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  View original topic: comparison between Mendeola & Eyeball A-Arm Suspension Page: 1, 2, 3  Next
jashv Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:55 am

I've been doing a little lite research between the Mendeola front end kit - http://www.mendeolamotors.com/motors/ and the Eyeball Engineering kit - http://eyeball-engineering.net/a-arm.html and not being an engineer myself I'm not really sure which is better. Has anyone come across any pros/cons to each.

I've found posts from the Mendeolo folks who say:

Quote: We are also the only "true performance" front end, and the only a-arm front end with a sway bar.

Which is like me saying in this post "I'm a certified female body inspector" just take my word on that :wink:

I like reviews, tech notes, anything that will help me understand which is better. At $3k a pop I'd like to put my money in the right place so to speak. Thanks for any help !!

Der6VoltFahrers Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:55 pm

Not to forget about this one...

http://www.red9design.co.uk/type1.htm

911pickup Tue Feb 15, 2011 3:55 pm

I've also looked (online) at all three. Eyeball now offers a sway bar for their kit.
I believe the Eyeball kit is entirely bolt on, but the Mendeola kit needs some welding. I'm also not sure if the Mendeola kit can be installed with the body on the pan.

jaymonkey Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:45 pm

The Red9 product is way cheaper. It's $2000CAD, I'm assuming 200-300 for shipping. It's actually the one I've been looking at and the company I've been communicating with. I could see about a price on 2 if you where interested.

jashv Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:28 pm

Just looking at them the Mendeola looks to be beefier and stronger. Welding is always fun so I wouldn't mind that, but I'm not to keen on the big in your face advert for their company on it, kinda vain. I'd say leave that off and give me a decal I could put on the window if I wanted to. The UK model looks good, but I like the videos on the eyeball site. What's funny is in my Jegs catalog you could buy one of these for a Mustang for about $2k or less, so why are these so expensive? I like the other products on the Mendeola site and wouldn't mind an entire pan from them, if it didn't cost so much. I'm not naive, I'd rather pay for quality than for some cheaply made crap, but someone on these websites needs to say WHY their product is better than another, not just because they say so. Look at Jack Raby at aircooled.net YEARS of testing go into his products and he's not afraid to show off the test data to prove why his stuff rocks.

jaymonkey Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:57 pm

They've lit the fire, hopefully a few other companies come online to produce a comparable beam to bring down the price. Won't help me, I'll be ordering mine in a month or two.

mark tucker Tue Feb 15, 2011 7:12 pm

so how much heaver are these systems??

66brm Tue Feb 15, 2011 7:59 pm

mark tucker wrote: so how much heaver are these systems??

The mendeola is actually lighter than a stock beam

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=401807

hoghead Tue Feb 15, 2011 8:08 pm

2 years ago, I went out and had a design engineered using rack and pinion steering and A-arms to fit my 17 x 7 Porsche 996 wheels and brakes while fitting inside my fenders. The engineering design alone cost what Mendola wants for a finished product so I really do not think what these companies are asking too bad.

I have been thinking of selling the design or at least one or two front ends to defray my costs


911pickup Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:32 am

Jaymonkey, I like the Red9 kit (and its price), but it doesn't have a sway bar, which would be a deal breaker for me.

jashv Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:34 am

hoghead - I think that's a good idea, it might help out some of those who are willing to tackle that challenge of building the entire unit from scratch. Still don't know which is better, I do like the fact the mendeola is lite, and it just looks stronger. Think of the time it takes to laser or water jet their name into the front, heck that's $800 of the cost right there.

wompninja Wed Feb 16, 2011 3:06 pm

The mustang kit is cheap because people buy them and they've been selling them for years. Once the Mendeola kit starts selling more and they make up the R&D time then the price will go down. That's how business works.

coolrydes Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:18 am

jashv wrote: Just looking at them the Mendeola looks to be beefier and stronger. Welding is always fun so I wouldn't mind that, but I'm not to keen on the big in your face advert for their company on it, kinda vain. I'd say leave that off and give me a decal I could put on the window if I wanted to. The UK model looks good, but I like the videos on the eyeball site. What's funny is in my Jegs catalog you could buy one of these for a Mustang for about $2k or less, so why are these so expensive? I like the other products on the Mendeola site and wouldn't mind an entire pan from them, if it didn't cost so much. I'm not naive, I'd rather pay for quality than for some cheaply made crap, but someone on these websites needs to say WHY their product is better than another, not just because they say so. Look at Jack Raby at aircooled.net YEARS of testing go into his products and he's not afraid to show off the test data to prove why his stuff rocks.

