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Sat Jun 15, 2013 10:23 pm

To link to this thread
Code: [url=https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=559556&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=]Throttle Body Rebuild FAQ[/url]

Took the plunge and had the throttle body rebuilt.
Saw some pictures of the work whip618 did on Vanagon T/B's and asked if he would do a bay T/B. He said yes so here's a shameless plug for the quality of his work. He rebuilt the shaft, bored it out for a new butterfly valve, made new butterfly valve, new seals, and cleaned all parts and plated the hardware. Simply put, 38 years of wear have been reset to better than factory specs. I say better because I know the assembly line didn't take near the attention to detail Phil did.

Take a look at whip618's gallery for other work Phil has done and my gallery for addition pics of my T/B.

Before:

After:

Sat Jun 15, 2013 10:49 pm

Wicked! This guy's gonna be busy now. That is top notch work fo sho.

Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:42 am

Wow please PM me Phils contact info? I would love to have mine redone. If you can please include cost and how it performs on your bus.

Thnk you for posting this.

Sun Jun 16, 2013 8:12 am

i had phil rebuild mine too a ear or two ago:

super high quality work, and nice to know that the worn out TB and butterfly valve can no longer be the source of any idle problems.

Sun Jun 16, 2013 8:44 am

Did I miss Phil's contact info?? Would love to have mine done. Very nice quality work.

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:33 am

How did whip redo the top throttle shaft bushing/seal mount. The OG bushing is no longer available so a mod is necessary to seal the shaft. Did he resize the seal mount for a new available bushing/seal??

Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:12 am

How many megabux was it? Deep into three figures?

M

Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:23 am

Send him a PM.....he is a good guy and a great machinist, which is why he is always busy..

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=1316

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:14 am

Everything was touched and made better than new.
Your looking at around 3 bills, need to contact for specifics.
He is a top quality machinist who is tooled for and familar with building these.

Thu Aug 31, 2017 8:14 am

025 133 073 Throttle Body to Intake Plenum Seal
022 133 069 Throttle Body Shaft Seal

whip618 wrote: You are probably suffering from a worn throttle body. VW did a poor job of design on these throttle bodies and as result they wear to the point of a sticky throttle at best and to an uncontrollable idle with very poor drive-ability at worst.

The throttle shaft and throttle plate being unsupported in the vertical position will actually wear into each other causing the excess gap between the throttle plate and bore of the throttle body with no way to really repair it without exchanging it for one with less wear or going to complete new re-machined throttle body that will not wear out.

This is photo of a 2.1 water cooled throttle body that has been back lit to emphasize the gap between throttle plate and throttle bore

This image is of a re-machined air-cooled throttle body, for proper operation you would want yours to look more like this.

whip618 wrote: To help put a little finer point on what busdaddy said about the throttle binding when the idle screw has been turned in to far I have included a picture that shows the wear that occurs in the throttle bore from the throttle plate opening and closing while rubbing on the bottom of the throttle bore.

With this amount of wear it is easy to visualize the air gap that would be present at the top of the throttle plate when in the idle position so if the idle air screw were turned in until it almost touched the throttle plate in this position it would certainly bind the throttle because the throttle plate in order to turn must first climb up out of this groove which sometimes are as much .030 deep so in that upward climb it would bind against the air screw.

on my rebuilds I machine the bore and the throttle plate to a radial clearance of.0015 so with the throttle shaft locked in the vertical position this produces a very stable idle that will not change over time.

Phil

whip618 wrote: Steve, I have quit a few of these seals in good used condition if you need some.

I remove these on the 2.1 throttle body's that I rebuild and replace them with an inch equivalent seal except that the OD is several thousandths over and I have to bore the throttle body anyway for a bearing so I just open up the seal counterbore at the same time so they are concentric
Phil

Throttle Body Shaft Seal

djkeev wrote:
Here you go, perfect fit!

Harwal (That's why I included the package in the photo, company ID and item description)
This office was in Vermont but they have others. You do need to purchase from a distributor.
In my case it was Motion Industries in Teterboro NJ.
Harwal will tell you who is nearby if you call them.
The OG VW/Audi product is single lipped too.
Fact is......
These are better, a single lip with a shaft tensioning spring.

