TheSamba.com :: View topic - I will no longer recommend Mann or Mahle oil filters.

Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:17 pm

I know the VDO goes off at a higher pressure but the main issue was the low pressure at 3000 rpms. It should be higher than 25lbs if everything is good. Plus now if the VDO pressure light goes off I know something is starting to go amiss before it is too late. My VDO goes off closer to 10-11 psi, and I checked it against a mechanical. Also isn't the idiot light supposed to go off at 2-6 psi?

Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:07 pm

OK, please someone, please post actual first- hand failure of a Fram filter. I , too have read rivers of Fram bashing, but yet not one single picture of a definitive failure of said Fram, on any vehicle, foreign or domestic.
I also harbor doubts in my mind when purchasing a Fram, and sometimes there is no other alternative for a certain vehicle, other than any of my German cars.
I still search for a different brand, but Fram is the ONLY filter carried by FleetFarm, and WalMart only has a few other fitments for various vehicles. I don't buy any from them, but they still sell a helluva lot of filters, almost exclusively Fram. No, I usually do not buy them, but IF they are so damn bad, what keeps the shelves stocked? I have never seen a true documented case of a Fram killing an engine. But maybe I need to get out more and search for the carnage....
Please, educate me. As I said, I do not buy them, (usually), but still, how do they stay in business? :roll:

Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:08 pm

I have read similar complaints about phram--the chinese junk has landed

Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:18 pm

Green,

Check out "www.bobistheoilguy.com" where they regularly open filters. They regularly find Fram shortcuts and people have sent them in after failure for examination. They also have poor filtration media and smaller amounts of media. They stay on shelves with super high volume pricing and contracts with auto parts stores, clever marketing and a highly recognizable image color. Marketing 101 at its best.

DougM

Sat Mar 31, 2012 7:35 am

greenbus pilot wrote: OK, please someone, please post actual first- hand failure of a Fram filter. I , too have read rivers of Fram bashing, but yet not one single picture of a definitive failure of said Fram, on any vehicle, foreign or domestic.

Other than many exploded FRAM filters on race cars with high oil pressure (remember, no pressure relief valve), you can't really point to a motor and say "this fram filter done blowed up my motor". It doesn't work like that.

Fram filters lack a pressure relief valve, instead employing a piece of string tied around the filter media to keep it from expanding too much (no bull shit, cut open a new one). They also use very cheap internal parts (filter media, cap, glue, etc).

They are just cheaply made and filter poorly. You can't say they are the reason for a motor failing, but you can just assure yourself the extra dollar you spend on a better filter isn't a waste.

Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:01 am

insyncro wrote: FRAM is garbage and lacks the pressure relief valving needed for the waterboxer.
Not recommended :!:

I never thought that these would be or should be great filters but I have seen them on numerous Ferraris at various car shows I have been to over the years and always wondered why? Why would you put a Fram filter on a $30k or $40k engine? I assumed I must be missing something.

Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:04 am

Fram does not enjoy the best reputation.

Sat Mar 31, 2012 9:07 am

JoshG wrote: insyncro wrote: FRAM is garbage and lacks the pressure relief valving needed for the waterboxer.
Not recommended :!:

I never thought that these would be or should be great filters but I have seen them on numerous Ferraris at various car shows I have been to over the years and always wondered why? Why would you put a Fram filter on a $30k or $40k engine? I assumed I must be missing something.

Have you ever worked on a Ferrari?
I have, not impressed.
I'm a Porsche Guy :wink:

I wouldn't use a FRAM filter on my garden tractor.

Anyway, enough from me.
Use whatcha want.

Sat Mar 31, 2012 11:21 am

insyncro wrote: I wouldn't use a FRAM filter on my garden tractor.

Yikes :shock: !!!

I've been using stubby Fram oil filters on my subie convers now for a while. Maybe I better switch over to Napa Gold or Purolator fast ?

Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:01 pm

Subaru specifies a high bypass pressure (23psi). Very few aftermarket filters meet this specification. Filters are pretty reasonable from the dealer, so we only use Subaru oil filters at the shop. Funny thing the recent blue filter from the dealer is made by Honeywell (fram), but to subaru specifications, unlike the orange ones.

-Dan

Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:08 pm

I use wix, pretty happy with them.

Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:35 pm

Here's my real world Fram experience, 84 GTi, I bought it new. Once out of warranty I change the oil, install Fram - the orange thing I have always used on all my vehicles.

GTi's have an oil temp gage. Oil temp goes very, very high. Hmmm, ask my local foreign car flaps what could possibly cause high oil temps?. He gets a German oil filter, says "Try this". I could not envision at the time that it could make a difference. I unscrew the Fram, install the German filter, top off oil. Oil temps back down to normal.

Enough for me - never ran Fram again - on anything. Not based on any internet posting, testing, just my actual experience. Most cars do not have an oil temp gauge. I wonder how much life these filters have sucked out numerous engines?

Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:54 pm

Just so people know, the right Wix filter for the 1.9, at least, and I think the 2.1, is:

51342

I think the Napa Gold number is just 1342. Rock Auto sells those at a pretty good price. I don't think they're dramatically better than the Mann/Mahle filters our dedicated suppliers sell, but I do think they're better than the BASIC Fram or the Purolators, and, hey, they're American-made and obtainable. Winston's been very happy with the Wix filters I've used on him.

Best!

Sat Mar 31, 2012 3:54 pm

a LOT.

Sat Mar 31, 2012 8:10 pm

Ok I just checked one of the Mahle OC-28 filters I have left (I do not have any Mann filters left) and it does not have an anti-drain back valve. That maybe the reason it took a while for oil pressure to build up when starting and may be the reason why the oil pressure was low at operating temperature. Other discussion forums confirm the lack of proper valving on the filters. Again, if I did not have an oil pressure gauge I would not have known there was anything amiss. Now I do not have an issue with hydraulic lifters pumping up or hear other rattles after sitting for a few days. Also my oil pressure shoots straight up on start up instead of taking a few seconds. If you look over on the Bay forum there are threads that confirm these observations.

Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:03 pm

WestyBob wrote: insyncro wrote: I wouldn't use a FRAM filter on my garden tractor.

Yikes :shock: !!!

I've been using stubby Fram oil filters on my subie convers now for a while. Maybe I better switch over to Napa Gold or Purolator fast ?

I order Subaru filters for both van and car from www.1stsubaruparts.com. OEM filters and cheaper than Fram too. :(

Sun Jun 10, 2012 11:06 am

The installation of a Mann filter (replacing a no-name one from the quickie lube (WIFE)) on our 240k 90 Carat solved the Death Buzzer Syndrome, and noisy lifters.

I had been fighting this for some time, changed oil 3x, etc, and the solution was that simple. Trying to limp this thing as long as possible.

Sun Jun 10, 2012 7:09 pm

I have been reading this thread with interest. Could someone please advise what is the correct model / part number for the WIX filter to fit my 1989 2.1 waterboxer. Regards Phil

Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:17 pm

Luckyphil wrote: I have been reading this thread with interest. Could someone please advise what is the correct model / part number for the WIX filter to fit my 1989 2.1 waterboxer. Regards Phil

I believe it's 51342.

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/index.asp

Sun Jun 10, 2012 8:31 pm

Thank you very much. I will use and see if any difference.