TheSamba.com :: View topic - Subaru Radiator in a Vanagon

Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:09 am

Was contemplating new projects the other day and was wondering if anybody with a suby motor has attempted putting in a Subaru radiator, electric fans, and expansion tank into a Vanagon? Theoretically, this would simplify the cooling system in general and get rid of the pressure tank and all of the associated plumbing and additions to the reversed manifold. Would require some adapter brackets for sure, but the benefit might be a cooling system that isn't "overcooled" by the large van radiator. Any thoughts?

Fri Nov 02, 2012 8:47 am

I have seen the dual fan SVX radiators retrofitted into SVX swap vans.

I don't think it simplifies anything, however.
As an example.. the reversed coolant manifold for Subarus is designed to move the main plumbing to a more manageable location.

I am not seeing where else the Subarau radiator makes the plumbing any less complicated than what is already there forward of the firewall. Its just two pipes running foward... and the heater lines. Those would remain regardless the radiator used.

You might want to ask this question on the Yahoo board...

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:14 am

There was the earnest young man who had a massive thread on his svx transplant that tragically melted the first time out. It was a sexy radiator as I recall, but didn't work out so well. :(

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:24 am

I would rather be overcooled than undercooled. Besides, the thermostat should keep the engine at temperature in normal situations. But if the radiator is incompatible and too small, there won't be enough surface area to dissipate the heat.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:24 am

Yikes! Well I'm not looking to reinvent the wheel, but I like pushing the envelope of what's conventionally accepted as "the way things are done". The biggest advantage of using the entire Subaru cooling system as I see it would be to eliminate the pressurized "burb tank" from the VW system in the engine bay and moving the expansion tank to the front. This would free up some space and simplify the plumbing of the whole system. The other advantage would be that the radiator would be properly sized for the engine.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:29 am

I thought I saw some pictures somewhere of someone who moved a coolant reservoir to the front to simplify the bleeding of the radiator. I cant remember where I saw it though. I think they may have even still had the wbx.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:30 am

I'm in the midst of a suby swap on an aircooled van.

I also wanted to put in a radiator with a cap on top because 1) it would be nice to fill the coolant from the highest location in the cooling system 2) I was going from aircooled, so I didn't already have a radiator in-hand, and 3) I also thought it would clean up the engine compartment to keep the coolant expansion tank by the radiator behind the grille.

A critical measurement when checking if a radiator will fit is the width between the structural members behind the front bumper support. The radiator has to slide up from below, and if the radiator is wider than the space behind the front bumper, it's not going in.

I made the mistake of snagging a radiator from a 97ish Dodge Caravan from a junkyard because there was enough room for it between the headlights and the hoses were both on the passenger side. Unfortunately, the Caravan radiator won't go in because it's too wide to slide in behind the front bumper support.

Even if it had fitted, I was worried it would be tricky to find radiator hoses to run coolant to the top radiator outlet in the tight space behind the nose of the van.

I'd think the Suby radiator would be even trickier because (IIRC) it has an outlet on the driver's side...how would you run the hose to the coolant lines running under the passenger-side floor? Cross the hose over in front of or behind the spare tire? Re-route one of the long coolant lines to the driver's side?

I ended up going with a Vanagon radiator...It bolts right in, has both water outlets on the bottom passenger corner, and resulted in fewer hassles...even though I need to make a Libby Bong to fill it up :-).

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:40 am

I reinvent the wheel all the time. I think you may be overthinking this one though. I am using the stock vanagon radiator, but am not using the pressure tank. The vanagon radiator is a reverse flow unit, when compared to most conventional radiators. Not that it makes a difference.

I see a lot of threads "problems bleeding" my cooling system. I wonder how often this needs to be done. Once the cooling system is bled, you are done. If you need to be repeatedly doing so, you have another problem and it is not related to the design.

Post some pictures once you have it installed.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:47 am

Not sure if I'm going to follow through with this one. Its just a thought exercise for now, taking the pulse to see if what I'm thinking of is in the realm of possibility. I'll have to do some measuring to see if its even feasible at this point.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:50 am

rsxsr wrote: I see a lot of threads "problems bleeding" my cooling system. I wonder how often this needs to be done. Once the cooling system is bled, you are done. If you need to be repeatedly doing so, you have another problem and it is not related to the design.

