TheSamba.com :: View topic - Fuel Line Fuel hose

Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:01 am

I can vouch for this type of Fuel Injection hose.
I just changed my fuel lines (finally) after six years. Maybe foolish to let it go that long but although the old lines were a little stiff, they were still flexible with no cracks. I can squeeze the ends of the lines and they don't crack. This seems to have held up very well.
I don't know the brand, got it from Triangle Auto here in Orlando, standard high pressure fuel injection line.
Marking are 7x3 Made in Germany NER/CR 43/13/21 07:37

Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:08 am

LeeE wrote: I can vouch for this type of Fuel Injection hose.
I just changed my fuel lines (finally) after six years. Maybe foolish to let it go that long but although the old lines were a little stiff, they were still flexible with no cracks. I can squeeze the ends of the lines and they don't crack. This seems to have held up very well.
I don't know the brand, got it from Triangle Auto here in Orlando, standard high pressure fuel injection line.
Marking are 7x3 Made in Germany NER/CR 43/13/21 07:37

I think that is the same hose I can get from Halsey in Portland. It last very well from what I have seen. Fairly cheap compared to other hose as well.

Thu Nov 03, 2016 7:20 pm

I recently pulled a section of NER/CR dated 2004 that was still in great shape. A little bloated, but no cracking on the inside at all.

I replaced all my hose with that Made in Germany NER/CR hose. We'll see how it holds up.

Fri Nov 04, 2016 11:46 pm

Does anyone have the part number for Gates Barricade - 7mm hose at O'reillys?

Sat Nov 05, 2016 6:43 am

Vova wrote: Does anyone have the part number for Gates Barricade - 7mm hose at O'reillys?

Gates doesn't make 7mm hose. It's in standard measurements so the options are 5/16" (8mm) or 1/4" (6.3mm)

The 1/4 is way too tight. 5/16 is a bit loose, but people still seem to use it. Just make sure to use the proper FI clamps and make sure it's tight.

Part number is 27348

Sat Nov 05, 2016 6:57 am

for FI Gates Barricade 5/16 fits like a glove. 1/2 works for the fuel filter to pump. Both are available at O'Reillys. It doesn't have the gasoline smell seep thru like the other hoses do. In fact it is the only CARB II certified hose because of the low permeation.

Sat Nov 05, 2016 8:07 am

BayCreamPuff wrote: Vova wrote: Does anyone have the part number for Gates Barricade - 7mm hose at O'reillys?

Gates doesn't make 7mm hose. It's in standard measurements so the options are 5/16" (8mm) or 1/4" (6.3mm)

The 1/4 is way too tight. 5/16 is a bit loose, but people still seem to use it. Just make sure to use the proper FI clamps and make sure it's tight.

Part number is 27348
5/16 is what I was looking for. Thanks!
Cream puff. Do you have a build thread? I'm restoring your younger brother.

Sat Nov 05, 2016 8:10 am

SGKent wrote: for FI Gates Barricade 5/16 fits like a glove. 1/2 works for the fuel filter to pump. Both are available at O'Reillys. It doesn't have the gasoline smell seep thru like the other hoses do. In fact it is the only CARB II certified hose because of the low permeation.
I thought it was 3/8 for the fuel filter to pump?

Sat Nov 05, 2016 8:16 am

BayCreamPuff wrote:

The 1/4 is way too tight. 5/16 is a bit loose, but people still seem to use it. Just make sure to use the proper FI clamps and make sure it's tight.

VW sizes the OEM hoses to the ID of the fitting which gives a very snug fit between the hose and the fitting, thus 5/16" hose fits very nicely on the 7mm ID (8mm OD) fittings and tubing VW used. I have used several brands of 5/16" FI hose over the years and they all fit fine.

Vova needs to be aware that there are two types of Gates Barricade hose a low pressure variant for carburetors and a high pressure variant for FI use.