Dave

Thrasher22 wrote: Direct link to the product: http://harwal.com/product/15257
I can't find it listed on the Motion Industries website
EDIT: This looks like what we need.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Metric-Oil-Shaft-Seal-7-x-...258324100f

Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:24 pm

Phil is building me a new TB now. I can't control my idle consistently from one minute to the next. I've never separated the Tab from the intake. Is it really as simple as disconnect the cable, unscrew the two Phillips heads and remove it from the car?
When reinstalling, just put the seal on screw it in, and reconnect the cables?
I'm sure I'm missing something - any words of wisdom before I tackle the project?

Tue Sep 05, 2017 5:45 pm

obnoxiousblue wrote: Phil is building me a new TB now. I can't control my idle consistently from one minute to the next. I've never separated the Tab from the intake. Is it really as simple as disconnect the cable, unscrew the two Phillips heads and remove it from the car?
When reinstalling, just put the seal on screw it in, and reconnect the cables?
I'm sure I'm missing something - any words of wisdom before I tackle the project?

Pretty much!

I get much better results with the TB fitted seal/o-ring by carefully putting a VERY thin smear of high temp, oil proof RTV like permatex ultra.....on the tB side of the seal. Mount it up to the TB. Use something that will hold the seal in exact position until the RTV is conpletely cured.

I'm lucky....I have several plenums. I bolt the TB to a spare plenum to dry. I carefully open the plate and clean up any little bit of RTV that squeezes out.

Then carefully clean the plenum opening so its smooth. Repaint if necessary.

Then install the TB. Much better seal positioning. Ray

Tue Sep 05, 2017 5:51 pm

Great thanks Ray! I'm thinking since I dont have a spare plenum I could probably use something just to secure it in place.

Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:03 pm

obnoxiousblue wrote: Great thanks Ray! I'm thinking since I dont have a spare plenum I could probably use something just to secure it in place.

The late seal kind of has a stepped/ribbed OD.

Anything cone shaped with a,weight,will do to put in the center to hold it in contact. Ray

Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:06 pm

So while I can't yet confirm it is THE problem, I'm certain that the play in my Tab is A problem. A friend let me play with his and it didn't move around like mine did. The rebuilt one is on its way from Phil.
Is there anything special to the install here, or is it really as easy as the two screws and the cable? Any settings or anything that need to be adjusted beyond the obvious idle screw?

Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:42 pm

No, the 2 screws and the cable adjustment along with any attached vacuum lines is all there is, and reinstalling the S boot and an idle adjustment of course.

obnoxiousblue wrote: A friend let me play with his and it didn't move around like mine did.
You really should proof read your posts, that statement leaves you wide open for many potential derails :wink: :P

Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:13 pm

busdaddy wrote: No, the 2 screws and the cable adjustment along with any attached vacuum lines is all there is, and reinstalling the S boot and an idle adjustment of course.

obnoxiousblue wrote: A friend let me play with his and it didn't move around like mine did.
You really should proof read your posts, that statement leaves you wide open for many potential derails :wink: :P

Sounds like a technique issue......or lack of lubricant......just sayin.... :lol:

Ray

Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:55 am

Karl wrote: What is still available is the late Vanagon gasket, 025 133 073. It
looks very similar in size and shape with the only differences I can
see being that it has more ribs along the circumference and the 3
small cutouts at the perimeter are missing.

022 133 073A 2L Type 2 76-79, Vanagon 80-85
025 133 073 Vanagon 86-up

Wed Aug 24, 2022 10:44 am

Reviving an old thread, as my bus is also suffering from a worn throttle body and needs a rebuilt unit. I reached out to Phil but he is no longer doing this work.

Anyone have recommendations for where I could get a rebuilt throttle body, or have mine rebuilt?

Thanks!

Wed Aug 24, 2022 3:47 pm

Try Tim at Volkzblitz
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=451227&postorder=desc