TheSamba.com :: View topic - 5 cylinder TDI blahblahbl... wait a second... audi trans?!!!

Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:26 pm

I was thinking about this on the drive home, if you made a plate that bolted to the trans that used the input shaft as a locator, it would be as easy as cutting, spinning around the input shaft & re-welding. Assuming there weren't huge gaps to fill where things were different.

That or just an adapter plate to any flipped longitudinal trans... Any reason you can't flip a Subaru trans?

Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:26 pm

AndyBees wrote: The engine mounting tube looks like one I saw for sale here in the Samba with a package deal...........Quantum 5-cylinder diesel, South Africa Bell housing, mounting bars, etc..... looked very similar if not the same!

yeah the guy Im working for down here, bought that package, It was a pretty good deal, I'm suprised it didnt sell earlier. it looks just like that!
He's gonna put that 5 cyl behind a DK tranny. Whats wrong with that?? I think it'll be a tractor :D , im kinda on the way out so I probably wont see it run. theres gonna be alot of customization involved but another pass van so make it fit :twisted:

Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:38 am

I'm unconvinced about the oiling. When Porsche turned the 930 gearbox upside down, it involved an internal oil pump and an external oil line.
If you just filled the gearbox as high as possible, you'd end up with oil pressure problems and leaks all over the place.

Centering the gearbox to the input shaft would take more than just relying on it being in the clutch centre plate. There's always play inbetween the shaft and support bearings so it could feel right and not be... if that makes any sense.

A nice idea but going on the other things I've seen produced by the same outfit, I don't expect that these issues will have been looked at.

MG

Fri Mar 04, 2011 12:16 pm

It might be easier to make an adapter plate that fit between the bell housing and the transmission rather than cut and weld. The only problem I can think of is that the input shaft might come up short, but it would be easy enough to extend the pilot shaft bearing with a custom adapter. In an application like this, an external pump would be a good idea. You could plumb an oil cooler as well and have a couple of returns on top of the case that you could position over the ring gear and the gear cluster. I like when someone thinks outside the box. For sure, whomever did the bellhousing did not do the other fabrication.

Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:47 pm

Sweet!!!

Mon Mar 07, 2011 4:50 pm

SyncroGhia wrote: .

A nice idea but going on the other things I've seen produced by the same outfit, I don't expect that these issues will have been looked at.

MG

HI EVEYONE THIS IS MY VAN AND TRANSMISSION IN THIS THREAD

FIRST OF ALL HELLO TO ALL OF YOU LOT OVER THE WATER
A FEW THINGS ABOUT ME FIRST
MY NAME IS MARTYN FROM SUNNY ENGLAND
I HAVE ALWAYS BEEN IN TO VW CARS AND CAMPERVANS I HAVE LOST
COUNT HOW MANY I HAVE HAD
I HAVE ALWAYS WORKED IN THE MOTORTRADE AS I LOVE CARS
I WORKED FOR RALLIART FOR A FEW YEARS MODIFYING
CARS FOR TRACK AND RALLY ETC
I AM CURRENTLY WORKING FOR MERCEDES BENZ ON THE SLS MODEL

ANYWAY

THANKS MIKE (SYNCROGHIA) FOR YOUR BACKING ON THIS ONE

IF EVEYONE WAS WORRIED ABOUT IF IT WOULD WORK OR NOT WORK THEN NOTHING WOULD EVER MOVE FORWARD
BOTTOM LINE IS I THINK IT WILL WORK ONLY TIME WILL TELL
IF IT DONT THEN I WILL MODIFY TO SUIT

THE OLD TRANSPORTER / EUROVAN TRANSMISSION IS RUBBISH
I SPENT
£1500 ON HAVEING MY AAP TRANSMISSION FULLY WORKED IN GERMANY LAST YEAR AND I STILL BROKE IT !
WE ALL NEED TO FIND WAYS TO MAKE OUR VANS MORE MODERN / STRONGER
AND AT REASONABLE COSTS THIS AUDI TRANSMISSION COST £75 TO PURCHACE
AND £200 TO BE CUT AND WELDED SO IF IT DONT LAST VERY LONG
I AM NOT BOVERED .

Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:27 pm

loogy wrote: I actually considered doing exactly that with my 1.8T project, but I didn't like how high it raised the inner CV joints in comparison to the outers. Probably not an issue on a lowered, or maybe even stock, height van, but on a higher van, I think that the CV angle would be less than ideal. Cool to see it done though. Where did you find that?
my van has a 70mm drop on the rear so the shafts have a slight
upwards stance to meet the audi tranmission
(flanges sit 4inches higher in the audi box)

with the vw tansmission the shafts went down from the wheel to meet the transmission which is lower

Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:46 pm

Vanagon Nut wrote: danfromsyr wrote: I can't say I'm favoring the exhaust or engine carrier welding

x2, though I consider myself a hack at that stuff.