Sat Nov 05, 2016 8:25 am

Wildthings wrote: BayCreamPuff wrote:

The 1/4 is way too tight. 5/16 is a bit loose, but people still seem to use it. Just make sure to use the proper FI clamps and make sure it's tight.

VW sizes the OEM hoses to the ID of the fitting which gives a very snug fit between the hose and the fitting, thus 5/16" hose fits very nicely on the 7mm ID (8mm OD) fittings and tubing VW used. I have used several brands of 5/16" FI hose over the years and they all fit fine.

Vova needs to be aware that there are two types of Gates Barricade hose a low pressure variant for carburetors and a high pressure variant for FI use.

I am pretty sure the original hose between the filter and pump is 11mm ID. 1/2" is the closest. 3/8 is 9.52 mm and 1/2 is 12.7 mm. The Barricade is less flexible to expand so you won't get the 3/8" / 9.52 mm over the filter. 7/16" would be perfect but they do not make it.

SGKent wrote: the high pressure FI line will be marked 225 PSI on it every foot or so as I recall. I put it down in my post but I think the 5/16 was perfect for the high pressure side and I used 1/2 inch for the short filter section. O'Reillys had it - they had to order the 1/2 inch and someone shipped them a whole spool like 200' so they just gave me 1 foot off that for free. I used the high pressure line for everything else but it is overkill you don't have to do that. I just didn't want to do the "and 2' of that," and "18" of that and ...

Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:57 am

Gates barricade fuel hose date stamp.

Note the date stamp on this hose is CS092011.
CS=the Gates plant that manufactured it
09=month
20=day
11=year 2011

I could not find a regulatory agency with a posted shelf life expiration date for fuel hose.
Internet research seams to vary from 5-8 years.
But knowing that tires have a shelf life of 5 years I'm going with that.

This hose at the time I received it had a shelf life of 5yrs 9mnths. so I returned it.

To conclude, it would be a good idea to contact the vendor and get the Manufacturing Date in writing (email) before you order.

Good luck
Tcash

Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:16 pm

telford dorr wrote: Just finished a FI replumb using the Gates Barricade FI hose. Some notes, probably applicable to the non-FI hose:

Good points:
- there is NO gas smell using this hose. It definitely does not allow any fume penetration.
- the 225 psi rating is way more than needed for a FI system. It handles the fuel pressure very well.
- the hose seems quite durable, and I wouldn't worry about accidental hose damage from minor impacts, etc. [That said, I would definitely protect it from sharp cutting edges. But then again, I'd do that with any hose...]

Bad points:
- it has a tendency to kink on small bend radiuses (radii?) (like from the injector to the metal distribution pipes, and at the cold start valve).
- it cannot take fuel on its outer covering very well. I had a slow leak at the fuel pump (operator error...) By the time I caught it, the outer covering was noticeably swollen and gummy. Had to cut the hose back and reattach to repair. Makes me wonder how grease / oil will affect the outer covering, long term.
- it definitely needs the proper clamps - not the cheap worm screw things they sell at the FLAPS. Don't cheap out on this detail. "Buy the best and cry once..."
- the hose is pretty stiff - it does not stretch or compress too well (i.e. it fits what it fits). If you need to plumb between two different size hose barbs, use two different hose sizes and couple using a (buy / make) metal hose adapter (see this post). Don't try to squash it down with a hose clamp (especially on high pressure FI systems).
- it is a shame that they don't make this stuff in true metric sizes.

Bottom line: when used within its limitations, this hose works well, and I would recommend it over the old fabric covered hose in a heartbeat. Just be aware of what it likes and doesn't like.

I'm about to for my fuel lines/hoses so I'm looking at my options and learning what I can.

