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Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:17 am

I am considering ordering a 90 amp flux wire welder for floor pan weld. I have no idea if this is strong enough or the right type for the floor pan. The price is pretty cheap, so I thought it would be a good starter welder.

Does anyone have advice on whether this would do the job??? Thanks

Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:30 am

You really need a MIG (gas) welder for thin body metal. Without the gas you'll blow holes right through the metal, especially if you are not an experienced welder. Buying a good gas welder is a great investment. A few small jobs for you and for others and it will pay for itself in a very short time.

Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:41 am

the welder will work, but is limited. Being that its a 90 amp, it probably doesn't have infinite temperature control. Flux will leave an ugly weld too. It should have dual wire size feeder too, you will want to us a smaller .025-.029 size wire also for sheetmetal.

Also, the smaller welders (120v) etc... will have a duty cycle, meaning you can only weld on and off without overheating the machine.

Having a nice 220v unit is nice and worth their money. Bottom line, yes you can do it with a flux core wire, it is MIG welding, it is just not gas shielded.

Sun Jul 11, 2010 6:48 am

Much nicer welds with even a 110 gas mig.

Sun Jul 11, 2010 7:19 am

Duane wrote: the welder will work, but is limited. Being that its a 90 amp, it probably doesn't have infinite temperature control. Flux will leave an ugly weld too. It should have dual wire size feeder too, you will want to us a smaller .025-.029 size wire also for sheetmetal.

Also, the smaller welders (120v) etc... will have a duty cycle, meaning you can only weld on and off without overheating the machine.

Having a nice 220v unit is nice and worth their money. Bottom line, yes you can do it with a flux core wire, it is MIG welding, it is just not gas shielded.

Inner shield wire has a high spatter rate,its a pain to work with but is more tolerant of rust and paint. It is not MIG welding,the only thing they have in commom is that they are both wire fed.Larger diameter innershielded wire (.035 plus)used in conjunction with gas shielding is the easiest applied weld there is,used on unlimited thickness mild steel its fool proof,a monkey can do it.

buy a 110v MIG unit (lincoln LN-7 is good) mig requires extreme cleanliness but is easy to weld with...the process is like driving a ferrari,easy and wonderful to use,but high maintenance,keep your nozzel and tip clean,dont kink your whip and you'll be fine.

Sun Jul 11, 2010 10:24 am

I prefer to braze body work. But def. Mig pan!

Sun Jul 11, 2010 8:41 pm

aircooled74 wrote: I prefer to braze body work. But def. Mig pan!
Nothing structural should be brazed together. Brazing is for cosmetic panel repair only. And x2 on MIG. That's the only way to go. Well, aside from TIG of course. :wink: But seriously, with an entry level MIG and a good angle grinder and you can do anything on a Beetle. But practice on some metal scrap first....

Sun Jul 11, 2010 9:50 pm

You can use it even with a flux wire. Gas is definitely better with thinner wire. You can go to the local welding supply store and get flux wires designed for thin sheetmetal welding. Flux wire isn't universal, there are some for overhead welds, thin sheetmetal, high amp etc.

Ask questions at the local welding supply. They can help alot and many of their customers are not professionals, so you won't look silly asking alot of questions.

I weld professionally and still ask the suppliers questions. It is like the auto paint business, stuff is changing and welding materials are becoming better.

Mon Jul 12, 2010 5:35 am

Quote: smaller welders (120v) etc... will have a duty cycle

ALL welding machines have a duty cycle. My Hobart 135 (120v) duty cycle on the lower settings for sheet metal is so long that short beads, like pan half welding, is not an issue.

Mon Jul 12, 2010 6:54 am

runamoc wrote: Quote: smaller welders (120v) etc... will have a duty cycle

ALL welding machines have a duty cycle. My Hobart 135 (120v) duty cycle on the lower settings for sheet metal is so long that short beads, like pan half welding, is not an issue.

sure they all have a duty cycle... but the point the poster was making is that with larger and better machines you get a longer duty cycle and most larger, better, machines have a 100% duty cycle... meaning more stability for continuous welding..

Mon Jul 12, 2010 10:55 am

bugninva wrote: runamoc wrote: Quote: smaller welders (120v) etc... will have a duty cycle

ALL welding machines have a duty cycle. My Hobart 135 (120v) duty cycle on the lower settings for sheet metal is so long that short beads, like pan half welding, is not an issue.

sure they all have a duty cycle... but the point the poster was making is that with larger and better machines you get a longer duty cycle and most larger, better, machines have a 100% duty cycle... meaning more stability for continuous welding..

Well, the point I brought up is that at lower current settings the Duty cycle for any welder is higher even for a cheap welder. The current/voltage setting I use on 'pans' works out to be 90% Duty cycle for the Hobart. So if I were to weld pans like you do, continuously, it could pretty much handle it, but I weld 1"-1 1/2" beads and the time between the beads makes the Duty cycle not an issue. 8)

Mon Jul 12, 2010 11:05 am

runamoc wrote: bugninva wrote: runamoc wrote: Quote: smaller welders (120v) etc... will have a duty cycle

ALL welding machines have a duty cycle. My Hobart 135 (120v) duty cycle on the lower settings for sheet metal is so long that short beads, like pan half welding, is not an issue.

sure they all have a duty cycle... but the point the poster was making is that with larger and better machines you get a longer duty cycle and most larger, better, machines have a 100% duty cycle... meaning more stability for continuous welding..

