TheSamba.com :: View topic - Best starter for Subaru converted Vanagon

Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:38 am

Seems that someone had a Vanagon Subaru conversion engine with a "better" starter on it.

I want the best starter money can buy for this van. It has a 2.2 L Subaru, and it is having issues where it will intermittently die on me.

My battery is fairly new. I think the alternator is fine. I will get them tested.

But does anyone know if there is a BETTER STARTER to get to replace the OEM starter?

Buffbuh
'88 Wolfsberg Vanagon
'97 2.2 L Subaru Engine

Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:41 am

Westy Ventures make an adapter that lets you use a 1996-2003 TDI (Golf/Jetta) manual trans starters.

http://www.westyventures.com/parts.html

Ken.

-edit-

looks like they now have an adapter for autos too.

Mon Nov 17, 2008 12:01 pm

Westy Ventures is the cheapest solution to the "hot starter" issue with ej22 conversions. I have not personally tried it but Karl doesn't sell junk - he stands behind his stuff.

The IMI "hi torque" starters are iffy - I've heard good and bad stories.

I have the same starter issue with my ej22 and have been considering the above option as well as the new Small Car bell housing that uses the Subie starter. Its $600 for the bell housing but I'm thinking of moving up to a 2.5 and the new bell housing uses not only the Subie starter but the flywheel and clutch from the donor.

I can oly hope that the new bell housing places the starter is a more accessible spot than the current spot on my Syncro. Dropping the motor and trans down several inches to get to the starter in kinda insane.

Jeff

Mon Nov 17, 2008 1:12 pm

What is the issue? Heat?

No one I've spoken with to has found it necessary to switch from a standard Bosch starter for their subie conversion--even the synchro guys. I use my old started on the wrx with no problems at all. Is the 2.2 higher compression than the 2.5? Or is it lack of ventilation with a synchro? I know the wrx is pretty low CR like 8:1, and since its a 2WD there is tons of ventilation.

Just wondering.

Marc

Mon Nov 17, 2008 2:08 pm

I am using the stock starter on my '89 Westy with a EJ22 and it cranks just as well as with the old WBX'er. FYI - Most say that the 3/4 horsepower starter from the 1.9 WBX'er is not sufficient. Though you have the 1 hp starter since your van is '86+ and should be fine...if it's healthy.

You may try checking your grounds, both on the tranny nose and the one going to the side wall off the left air intake bolt.

I have heard that adding a third ground going directly to one of the starters mounting bolt can help boost it.

Have you posted on Yahoo's Subaru conversion forum called SubaruVanagon? There is a fairly recent post on this. You will find the info on the hi-torq starter as well.

http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/subaruvanagon/

What I believe is the upgraded one you are seeking is the IMI-104 Hi-Torq starter. Though I would double check this with those more in the know at SubaruVanagon Yahoo forum. Here is the link for the starter

http://www.funrunr.com/hitorque.htm

Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:03 pm

on the wrx vanagon... spins fine. even quieter than with the stock 2.1

make sure you have good grounds and clean connections...

Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:50 pm

The issue is not the ground because I only have a problem with the starter when the engine is hot and I shut it down for less than a minute or it stalls. When the engine is cold or has been shut down from hot for more than 3 or 4 minutes, there is no problem at all - spins quite well. I have personally heard this from at least 3 other Subie Syncro owners so I don't think its an electrical issue isolated to my van. I've heard that the problem is a combination of higher compression and engine heat. If it wasn't such a monster PIA to get the starter out, I'd have tried a rebuilt long ago.

Jeff

Mon Nov 17, 2008 7:41 pm

get the tdi starter from westy ventures, i've had one on my svx van since january and not one hesitation on starting, EVER!!! karl is super nice, and has quality parts that look great. go tdi!!

Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:00 pm

I have a Bosch rebuilt 1 HP starter and it turns my EJ22 over plenty fast; however the coldest I have had it is 18 F.

Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:35 pm

Izzydog,

You can add one more person to the list of those who suffer from the SubaruVanagon hot start syndrome. I have a 2wd Westy with a 2.2L, so it is not necessarily a Syncro issue. I'm pretty sure the problem is high compression when the engine is hot. I have never had the van not start, but it cranks so slow that I'm holding my breath every time.