*crazy thought* Would wrapping it in something protective help keep the outer hose from fuel?
Something like this?
http://www.jegs.com/i/Vibrant-Performance/231/25832/10002/-1

http://www.jegs.com/i/Thermo-Tec/893/14005/10002/-1

Thu Aug 03, 2017 2:40 pm

Terminatez wrote: telford dorr wrote: Just finished a FI replumb using the Gates Barricade FI hose. Some notes, probably applicable to the non-FI hose:

Good points:
- there is NO gas smell using this hose. It definitely does not allow any fume penetration.
- the 225 psi rating is way more than needed for a FI system. It handles the fuel pressure very well.
- the hose seems quite durable, and I wouldn't worry about accidental hose damage from minor impacts, etc. [That said, I would definitely protect it from sharp cutting edges. But then again, I'd do that with any hose...]

Bad points:
- it has a tendency to kink on small bend radiuses (radii?) (like from the injector to the metal distribution pipes, and at the cold start valve).
- it cannot take fuel on its outer covering very well. I had a slow leak at the fuel pump (operator error...) By the time I caught it, the outer covering was noticeably swollen and gummy. Had to cut the hose back and reattach to repair. Makes me wonder how grease / oil will affect the outer covering, long term.
- it definitely needs the proper clamps - not the cheap worm screw things they sell at the FLAPS. Don't cheap out on this detail. "Buy the best and cry once..."
- the hose is pretty stiff - it does not stretch or compress too well (i.e. it fits what it fits). If you need to plumb between two different size hose barbs, use two different hose sizes and couple using a (buy / make) metal hose adapter (see this post). Don't try to squash it down with a hose clamp (especially on high pressure FI systems).
- it is a shame that they don't make this stuff in true metric sizes.

Bottom line: when used within its limitations, this hose works well, and I would recommend it over the old fabric covered hose in a heartbeat. Just be aware of what it likes and doesn't like.

I'm about to for my fuel lines/hoses so I'm looking at my options and learning what I can.

*crazy thought* Would wrapping it in something protective help keep the outer hose from fuel?
Something like this?
http://www.jegs.com/i/Vibrant-Performance/231/25832/10002/-1

http://www.jegs.com/i/Thermo-Tec/893/14005/10002/-1

With some hoses using a wrap seems to make them sweat. Don't know if this applies to any of the currently available hoses or not.

Thu Aug 03, 2017 4:56 pm

Wildthings wrote: Terminatez wrote: telford dorr wrote: Just finished a FI replumb using the Gates Barricade FI hose. Some notes, probably applicable to the non-FI hose:

Good points:
- there is NO gas smell using this hose. It definitely does not allow any fume penetration.
- the 225 psi rating is way more than needed for a FI system. It handles the fuel pressure very well.
- the hose seems quite durable, and I wouldn't worry about accidental hose damage from minor impacts, etc. [That said, I would definitely protect it from sharp cutting edges. But then again, I'd do that with any hose...]

Bad points:
- it has a tendency to kink on small bend radiuses (radii?) (like from the injector to the metal distribution pipes, and at the cold start valve).
- it cannot take fuel on its outer covering very well. I had a slow leak at the fuel pump (operator error...) By the time I caught it, the outer covering was noticeably swollen and gummy. Had to cut the hose back and reattach to repair. Makes me wonder how grease / oil will affect the outer covering, long term.
- it definitely needs the proper clamps - not the cheap worm screw things they sell at the FLAPS. Don't cheap out on this detail. "Buy the best and cry once..."
- the hose is pretty stiff - it does not stretch or compress too well (i.e. it fits what it fits). If you need to plumb between two different size hose barbs, use two different hose sizes and couple using a (buy / make) metal hose adapter (see this post). Don't try to squash it down with a hose clamp (especially on high pressure FI systems).
- it is a shame that they don't make this stuff in true metric sizes.

Bottom line: when used within its limitations, this hose works well, and I would recommend it over the old fabric covered hose in a heartbeat. Just be aware of what it likes and doesn't like.

I'm about to for my fuel lines/hoses so I'm looking at my options and learning what I can.