Well, the point I brought up is that at lower current settings the Duty cycle for any welder is higher even for a cheap welder. The current/voltage setting I use on 'pans' works out to be 90% Duty cycle for the Hobart. So if I were to weld pans like you do, continuously, it could pretty much handle it, but I weld 1"-1 1/2" beads and the time between the beads makes the Duty cycle not an issue. 8)

I was just trying to inform on duty cycles. If he is looking at a small 90 amp cheapo welder, I would assume (might be wrong) that it will be very limited, and if he plans to us it for seam welding, he should know about duty cycles before he wonders why his new welder is acting like crap after welding for 30 minutes or so, or the next time he uses it and it doesn't weld good.

I have a Miller 175, can run that thing all day long. Love it. Before that I had one of them old Craftsman 135 Pros, great machine, but limited.

Mon Jul 12, 2010 11:18 am

runamoc wrote: [ So if I were to weld pans like you do, continuously, it could pretty much handle it, but I weld 1"-1 1/2" beads and the time between the beads makes the Duty cycle not an issue. 8)

I don't weld pans continuously, nor do I weld 1- 1 1/2" beads on pans, I plug weld... all you need and doesn't make the pans too brittle around the weld... :wink:

Mon Jul 12, 2010 12:12 pm

I am in the middle of welding in my pans right now and am having a little trouble.

I have a Millermatic 211 with .030 wire and my test welds look good but the real thing is not coming out so great.

I am using weld-through primer along the edge of the tunnel and I punched holes in the edge of the pan.

I start the arc on the thicker tunnel inside the hole but more than half the time I just burn a bigger hole in the pan.

Would I be better off with no primer? My practice welds I did with no primer and I could get what looked like a plug weld without even a starter hole. Just start on the pan and it would go through to the edge.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:44 pm

[email protected] wrote: I am in the middle of welding in my pans right now and am having a little trouble.

I have a Millermatic 211 with .030 wire and my test welds look good but the real thing is not coming out so great.

I am using weld-through primer along the edge of the tunnel and I punched holes in the edge of the pan.

I start the arc on the thicker tunnel inside the hole but more than half the time I just burn a bigger hole in the pan.

Would I be better off with no primer? My practice welds I did with no primer and I could get what looked like a plug weld without even a starter hole. Just start on the pan and it would go through to the edge.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Run smaller wire... .025 runs colder than .030...Im with Buginva and you,plug weld the pans in...100% welding a pan on a continuous basis is impossible without tacking the pan in first,and foolish due to the warp factor. Stitch'em or plug'em...and seal them up.

Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:14 am

I have read thru this thread and I am undecided..I have a 135G welder that has a gas port. It's a 220 model and I can't move it around..I just found a extention cord that will allow me 25 feet more of pull but I can trade it for a 125..110 model with gas port..whic one is good for pans and tube welding..etc? thanks..

Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:15 pm

takedaily wrote: I have read thru this thread and I am undecided..I have a 135G welder that has a gas port. It's a 220 model and I can't move it around..I just found a extention cord that will allow me 25 feet more of pull but I can trade it for a 125..110 model with gas port..whic one is good for pans and tube welding..etc? thanks..
Don't. 220V welders are so much more versatile than a 125 machine. And I wouldn't burn in tube with anything less than my Miller 175 unless it was something that had no structural bearing. Build a cart and get a longer cord for your 220 machine. A gas setup costs the same for either machine. I would suggest buying the plugs and wire and building your own cord though, the pre-fab ones I've seen are ridiculously priced.

As far as welding sheet metal with flux core, I've done it, but it's a pain in the ass, and not for a first timer. MIG is simple, I've taught people to make picture perfect beads with a properly set MIG in literally 10 minutes. I mean I know people that've shaved door handles with a stick welder too, but it's not something I would have the patience for.

Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:52 pm

If it is that 90amp from harbor freight do not get it I had one and it was a POS

I have a hobart 140 now and it is night and day

Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:29 pm

bottom line is spend the money for a good welder, that you can run a shielding gas, hobart, lincoln, miller all make very good 110 welders. miller even makes one now that will basically set its self whitch is great for beginers. all your going to do buying a cheap non name brand welder is drive yourself crazy. go to your local wedling supply store (praxair, american welding, air gas) and they will be happy to help you out.

Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:47 pm

I had an 85 amp Sears MIG for years ( which I think was a Clarke) and for the money it was an adequate welder. One of the drawbacks of the cheap welders is that the wire stays energized when the trigger is released - trigger only controls the wire feed. I cant tell you how many times it arced with my helmet up. Long story short, spend the extra money. I recently bought a Hobart 140 and there is a TON of difference in the way it welds. Stay with the name brands - Miller, Hobart, Lincoln and don't settle for one of the low end models that doesn't come with the gas regulator. If you can't afford to pop for a bottle right off, you can weld with flux core until you can.