Post some pictures once you have it installed.
My system needs no bleeding (except on initial fill to be sure it is full) and tends to be self bleeding:

See thread with pictures: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=445880

Back OT, though, if you can fit the stock Suby radiator, then go for it.

The fact that I did not have to mess with the up front part of the van was a big time saver and worry eliminator for me. Buy a new radiator and be happy, I thought.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:15 am

In my experience the bleeding issues seem to have more to do with the engine than with the rest of the cooling system. With the original wbx there were often issues, on any long hot run there was steaming over, refilling, burping etc. with the JX diesel I can fill at the back a couple of times and it done. In two years have not opened the bleed screw on the radiator.
Just a thought.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 12:07 pm

The front mounted burp tank I believe was in badassdubs thread here:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...p;start=40

badassdubs wrote: Been kinda lazy the last few days. I put the radiator in tonight. The fill is in the front behind the grill. Easy access. Didn't feel like playing the "burp" game. Spent about 2 hours at the wreckers looking for a radiator that would work. Finally found one. Came out a dodge dakota with a 3.9L engine. Since mine is 4.3L, it should do the job. Expansion tank is from a volvo. I should be able to run the SA grill, seems to be enough clearance. Still need to build the lower brackets and powder coat everything.

Fan housing is little too long so trimming of the upper and lower fan housing is necessary.

1/4" on each end is all that is needed. Now it fits right in.

Bolted on a couple brackets.

And now the fan fits perfect.

Now I just need to finish the upper brackets, make the lower brackets and plumb it.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 12:10 pm

I have my local rad shop make me multi core units and I cool them with Zirgo fans.

Fri Nov 02, 2012 2:48 pm

denwood wrote: The front mounted burp tank I believe was in badassdubs thread here:
]

Yes, that is the one

Fri Nov 02, 2012 4:06 pm

I did the subie/aircooled conversion and was tempted to use the subie rad but opted to use one out of a Kia Sportage because the subie rad was a very tight fit, the Kia had more wiggle room. It fit in perfect, I also made brackets to use the vanagon fan/shroud and use an expansion tank up front.

However, i found that a capped rad still isn't the highest point in the cooling system (if you are also adding a heater core)...so I got creative with that and now I actually fill my system through the heater core (highest point in my system) with a few custom bleeders through the circuit...works like a charm.

I have over 17,000 kms on this set up with not one incident of overheating. Very pleased.

Good luck on your conversion!

Fri Nov 02, 2012 4:26 pm

Since the van has the drag coefficient of the side of a house compared to the donor car I see the bigger radiator as a plus.
Don't forget that the suby radiator is sized for a very short run to the motor.
Like already mentioned the front heater core is actually the high point in the cooling system.

Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:47 am

whafalia wrote: There was the earnest young man who had a massive thread on his svx transplant that tragically melted the first time out. It was a sexy radiator as I recall, but didn't work out so well. :(
Most heart-breaking thread I have ever read on the Samba :cry:

Like others have mentioned.. I have had no issues with the cooling system on my 89. I have flushed and refilled a half dozen times.

Filled it. Ran it. Let some air out of the front. Topped it off. Idled til it got hot.
Let it cool. Topped it off again.

That was the most I've ever had to do.
The self bleeding system on the 2.1 seems to work as designed.

Sat Nov 03, 2012 7:59 am

Having the overflow tank in the back with the engine makes way more sense maintenance-wise. I don't see any advantage in having to take the grille off to get to it.

Fri May 15, 2020 5:12 pm

I did it. In an Air-cooled conversion. everything juuuussst fits. still need to pipe it in and add the lower grill though at the moment. i modified subaru upper radiator brackets to hold it. had to cut off some of the plastic on the radiator to make putting the fans in easier. only pain about it will be i need to drop the spare tire and the radiator a couple inches so i will be able to fill it. i do not have a shop to fabricate brackets and such so i made do with that i had. I think it came out nice. hope my van runs after all this. it was a 2.5L conversion with rocky mountain westy kit ( which is the damn best!!!) everything is going together extremely well. I am very pleased with this kit and the guys at rocky mountain westy are the best!!! Especially Alex!! I started with a jdm 2.5L block, went to junkyard found intake, wire harness, and all other little bits from 2003 forester x.

Fri May 15, 2020 5:13 pm

I know im replying to a really old post, but i just want to answer that question for anybody interested.
Thanks