*crazy thought* Would wrapping it in something protective help keep the outer hose from fuel?
Something like this?
http://www.jegs.com/i/Vibrant-Performance/231/25832/10002/-1

http://www.jegs.com/i/Thermo-Tec/893/14005/10002/-1

With some hoses using a wrap seems to make them sweat. Don't know if this applies to any of the currently available hoses or not.
Yeah, the problem is not external degradation, it's the contents seeping through from inside, trapping it may just accellerate the decay.

Sat Aug 05, 2017 9:29 pm

I see.
Most people have problems with size due to using the original vw fuel pump, it being metric. Buying a carter pump (similar to those cbp offers) the fittings are 5/16 so the gates 5/16 hose shouldn't be an issue connecting in the pump inlet/outlet. In my case I have new dual weber 40 idf from ACN. The hose fittings come in 7mm... Would changing the fitting completely to a standard (5/16) size be a fitting solution?

The only thing different in size in that case would be from the tank to the fuel pump...

Correct me if I'm wrong ofc. :wink:

Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:50 pm

I've just bought Cohline 2240 for my type 4 with dual Weber 34 ICTs. I purchased 2 metres with 5.5mm ID and 2 metres with 7.3mm ID.

Quick question - why did VW use two different fuel hose internal diameters?

I know that the 7.3mm hose originally went from the fuel filter to the mechanical fuel pump, and then 5.5mm hose went from the fuel pump to the carburettors, but I'm not sure why.

I don't have the original filter or pump. I have a plastic fuel filter, going to an electric fuel pump, going to a fuel pressure regulator, and then to the carburettors. The filter needs 5.5mm (in and out) and the pump and regulator both need 7.3mm (in and out).

Do you guys think it would be OK for me to convert all of the fittings to 5.5mm on the pump and regulator? If not, could I convert just the inlet on the pump and the outlet on the regulator to 5.5mm?

I hope that makes sense... I'm a bit confused! Any advice would be greatly appreciated :D

Sun Aug 06, 2017 7:33 pm

Ben Middleton wrote: I've just bought Cohline 2240 for my type 4 with dual Weber 34 ICTs. I purchased 2 metres with 5.5mm ID and 2 metres with 7.3mm ID.

Quick question - why did VW use two different fuel hose internal diameters?

I know that the 7.3mm hose originally went from the fuel filter to the mechanical fuel pump, and then 5.5mm hose went from the fuel pump to the carburettors, but I'm not sure why.

I don't have the original filter or pump. I have a plastic fuel filter, going to an electric fuel pump, going to a fuel pressure regulator, and then to the carburettors. The filter needs 5.5mm (in and out) and the pump and regulator both need 7.3mm (in and out).

Do you guys think it would be OK for me to convert all of the fittings to 5.5mm on the pump and regulator? If not, could I convert just the inlet on the pump and the outlet on the regulator to 5.5mm?

I hope that makes sense... I'm a bit confused! Any advice would be greatly appreciated :D

It makes sense to me as it's something similar I want to do with my setup, except in my case I just want to change the fittings on the carbs to match everything else. Waiting on someone with knowledge to see whether it will work or not.

Sun Aug 06, 2017 9:14 pm

Hi. For the year 1972 it is obvious there were many changes for VW. Why they had the tank outlet at 5mm and the 1700 fuel pump at 7mm is not important nowadays. VW actually had a short dedicated hose for this adaption. And that hose is NLA.
Since the previous two posters have non oem carb systems one would think the ideal procedure would be to have all the hose be a size that is easy to obtain and work for the application.
Hope this helps.

Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:02 am

Would there be any change in fuel pressure or fuel flow if I changed all the hose to 5.5mm?

Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:23 am

Ben Middleton wrote: Would there be any change in fuel pressure or fuel flow if I changed all the hose to 5.5mm?

Highly doubt it. Your type 4 engine with small carbs can't possible run out of fuel even at wide open throttle.
I'm sure someone knows how much fuel a 2 liter engine might digest at a certain rpm.
And I'm sure someone knows how much fuel will flow thru a 5.5mm hose.
I think your good.