I have also read about the high failure rate of the IMI starters or I might have tried one. The Westy Ventures adapter is news to me and it looks like a great option.

Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:07 pm

The late 2.1L starter is doing a fine job, the 1.9L will not, that 1/4 hp make all the difference. But it need to be in good shape.

Maybe Syncro are more prone to some overheating but i didn't see that at all so far. that said, if you want to be sure it's the starter and not the wire coming from the ignition switch jump-start it form the back. Now you will know. If it still doesn't start, now it may be the starter, again, to be sure bang this one with a hammer, if it now start it is the starter.

Karl option is very good:

The diesel starter are very strong and last for ever, you can find them use for 20$ and those will outlast your van.

Cheers, Ben

Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:57 pm

Thanks for the pics Ben! I've been wondering how well the adaptors are working on the SVX. Have you guys tested the automatic versions yet? :S

Where do you find starters for $20??? I'd like to have a couple if you can find a few that cheap!

Tue Nov 18, 2008 5:46 am

westyventures wrote: Thanks for the pics Ben! I've been wondering how well the adaptors are working on the SVX. Have you guys tested the automatic versions yet? :S

Where do you find starters for $20??? I'd like to have a couple if you can find a few that cheap!

Hi Karl, well, i'm surrounded with shop and 2 are VW's so they had a few in a box. Hans told me he can find those easily for cheap in the states so you could ask him.

PM me, i could use a few

Ben

Tue Nov 18, 2008 6:36 am

these tdi adapters work great!! fit perfect on 2wd, and just like karl wrote, requires just alittle notch on the dif pod bracket on syncros. if you have any thoughts about getting a starter, get the tdi one. on 2.2s, i've never hada problem with the stock 1hp starter working fine. BUT, if you have a syncro, and dont like spending a few hours changing the starter if it goes bad in the middle of nowhere, get the tdi one. no more worries nad no problems. Oh, karl, i work at rocky mountain westy and we've been using the tdi adapters on several svx and one 2.5 conversions, and its awesome! i also have one on my personal svx van and its never missed a beat in almost a year!! great adapter, quality product. have not yet tested the automatic, but its great that you make one so it can be done now.

Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:14 am

Thanks so much for all the REPLIES! I love theSamba!

As soon as I can find a TDI starter, I'll get the adapter. That it sounding like the most "sound" option.

I think I am using a 1.9L starter right now. That could be the main issue - but I'm tired of replacing the starter - I want the best.

Let me know if anyone of you finds an extra TDI starter!

Buffbuh

Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:29 am

presslab wrote: I have a Bosch rebuilt 1 HP starter and it turns my EJ22 over plenty fast; however the coldest I have had it is 18 F.

Ditto! My experience exactly.

Alot of the problems people have with existing starters are:
1. 1.9's are pretty marginal,
2. Old 2.1's and 1.9's may be worn out,
3. Some FLAP (non-Bosch) rebuilds may not be the best.
4. The bushing may be worn out (new one comes with rebuild)

Of course, grounds and good cables are important regardless....

The main vendors sell rebuilt starters; that's where I got mine - a Bosch rebuild. I can't believe how good it is compared to the 1.9.

Edit -- Oh, and BTW, if you are an SVX, I think the diesel starter is probably the thing. You are talking a MUCH more difficult job turning it over than a 2.2L. But I can't fathom a 2.2L really needing it, unless something else is wrong.

Tue Nov 18, 2008 1:17 pm

Ben,

PM sent!

Tue Nov 18, 2008 5:13 pm

Will this work?

Auto parts warehouse

Buffbuh

Tue Nov 18, 2008 5:26 pm

car-stuff-1

car-stuff-2

Tue Nov 18, 2008 6:34 pm

I would not recommend buying from parts warehouses that don't list the Bosch number and list one starter as fitting multiple models. The TDI starter is not the same as the gas model. In most cases what is advertised on the sites mentioned is not Bosch but aftermarket crap. Get genuine Bosch SR0408X remanufactured (original VW part #s 02A911023R or 02A911024) and you won't have to worry.