And the size of tube used for carrier may be too small.

Neil.
the engine bar has been ok for 8years and thats been
with lots of track and drag racing action
got to admit i just banged the exhaust together
as i was eager to to get the van out on the road for a test drive
:D

Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:52 pm

Sir Sam wrote: I'm also wondering about oiling, unless the tranny was filled completely to the top I would be worried about how it would oil everything.

Seal the "top" side of the tranny and add a breather/reservoir somewhere and fill it to the top........

top of the box (bottom if in the audi)

drain bung has been drilled and turned in to the breather

Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:29 pm

Sweet ride! What size brake discs are you running front and rear?

Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:54 pm

Interesting indeed, I like the concept...seems more down to earth vs the subaru 5 speeds being worked on....er I mean up my alley :)

Tue Mar 08, 2011 10:55 am

BUS.BOY wrote: Vanagon Nut wrote:

x2, though I consider myself a hack at that stuff.

And the size of tube used for carrier may be too small.

Neil.
the engine bar has been ok for 8years and thats been
with lots of track and drag racing action
got to admit i just banged the exhaust together
as i was eager to to get the van out on the road for a test drive
:D

Well I tend to over build stuff so whadda I know? ;)

Material I used is too big!

Glad it's holding up.

Neil.

Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:44 am

Zeitgeist 13 wrote: Sweet ride! What size brake discs are you running front and rear?

360 mm front discs
330 mm rears
997 front and rear calipers and ferrari 360 handbrake calipers

rear discs

Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:30 am

Whoa...

Mon Oct 17, 2011 5:38 am

very interesting, i thought about giving that a go a while ago, the idea was shot down in flames big time, i'm glad you made it work 8)
it looks like a lot of work has gone in, thinking about this conversion last night while i was trying to sleep got me wondering, if the side of the gearbox was machined out so the diff could be flipped and fitted the other side, maybe a billet block could be machined to hold the diff in place, still the shift "H" would be backwards, i guess not the hardest part of life

Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:23 am

How would he be able to make that work? I thought you would need a reverse ring and pinion to allow the tranny to run backwards without issues?

Greg

Tue Oct 18, 2011 4:13 am

Just out of interest, how did you ensure that the bellhousing was exactly inline with the gearbox so as not to encounter clutch mis-alignment issues?

I'm still intrigued also as to how the diff bearings are receiving enough oil if you haven't over filled the gearbox with oil.

MG

Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:51 am

soundmasterg wrote: How would he be able to make that work? I thought you would need a reverse ring and pinion to allow the tranny to run backwards without issues?

Greg

i looked inside a gearbox, when it was on my mind, it would mean machining out the side of the trans, so the diff could be fitted from the other side, then a bearing housing/infill would need to me machined to fill the hole, this again could not be done without welding as we could not see enough places around the edge to tap for bolts to be able to bolt the infill piece back to the gearbox, the machining costs put me off, i didn't think about cutting off the bellhousing and rotating it the the idea was dropped

i take my hat off BUS.BOY for making it work, impressive stuff 8)

SyncroGhia wrote: Just out of interest, how did you ensure that the bellhousing was exactly inline with the gearbox so as not to encounter clutch mis-alignment issues?

I'm still intrigued also as to how the diff bearings are receiving enough oil if you haven't over filled the gearbox with oil.

MG

that could be achieved by drilling and tapping the gearbox case, and adding some tapped unions for brake line, running it like a dry sump system, using either an electric or belt driver powers steering pump, that'd oil the bearings where needed, wouldn't it ?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:46 am

soundmasterg wrote: How would he be able to make that work? I thought you would need a reverse ring and pinion to allow the tranny to run backwards without issues?

Greg

You are correct, Greg. You can't "flip" a hypoid ring gear because the axiis of rotation for both shafts are offset. The teeth are cut in an arc and they would no longer mesh. Creating packaging room for flipping a differential is just half the chore in reversing a modern transmission. Getting a reverse cut ring and pinion set is the other one - and unless one is planning to order a lot of them, it is cost prohibitive.

D

Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:21 pm

rubbachicken wrote: very interesting, i thought about giving that a go a while ago, the idea was shot down in flames big time, i'm glad you made it work 8)
it looks like a lot of work has gone in, thinking about this conversion last night while i was trying to sleep got me wondering, if the side of the gearbox was machined out so the diff could be flipped and fitted the other side, maybe a billet block could be machined to hold the diff in place, still the shift "H" would be backwards, i guess not the hardest part of life

i looked at flipping the diff but the main shaft is off set
also there is not enough alloy to machine the cases back
to make room for offset the the ring