose connected so that in the event of an overflow, it could be routed out to the ground)

This setup works perfectly... you just have to have the engine running (or key on) for the rear electric pump to keep fuel supplied to the heater's tank. You might want to design your differently depending on the space you have to install it. My tank setup will fit completely behind the kick panels so that it is completely hidden...

Wed Jan 28, 2009 6:16 am

That's pretty ingenious, but why not just get a heater made for a Bus?

Wed Jan 28, 2009 8:58 am

Attached are some pics detailing the Combustion fresh air pipe. Just in case any one needs to make their own.

BTW the fresh air pipe that goes from the air cleaner to the tin in the engine compartment of the Bugs, are the right size for this pipe. I know you can get the paper version as well as the aluminum style.

The fresh air pipe above has an "outside" diameter of 1" as does the short pipe that is on the B2 fresh air combustion outlet.

The short section of flexible hose that connects the "J" pipe to the heater needs to have an "inside" diamter of 1"

Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:32 am

64 bug -
thanks for posting the images of the combustion intake pipe...

when i installed my heater, I wasn't sure exactly what it was supposed to look like... I used a piece of 90degree metal conduit from the local home center for the combustion intake on my beetle... not the right shape after looking at these photos, but it does get it to pull the intake from under the gas tank... and a close fit on the actual intake on the heater... I didn't use any flexible hose on mine at all, just made a small "L" shaped bracket that attached to one of the heater mounting bolts under the fender, and clamped it to the intake pipe to hold it in place...

Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:40 am

"Why not just get a heater for a bus?"...

Well, B2's seem like they are easy to come by for cheap, and easy to rebuild (or at least get working)... and i thought if I mounted it up front, I could quickly get warm air up front where it is needed, rather than heat the whole back of the bus. Maybe I do things in an odd way, but it just seemed to make sense to me!

Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:13 am

wow, thanks Runderwood. Very clever.

took me a bit to see how you have it setup with the float. my "tank" is about a litre in size. I'll snap a few pictures of it.

Sun Feb 01, 2009 11:33 am

here is my completely seperate system.

Excuse the the coiled cable. i had planned to use it on the manual B2 switch, but then i figured out it couldnt "push". I have since got it sorted, but havent removed the cable.

Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:24 am

I am having trouble getting my B2 to ignite. The fuel pump is checked, everything but the glow plug works fine. Yesterday when i tested the glow plug, it worked perfectly. Today, when I'm testing with fuel, it wont get hot. Any ideas? Thanks :)

Sun Mar 08, 2009 11:54 am

Mattis wrote: I am having trouble getting my B2 to ignite. The fuel pump is checked, everything but the glow plug works fine. Yesterday when i tested the glow plug, it worked perfectly. Today, when I'm testing with fuel, it wont get hot. Any ideas? Thanks :)

when powered the glowplug should glow in a few seconds... I had a glowplug that was able to glow, but took some time to do so... what this meant was sometimes it lit fine, other times it took enough time that the heater flooded with fuel... if i disconnected the power to the fuel pump it would clear out then light... replaced the glowplug and it fires within a couple seconds of turning on everytime...

Wed Mar 11, 2009 11:37 am

I got it to fire :)
Apparently it just needed som adjustment on the thermostat-screw..

Now that i got it running; anyone have the measures for the holes i need to cut out in the car?

Thu Mar 12, 2009 7:21 am

Bump.

Thu Mar 12, 2009 11:48 am

I have an installation sequence printed out and in a binder. I thought it was from a CD-ROM I have, but cannot find it on the CD now.
It shows how to triangulate the various holes. Anyway, here are the hole sizes. I'll keep looking for the installation pics/instructions.

Outlet (inside cabin) 85mm 3.35 inches
Intake (recirc., inside car) 74mm 2.91 inches
intake (inner fender) 35mm 1.38 inches
exhaust (inner fender) 50mm 1.97 inches
mounting brkt. (trunk) 7mm 0.28 inches

Not all B2's come with the recirculation pipe and may not need the 74mm hole. The 7mm holes are for the mounting bracket that attaches to the front of the heater. I've seen them installed without this bracket, more or less just laying in the trunk.

Thu Mar 12, 2009 11:52 am

Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:01 am

Thank you! Helps a lot. Let me know if you find the CD, ok? Again, thanks :D

Mon Mar 23, 2009 4:24 pm

I am trying to remove the speedometer in this 79. My service manual says to CAREFULLY pry off the ends of the instrument wood dash panel. So far I have managed to take a small strip of the immatation wood trim off and that's all. So what is the secret to removing the instrument cluster without destroying the dash? Apparently once I remove the instrument cluster I can then remove the speedometer.