Sorry,
I had to jump in here on this one.
Like Jake Raby we spent and spend endless amounts of time to fully refine our products. If you look into our transaxle line we've been known for quality products.
Our new chassis line went thru a lot of testing. We first looked at the Red 9 and the Eyeball, we also looked at the Pete's a-arm bolt on kit. They all had good and bad points. Just for the sake of examples here are some of the things we did and did not like. Also to achieve the high level of performance we wanted, we had to design our own.
Please understand we are only pointing out our findings before designing our own. Hell, we made our front end handle so well we needed to design a rear system to tighten up the rear suspension also. Our rear kits features the same great Fox racing shocks, a rear sway bar, toe and camber adjustments. Originally we did not intend to sell these to the public, however after I drove one of these and being a VW guy for over 20 years, I knew I had to make these available to all type 1 based vehicles.

Red 9:
The good
good design
very strong

The bad
no sway bar
shipping cost
wait time to clear customs
very little adjustability
steering knuckles being bolted onto the spindles

Eyeball:
The good
bolts on with out removing the body

The bad
Difficult adjustments. in a-arms
No sway bar at the time we looked it over
Bolts being in sheer
Overall design seemed to light weight possibly a little weak?
Reeling on the sheet metal portions of the pan to support the twist
the use of tie rods in key pivot positions

Pete's A-arm kits
The good
plenty strong
bolt on
uses a stock beam style bolt on frame so that the weight of the car is supported just like it was originally Bolts not in sheer

The bad
not very adjustable
no sway bar
not really designed for street cars more for off road
out weighed a stock beam by 12 lbs
Cost (you still have to get spindles and buy the sway bar)

As far as the MENDEOLA name on it. It's not that we are trying to show off or act like we are better then anyone else. It is to protect our investment. We have 6 major lines of transaxles in current production and a few years back we had a company copy three of the 6 lines. They splashed almost every part. You could even see our Mendeola name in their first cases. Needless to say they saw the inside of the court room a few times over this. Having our name on it does two things. For us it protects our investment. For the customer it say quality. If you ever want to sell your car it will add value.

Dan the workingstiff Fri Feb 18, 2011 2:56 pm

Here's another link http://www.a-arm.com/

coolrydes Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:27 pm

Dan the workingstiff wrote: Here's another link http://www.a-arm.com/

This is the Pete's A-arm kits. I'm not sure if he is still building kits.

jashv Mon Feb 21, 2011 8:57 pm

coolrydes - You say that's your testing or a non-bias third party tester? Please don't take offense to that question, just asking. Seriously in just looking at the construction I'd say hands down I'd trust the Mendeola 1st because it just looks over engineered enough to support a tank on top. I do kind of like the idea of a bolt on front end, but knowing when that time comes the pan and the body will be separated anyway I don't care if it bolts on or welds on as long as it STAYS on. Are you thinking about making a RHD unit?

Tom_Kathleen Tue Feb 22, 2011 8:52 am

jashv - I think the weld on Super Beetle based front end is already capable of RHD. If the rear most bulkhead is symetrical, you would just have to flip it around for right side master cylinder clearance before welding and add a RHD steering rack.

I have not seen enough detail pictures of the ball joint/link pin front end to see if the same thing is possible. Tom

jbbugs Tue Feb 22, 2011 1:02 pm

A customer of mine was looking into buying a front end kit from Red 9. After a few emails to them and some VERY SLOW, un-informative responces from them, he decided against any purchases from them.
If it takes them weeks to reply to emails, how long would it take to actually ship and receive the parts?

coolrydes Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:09 pm

jashv wrote: coolrydes - You say that's your testing or a non-bias third party tester? Please don't take offense to that question, just asking. Seriously in just looking at the construction I'd say hands down I'd trust the Mendeola 1st because it just looks over engineered enough to support a tank on top. I do kind of like the idea of a bolt on front end, but knowing when that time comes the pan and the body will be separated anyway I don't care if it bolts on or welds on as long as it STAYS on. Are you thinking about making a RHD unit?

As for the testing up to this point has been done by us. We are planning a third party testing soon with video cameras and testing equipment being filmed to show without any dought the findings.

Actualy we have shipped a few of these in a right hand drive config. You will have to buy a right hand drive rack in your country since we do not have right hand drive racks here in the states. We simple deduct the price of the rack and flip the rear bulk head around when building them. All of our kits both super beetle and standard kits are available in right hand drive.

coolrydes Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:12 pm

jbbugs wrote: A customer of mine was looking into buying a front end kit from Red 9. After a few emails to them and some VERY SLOW, un-informative responces from them, he decided against any purchases from them.
If it takes them weeks to reply to emails, how long would it take to actually ship and receive the parts?
Our email time is normaly the same day (durring business days of the week) and we normaly ship kits in 6-8 weeks currently due to a large amount of orders.



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