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Sat Mar 29, 2014 6:28 pm

I can only go about 45 miles before I run out of gas
I just filled it to the brim went to pick up my kid thirty miles away, got half way back and ran out
I know part of it is I got an 002 bus tranny and it's winding out at 50mph, but maybe it's running super rich? Or maybe the angle of the gas tank under the front hood is weird and it's not using the whole tank

I need to fix it somehow

Sat Mar 29, 2014 6:50 pm

You need to verify if the tank is emptying past the pick up of if you are leaking fuel somewhere. IF the engine was using 8 gallons of gas in 45 miles it would be running out the tail pipe. When you open the ccap is it hard to remove the cap due to vacum in the tank?

brad

Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:15 pm

slalombuggy wrote: You need to verify if the tank is emptying past the pick up of if you are leaking fuel somewhere. IF the engine was using 8 gallons of gas in 45 miles it would be running out the tail pipe. When you open the ccap is it hard to remove the cap due to vacum in the tank?

brad

no, actually pressure shot out of the tank when I opened the cap

so here's the deal... when I ran out a guy towing a sand rail stopped and gave me four 16oz bottles of fuel from his rail and I made it 9 miles on that just cruising slowly before it ran out. That's a half a gallon so I'm at least getting 18mpg.

I had cell phone service at that point so my kid came with 2 1/2 gallons. I just went to the gas station and filled it to the brim with 2 1/2 gallons more

So I'm only getting five gallons of usable fuel from my stock pre 67 gas tank
How much does the tank hold?

Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:28 pm

Should be close to 10 gallons. Sounds like the outlet of the tank isn't in the right place and you're going dry, or, more likely, it (the tank) isn't vented and the engine simply can't pull any more gas due to the vacuum. Since you said that "pressure shot out", that would be my first suggestion - vent the tank.

Sat Mar 29, 2014 7:35 pm

Letterman7 wrote: Should be close to 10 gallons. Sounds like the outlet of the tank isn't in the right place and you're going dry, or, more likely, it (the tank) isn't vented and the engine simply can't pull any more gas due to the vacuum. Since you said that "pressure shot out", that would be my first suggestion - vent the tank.
I used to have a vented "Thing" cap that was so vented it leaked fuel everywhere and it still ran out after about 45 miles
I just swapped it out for a non vented cap to stop the gas mess all over the hood

Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:45 am

Something is def wrong here. We have an 8gal tank and regularly drive 2-1/2 hours and our longest stretch to date was 202 miles.

I should be worried that you have some sort of leak somewhere.

Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:05 am

Sounds like your tank is at a piss poor angle. VW tanks.. hold about 10 gallons stock. My car uses a pre 68 tank with the exposed neck at the LF corner. I can only squeeze 8.5(ish) gallons in mine as its lowered and the tank platform is also raked. Makes it have a large air pocket. I can still drive and make it an easy 150-175 miles.

Of course large engines... heavy foot... = higher fuel consumption.
5 gallons at 45 miles is 9 miles per gallon..
If you drive normally...and If its that rich... you'd know it by black smoke, constant fouled plugs, possible hydro-locking.

If you are doggin' it around.. its going to suck fuel..

Check your oil level.. be sure.. its not heading into the crank case..

and..

VOLKSWAGNUT wrote: VOLKSWAGNUT wrote:
I cleared a fuel line blockage on a 67 Vert once with a cable and pliers. Here was the kicker after the car was complete and on the road for a few weeks, it began having a problem with what I thought was heat vapor locking. It would sputter to a stop. I'd crank it over a few times and it would restart. Drive for a few days same thing. After about a month I noticed a wet spot at the pedals. Checked it out and it was GAS!!!. Pulled my shift rod coupler cover and GAS WAS FLOATING around in the tunnel. I always had driven with the top down and never smelled any "excessive" raw gas. I drained about 2 gallons of fuel out of the tunnel, and the only evidience was a little wet spot at the pedals.

Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:25 am

StevieC wrote: slalombuggy wrote: You need to verify if the tank is emptying past the pick up of if you are leaking fuel somewhere. IF the engine was using 8 gallons of gas in 45 miles it would be running out the tail pipe. When you open the ccap is it hard to remove the cap due to vacum in the tank?

brad

no, actually pressure shot out of the tank when I opened the cap

so here's the deal... when I ran out a guy towing a sand rail stopped and gave me four 16oz bottles of fuel from his rail and I made it 9 miles on that just cruising slowly before it ran out. That's a half a gallon so I'm at least getting 18mpg.

I had cell phone service at that point so my kid came with 2 1/2 gallons. I just went to the gas station and filled it to the brim with 2 1/2 gallons more

So I'm only getting five gallons of usable fuel from my stock pre 67 gas tank
How much does the tank hold?

Book says pre 69 tank is 10.5 gallons capacity for type 1 vehicles...

Check tank angle... Look under buggy hood area and see what angle tank is mounted at and where fuel out let is in relationship to lowest point of tank....Most tanks mounted in buggy bodies have a increased angle over angle it would be in stock beetle putting tank outlet above actual lowest point in tank...

Believe you have serious problem with either fuel outlet location or capacity of tank.... You should be getting at least 18 to 20 MPG even with your transaxle/engine combination... Should have about a 200 mile range....

Dale

Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:32 am

I ran a 1915 with a W120 and single progressive carb in college. That engine only managed 10.5 miles per gallon. I put a little over 100,000 miles on it by graduation. Did not foul plugs, just a touch of black out the exhaust.

I would get 105 miles out of a tank and my round trip to college and back home was 102 miles.

Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:40 am

I guess the next question is..
Is it a stock engine or some hot rod..

If this is a stock displacement and induction engine... something is wrong..or someone drives like the throttle is a toggle switch.

.

Sun Mar 30, 2014 7:29 am

If the gas tank is actually empty, Check your engine oil level for overfull to see if the fuel pump is leaking into the crankcase. You will take out a set of bearing pretty quick if the oil is diluted with gas. That much fuel has to be leaking internally or burning, but even burning it, a good deal will be washing the cylinders into the case

Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:57 am

Ditto what others have said about the tank angle. I have a mid sixties style tank in mine, and I relocated the filler so it's in the center of the hood. The tank sits in a nose down attitude, so I ended up having a large pocket of air in the part past the filler instead of gas. This reduces the fillable capacity to about 8 gallons.

I ran out of gas shortly after building the buggy and discovering that the gas gauge is a liar. :lol: When the engine would no longer run, I could tell that there was still gas in the tank. The pickup tube sticks up into the tank a little ways, probably so it wouldn't clog up if debris accumulates. I opted to cut the tube down so I could get more fuel out of each tank. I keep an eye on it (I can see the pickup tube if I shine a light down the filler), and that has helped. Still, I can only get a max of about 140 miles per tank in normal use.

One of the other issues I have is with the vent. The vent is in the neck of the filler. I attached a piece of vent line to it, made a few loops, then directed it down to the lip of the pan. If I fill the tank and do not drive right away, the heat from the sunlight on the hood heats up the tank, making it expand and gas will RUN out of the vent line.

Aren't all these little issues fun?

Lee

Sun Mar 30, 2014 9:23 am

Thanks for all the replies
I checked the oil level it's fine
Here's a photo of the gas tank angle

Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:07 am

Wow.. that's raked quite a bit... more than mine.
Explains at least some of the low fueling level capabilities issue, especially if it has the turtle neck 67 and older tank.

if your current pick up tube has any kind of straight extension you wont get much fuel at all out of there. Chop it shorter if it is, but not too short.

You would benefit from a relocated fuel neck to the center, or 68 and newer tank with filling at the right rear.. to be able to fill more..but
You're still not going to get all the fuel out.. unless you relocate the pick up or modify a tube inside to swim in the deep end.
Of course... these would mean mods..

Option.. create an internal flex tube from the internal pick up spout to lay in the lowest point.
With that tank angle though it almost has a double hump tank..

Easier solution.. lower the rear and raise the front of the car.... :lol:

Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:17 am

thanks, I just took two inches of preload height off the front coil overs because it was too harsh

That would explain why I ran out of gas faster than ever.

If I put a tube on the fuel pick up and ran it to the low front of the tank will the pump have a problem sucking it up over the hump?

Also if I put a 68-70 tank in there will the filler spout be in the same place so I don't have to drill another hole in the hood where the gas cap is?

Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:23 am

Yes the pump will pick up from over the hump in the deep end after adding an extension, but you are still only going to be able to fill the tank until it reaches the bottom of the fill neck..

Yes the 68 and later tanks do not have a fuel cap, as the actual cap is behind a door on the body on the RF quarter.

So yes.. if you were to swap tanks.. = more holes opened up and a remote mounted fuel filler.

Some have flipped the 61-67 tanks backwards and had the neck through the body up higher and right.

Sun Mar 30, 2014 10:35 am

OK I'm getting it, even though I'm filling the spout to the brim, the angle of the tank is leaving an open space in the tank that's not getting filled

So the pickup location is only part of the problem and probably not the biggest problem

I'm a little slow, but I get there eventually :D

thanks man!

Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:35 am

In essence fuel filler should be at highest point in tank... But if it complicates body/beauty options you are kind of stuck with situation...

Fuel outlet should be at lowest point in tank.... This one is easy just a lot of work.... Mark lowest point of tank... Remove tank from buggy add new fuel outlet at lowest point... Re-install tank.... Yes its the right way to do it.... Trying to add any tubing or silly "patches" inside tank will probably only lead to failure in near future...

This is image of fuel outlet... The portion on right side of disk welded to tube sticks up into tank, it is also part of your "capacity" problem as it raises unusable fuel level in tank.... You can cut most of it off.....

Dale

Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:53 am

Dale M. wrote: I... Trying to add any tubing or silly "patches" inside tank will probably only lead to failure in near future...
Dale

Every heard of R&D there Dale?

Lot of work to remove a tank and slice in a new pick up on a "maybe". Its really only going to pick up a possible 1 1/2 more gallons.

A flex extension inside the tank will work well using the proper material... even if its a"silly patch"... :roll:

There are plenty of modern cars rolling around with flex tubing inside the tank.

Sun Mar 30, 2014 11:53 am

Dale M. wrote: In essence fuel filler should be at highest point in tank... But if it complicates body/beauty options you are kind of stuck with situation...

Fuel outlet should be at lowest point in tank.... This one is easy just a lot of work.... Mark lowest point of tank... Remove tank from buggy add new fuel outlet at lowest point... Re-install tank.... Yes its the right way to do it.... Trying to add any tubing or silly "patches" inside tank will probably only lead to failure in near future...

This is image of fuel outlet... The portion on right side of disk welded to tube sticks up into tank, it is also part of your "capacity" problem as it raises unusable fuel level in tank.... You can cut most of it off.....

Dale

So I would need to cap off the existing pickup tube and get one of those and put it on the front downward hump

this problem is going to be exasperated, I just ordered 33" tires for the back and putting my 30's on the front, the combination is going to result in a little more incline

When I got the buggy the front was at least three inches higher than the rear and now I see why