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  View original topic: Lizard Skin Sprayable Sound Deadener and Thermal Insulation Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
insyncro Sat Sep 06, 2014 9:22 am

As many will find out, masking products are not cheap and when you start layering multiple products and building up, having a plan for masking and how to cut clean lines can present a few issues.

Here, TuffR is being used to keep my spray inside the vehicle with the widows out and helps create a clean break between interior and exterior products.
The panels can be flipped around to the inside when working on the exterior of the van.






thatvwbusguy Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:32 pm

I would trust any product that Dylan recommends here without a second thought. Doing solid research and going the extra mile to do things way better than original is Dylan's trademark. If I had funds to allow it, my van would be on the waiting list for the Insyncro treatment.

shizzon Tue Sep 23, 2014 10:02 pm

How long does this stuff take to offgass? Mine has been smelly for several weeks now.

Other than that, it works great!!! Amazing sound dampening and thermal properties!

0cean Tue Sep 23, 2014 10:18 pm

shizzon wrote: It works great!!! Amazing sound dampening and thermal properties!

Could you tell a little more about the Thermal protection? Is it worth spending the extra $$$ and time? What areas have you used it on?

shizzon Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:35 am

0cean wrote: shizzon wrote: It works great!!! Amazing sound dampening and thermal properties!

Could you tell a little more about the Thermal protection? Is it worth spending the extra $$$ and time? What areas have you used it on?

Yes, it's worth the time and $$. The vast majority of the work on this project is removing the interior and masking everything off. it's almost no extra time to spray on the CI product.

insyncro Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:39 am

I would say two days at my shop, in the full sun and with fans moving the air, dries and cures the products well without any more smell.

I spray LineX over some of the sound/thermal products and it takes about a week for the lingering smell to diminish.

Yes, worth every penny and time spent.

shizzon Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:41 am

insyncro wrote: I would say two days at my shop, in the full sun and with fans moving the air, dries and cures the products well without any more smell.

I spray LineX over some of the sound/thermal products and it takes about a week for the lingering smell to diminish.

Yes, worth every penny and time spent.

Wow, I wonder if i sprayed it too thickly or something? Mine still smells pretty strongly, several weeks on... granted, i haven't had it in full sun with fans, etc...

insyncro Wed Sep 24, 2014 7:45 am

I spray multiple layers to allow each to set and start to dry before layering up.

This is how I paint as well.

Wet coats take forever to completely cure.

Playing around with the atomization helps too.
I spray at higher pressures with less product dialed in at the nozzle.
The texture is very fine as I prefer it that way.

UV light is your friend...get it exposed to sunlight and keep the air moving around it.

chazz79 Wed Sep 24, 2014 11:46 am

This has the ability to make a solid air barrier as sprayed. I'd bet if you just heat shrunk a vapor barrier over the interior voids you'd have a van with a higher r-value than the standard westy with its fiberglass.

I'm not a believer on the ceramics keeping the heat out but I do know this is high build and seals out drafts beautifully. The noise reduction is real too. Capture the air pocket and I think you're really be on to something here.

Merian Wed Sep 24, 2014 3:55 pm

not sure I understand you chazz - "air pocket" usually refers to something macroscopic in size, and that means air will move inside the pocket, rapidly transferring heat

tiny air bubbles insulate well if they are so small that heat has to move across the air bubble by conduction, not convection - e.g the foam in a wet suit, gaps in home insulation, down etc.

ceramics insulate in the same manner - tiny air bubbles where the air cannot move in the small space; some ceramics use hollow spheres - micro-spheres or today, nano-spheres

insyncro Sat Sep 27, 2014 9:24 am



Here I am testing a new structural foam product on the rear door supports.
The sound deadener was applied right over the foam.
The supplier's of both products assured me that they will work well together and they do.

SyncroScott Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:24 am

So I think I'm finally going to bite the bullet and get a kit of the Lizard Skin; thanks again for the great write-up!

Two questions:

1) How do you sound insulate your front doors? What methods/products do you prefer or is it really too much hassle to worry about them?

2) How strong are the fumes when spraying? I have a good mask for me but the heated garage I have access to does not have ventilation which might end this project before it starts.

Thanks!

SyncroScott Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:24 am

So I think I'm finally going to bite the bullet and get a kit of the Lizard Skin; thanks again for the great write-up!

Two questions:

1) How do you sound insulate your front doors? What methods/products do you prefer or is it really too much hassle to worry about them?

2) How strong are the fumes when spraying? I have a good mask for me but the heated garage I have access to does not have ventilation which might end this project before it starts.

Thanks!

insyncro Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:47 am

I have made a spray tool with a flexible wand to be able to get into tight spots like the front doors.
These products can be rolled or brushed if needed.

The fumes are not that bad, but I spray all sorts of coatings and wear a 3M full face respirator for all of them to be safe.

I am pairing Lizard Skin applications with Roxul insulation installation to fill all large gasps between the outer panels and the inner panels.

Roxul Comfort Batts is the product name.

SyncroScott Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:29 am

Rolled, you say? You said the magic word, phew!

You read my mind regarding mentioning the insulation! I had been searching around for good product like that.

Thanks!

Just read MSDS for it and seems pretty harmless but I'll be sure to wear my usual respirator mask just to avoid the reported ammonia smell and particulates.

flomulgator Mon Nov 10, 2014 12:38 pm

Any experience with Al's Liner Heat & Noise Reducer? It has the same "ceramic microspheres" mentioned in the Lizard Skin products. While it would be nice to just repeat the steps shown on page one with Lizard Skin, I'm interested in this as an affordable alternative (60% cheaper by volume).

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005Y14Q96/ref=wl_it_dp_o...OF7VT8S3NS

Merian Mon Nov 10, 2014 6:12 pm

maybe it has 60% more water by volume??

OTOH, some big chemical co. is making that stuff for the retailers

OTO,OH it is likely made to a spec. the larger, more savy retailers provide

would you rather take a chance or use a product known to work well? how much of a risk premium is worth it?

flomulgator Mon Nov 10, 2014 6:29 pm

As I said I'd love to just buy the lizard skin and follow Insycro's lead to a T. However, my aggregate costs are too high right now and I simply cannot afford the product. For other reasons, I have my Westy stripped to the level necessary to apply something, a rare opportunity. Thus the question if anyone has experience with this alternative product. Sometimes cheaper is cheaper and sometimes products are reasonably similar with wildly different costs.

dkoesyncro Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:33 pm

I googled alternative to "lizrd skn snd dedn" and found some folks restoring early GM's and using an industrial latex paint and a product used for filling defects in plastic model planes found at most hobby shops. The folks claimed that it worked well. They were able to brush and roll the product with ease.

Merian Mon Nov 10, 2014 8:08 pm

the problem is that you have to measure not just go by your experience (which is subject to pretty strong placebo effect)

and to measure properly is something an engineer does

all I can tell you is maybe compare the MSDS sheets on both products, or be like a crawfish and back on out - see if a dampener + MLV floated on foam would be cheaper

or... the cheaper product is likely to provide some benefit, even if not up to the more expensive one



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