Help Moe

Thu Sep 24, 2009 1:37 pm

I have another thread up on the B2 fuel pump and a low voltage problem. I fixed that issue and update the thread:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4087831#4087831

However, I though I'd add a few things I learned along the way to this thread since someone may be referencing it when rebuilding a B2.

After running fine for a while, but heater began to take longer and longer to fire. I suspected a fuel pump problem (I was wrong....sorta.) I pulled the pump and reset the points and diaphragm.

-Fuel pump diaphragm
Here's where I'd like to add that even though the literature calls for 2.5 turns out on the diaphragm, mine works best at a little under 2.5 turns. Other Samba members mention 2 turns and one uses 3.5 turns. These pumps and diaphragms are old. Some more than 40 years old. I would take the 2.5 turns as a starting point and experiment with it on the workbench.

-Points
I could never find a points setting in the factory literature I have. Someone here mentioned 1.0mm. That's where I set them last Winter and, initially, that worked fine. What I DID notice is that the points no longer lined up properly. And 1.0mm might now sound like much, but that's a pretty big gap. While bench tuning my pump, it pumps MUCH stronger and better at just over .300mm At 1.0mm it was sluggish and the spark was weak. At .300mm, it pumps fast and hard and the spark is much stronger. The points line up better, too. I may end up eating these words and readjusting them out more but, for me, this worked best.

-Voltage
My fuel pump problem turned out to be low voltage. I was getting 12V to the power lead on the back of the fuse panel (inside the trunk, from the backside) but less than 11 volts once it got to the switch at the heater. I cleaned several connections, especially the grounds. I found out that simply cleaning the fuse holder (inside the car, under the dash) raised the voltage througout the heater to 12+ volts and it fired immediately. Put in a new fuse just to be safe.

Lesson learned: Set points at 1.0mm and diaphragm at 2.5 turns, then go from there to optimize your particular pump. Check for voltage drop and clean ALL connectors...but clean the fuse first. Might save you some headache....

Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:49 am

Question about the install on one of these guys.....

Does anyone know why the original design calls for the intake pipe to run outside of the trunk compartment then back under the gas tank? I know they wanted to keep the intake in an area where it wouldn't get air forced down into it - it'd turn the heater into a blow-torch.

Wondering why I couldn't just draw air-in from inside the trunk for the intake. Less holes.....

Trying to fit a later model B2 (12v) into my '59 beetle. Things are a little different hole-placement wise as my fender-wells look a little different than the ones on later model bugs.

Sun Nov 15, 2009 12:37 pm

You can draw combustion air from inside the trunk. That's how VW did it on 1965 Beetles that had a factory installed B2 heater.
However, it may not work for you if you just leave off the pipe. When your car was new, all the panels fit perfectly such that enough air probably couldn't be drawn into the trunk to replace what the heater consumed. If your front hood doesn't seal well, go ahead and leave the tube out.
A 1965 Beetle came with a special inspection cover plate for the hole behind the spare tire for removing the shift rod. This cover was designed to let air into the trunk.

Sat Jan 09, 2010 5:36 pm

Old thread but wanted to add my experiences with the hardi fuel pump (same as on the early BN2 heater)

The diaphragm was hardened on mine so I bought a new one from someone on thesamba. Then I had major trouble getting the pump to work without sticking. I set the points gap to 1.0 mm, backed out the rod 2.5 turns but it still kept flippin stickin.

I filed the points gently with a points file and sprayed the whole thing down with brake cleaner and unscrewed the two securing bolts that held the whole points assembly on the end of the pump. I didn't take it off completely as there are wires running inside the pump housing. But removing the two bolts gave me enough freeplay to be able to work all the tiny hinge points back and forth to loosen up the 40 years of standing still. I put tiny drops of oil on the hinge points.

By accident really, I discovered that if I turned the rod out 3 and 3 quarter turns, it pumped away happily. The tighter you tighten the rod, the more rapidly the pump ticks. The further out you unscrew it, the slower the ticks, but in my case, the more reliable the pump.

Sun Jan 10, 2010 1:43 pm

I had similar experience with the rod/points gap on my B2. I just had to play with it until I found what worked best. The BIGGEST problem turned out to be low voltage. The wiring is 30-40+ years old. After replacing a few wires and getting full voltage to the heater, it worked MUCH better.
But remember, changing the points gap/rod may also affect how much fuel is pumped. As long as the jets are clean and you have a return line it should be OK. Be sure to check for excessive smoke from the exhaust and make sure it's not running too rich.