TheSamba.com :: View topic

Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:03 am

I was going through my boxes of parts for my restoration last night, a mixture of parts from a '58 and a '64, and stumbled on an interesting little bit of curio...

Most people know about the headliner and jute triangular pillows that were stuffed up into the corners of the engine compartment. For those that don't, they're little triangular pillows made out of scrap headliner material and stuffed with jute. When looking at mine (they're from the '64), they're made of the standard perforated vinyl headliner material, right? Upon closer inspection (and this evaded me the first several times I looked at these pillows), the perforations are just little black dots! If you look at the headliner piece on the "back" of the pillow, it's not perforated, but when you flip up the corner, it has the little dots. I looked closer and sure enough, they're not holes but dots! I figured the perforations would have been done when the vinyl was being made, but it looks like it wasn't done until AFTER the headliner was cut out (why else would the scraps not have holes?).

Interesting.

Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:19 am

63 vinyl did not have holes but painted dots. The dotted material was also used on the window sections of type II. The dots were painted to match the holes in the headliner section. When the side sections are glued on if there were holes the glue would squeeze right through.

Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:26 am

The frontmost section of headliner was dots not perf, on many models.

Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:41 am

Didn't know that. I suppose it's not as curious as I thought...

Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:43 am

Hi,

Does anyone repro the pillows? I have one but need a second one. How far / tight do you stuff them in the hole? Should you be able to see the bottom of the pillow if you look up?

I restored my wife's '64, and the car was bought already taken apart and in boxes from the PO. It is still quite loud even with all the sound proofing materials added. My understanding is the pillows really make a difference in the interior noise level.

FYI - I would also buy a used one if somebody has one for sale - just PM me.

Cheers,
DB

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:00 pm

Bigger is better. VW made them as small as possible but barely work because they were cheap.

Those also seal oil/gas/exhaust fumes from the engine bay before they get sucked into the passenger compartment, which is at a negative pressure at road speeds.

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:05 pm

I just found this the other day

Make your own

Sun Mar 04, 2012 6:57 pm

we made our own its listed on my thread

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5894798#5894798

Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:11 pm

In many models the headliner is both perforated and non perforated (black dots). The reason VW did this is because in the areas of the headliner where it is glued down you cant have perforated headliner or the glue would seap through the holes.

My '65's original headliner has the front most piece by the front windshield non-perforated (black dots) and the center is perforated and then under the rear quarter windows and rear window is non-perforated(black dots). No one reproduces the exact black dot vinyl (though some thats VERY close can be found) so if your trying to restore you car back to the way it was off the production line your screwed and have to use all perforated headliner. On the plus side its a quick and easy way to tell if a headliner is original or not.

Mon Mar 05, 2012 4:43 am

In the service bulletin n.13 (thanks, derluftwagen) I'm very confused about the "E" item; why to insulate the partition under instrument board? This area is not interested by engine noise.

On my '63 I have no soundproofing there. Should I provide with?

Thank you

Mon Mar 05, 2012 6:15 am

Which is item "A" in the service bulletin?

Is it stuffed into the ventilation channel (blocking it???) or is glued flat above the channel or on the rooftop?

Thank you

Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:04 am

Item "E" is just a piece that is glued to the flat sheet metal ahead of your fuel tank... The panel above your knees when seated. I have seen plenty of these in old beetles, usually pretty rotten and frail. These were just placed in there to kill some of the road noise drumming through the sheet metal up front.

Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:46 am

My 67 has a type of foam stuffed in the corners of engine compartment. Maybe they changed it by 67.

Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:52 am

About item "A" in the bulletin: When I changed the wiring loom in my 64, the channel it passes through in the roof was stuffed with yellow foam material. I'm not sure what it was like when new, but it was dry and crumbled apart as it was pulled out--I used a wire hanger to get out the last bits of it. It wasn't like the pictures I've seen of the injected foam VW used in the 70s bugs. I replaced it in both channels with some closed cell foam before replacing the pillows.

Thanks for posting the service bulletin: I knew about the pillows but the foam was a surprise when I found it, I hadn't seen it mentioned anywhere before that.

Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:37 pm

herbie1200 wrote: In the service bulletin n.13 (thanks, derluftwagen) I'm very confused about the "E" item; why to insulate the partition under instrument board? This area is not interested by engine noise.

On my '63 I have no soundproofing there. Should I provide with?

Thank you

Here is a pic of some of the original tar/fiber insulation or item "E"

Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:44 am

Ok, so I have poked around, and the channels that run up the c pillar in my 60 have two different types of stuffing. The lower, which is located behind tar board, is a sewed cloth pillow full of upohlstry batting. The other, located above the channel the pillow resides in, is an obviously aged foam of some kind that turns to dust when I poke at it with a finger. I can barely reach it with fingertips with the deckled in place. On the driver side I think the wiring runs through this foam from the roof/front of car. Is it best to leave it alone, or pull it and replace it with something modern that won't hold water?

Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:04 am

Thank You Derluftwagen, yesterday in the evening I've glued a sound deadener board as an "E" item and today noticed a good "smoothness" effect on road noises. A sheet of metal, now I've understood, should not be left without a soft sheet that asbsorbs vibration.

Wed Mar 07, 2012 12:18 am

Dear PanicMan and McQuirk

It seems that, on yours '60 and '64 both you discovered a sort of yellow foam into the upper channels, am I right?

Do you have a photo of that?

I'm trying to reconstruct the original sound insulation on my '63.

Noticed that the biggest part of engine noise comes in via the upper channels; but, if I close them noise decrease but, at speed, a lot of air pressure grows in the cabin, disturbing my ears.

From 1967 upper channels were closed BUT compensated with air outlet above rear window.

On '63 they should be free so cabin air can escape through them towards openings in the engine room.

I'm searching how to leave them free for air and blocked for sound!

Wed Mar 07, 2012 4:57 am

what are the dimensions of the triangles?

Wed Mar 07, 2012 8:43 am

the orignals from my 65 where 7" x 9" on the legs and they where about 1/2 to 5/8 thick some spots more worn down than others.We just made bigger and thicker ones for more of a seal and insulation (fire resistantance).