TheSamba.com :: View topic - Propane Manual Bleeder Valve: Open or Closed Diff at fill ?

Fri May 09, 2014 5:28 am

I purchased my TK replacement Manual Fill and bleeder valve. I finally made it out to the only place around that fills propane to get it filled.

I mentioned to the guy about the manual bleeder and he said it didn't need to be opened because the system would stop when filled automatically.

I stood far back and let him at it.

This is in Canada and it took $7.90 worth of propane May 1st in GTA so:

1. I wonder what the difference is with opening or keeping closed that bleeder ?

2. I plan to use a non OPD tank and adapter at home to fill in the future and I'm thinking I SHOULD have it open to prevent overfill. Is this an accurate statement ?

I won't want a BBQ.

BTW, I had really bad luck with the Teflon paste vs the proper orange gas thread tape.

I managed 100% of slow leaks with the paste and 100% success with the proper orange tape on all my non tapered connections (don't use any on those ones).

I'm not sure the secret but I do have to redo my fill and bleeder valve for a really slow leak once I finish off the tank. It didn't even bubble when I tested it at first but developed after a day or so.

For now it is parked away from the garage and running my fridge for the last week ;) My temp beer fridge.

Fri May 09, 2014 7:27 am

From what I know, if you don't have one of the auto-close fill valves then you probably have the same setup that most are running and the bleeder needs to be open during the fill. I'm pretty sure that you wouldn't have a manual bleeder if you had the auto-stop fill valve anyway since the auto valve uses the spot where the manual bleeder is mounted.

Also as I understand it, the manual bleeder is screwed into a hole that has a pipe on it internally that runs down to the proper max-fill level inside the tank. You open that manual bleeder just a touch and then commence with filling the tank. As soon as the propane starts to fog out of the bleeder you shut off the fill feed (typically on the hose first then the pump) and then close the bleeder quickly. You don't leave the bleeder open long as it could freeze up due to the cold. You wear gloves or are very quick/careful as you can burn yourself easily with the evaporating propane that is very cold both at the fill attachment and the bleeder valve. There are a few tricks to avoiding freeze-ups like being quick at removing the fill feed vs letting the gas downstream of the shut-off seep out for a long time, etc.

If you don't open the manual bleeder the lpg could easily overfill the tank. If pushed far enough the pressure-relief valve on the tank could open either at some point during the filling or later when the tank heats up (park on asphault in hot sun) etc. I'm not sure if the fill pump is high enough pressure to trigger the overfill valve but do know that sun/heat/altitude changes or some combination of these can cause bleed off.

I've filled the auto-close tanks a few times and the manual plenty of times and have also had others do the filling. My preference is to offer to run the fill hose/etc. while the propane guy manages the pump. Not many folks let you do that but the ones that do I will return to. It's easier for both of us as they don't have to get onto the ground and fiddle around and I know things are done right. I've had guys not open the manual bleeder and as a result overfill the tanks. It was scary the first time I got out of my van on a hot day and heard the tanks bleeding off as it seemed like a risk if a smoker had driven by and tossed a lit cigarrette my way/etc.

Hope that helps with whatever you were trying to figure out..

Jonathan

Fri May 09, 2014 8:53 am

I have run into that before. Same setup, but different fill stations and attendants. When I get a fill, I try to be involved as much as possible without being a pain in the butt. I even carry a rug to throw down. The times I have gotten a fill using their equipment to determine when the tank is full seem to match what I am expecting to purchase.

So, either way I have not had a problem so far. The more fills you get, the more comfortable you will get. I always give the attendant $5 as a tip. Figure it is for the next VW he needs to fill.

Fri May 09, 2014 10:23 am

The 80% valve, or bleeder valve MUST BE OPEN TO FILL THE TANK--PERIOD.

Now, you found Manyard G. Krebs of propaneland that obviously doesn't know which end of the hose from the other to connect.

It's a another common sense issue here Mom's & Dad's, Boy's & Girls.

The manual fill valve & bleeder has been around eons prior to some madman coming up with that Autostop Fill valve that failed.
Most propane attendants don't have a clue what in the hell that gizmo is---and 9 times outa ten , usually can't get the tank full hooking up to it--or won't hook up to it because it simply looks strange.

So, in reality, if this fool didn't known how to use a tried & true, easy to use, been around for 100 years, manual fill & bleeder valve, I'd report him & the place he's working at to the department of transportation, the EPA, the FBI, RCMP, KGB & the Gestapo for being dangerous to public health & well being.

Don't go back to see this idiot, he for sure doesn't belong in a propane filling station.

If for some wild reason , you couldn't get the fill valve or bleeder to seal using TEFLON Paste--I'd have to think you didn very little tanks threads prior to screwing them in---or you didn't tighten them up enough.
DO NOT USE TEFLON TAPE!
Not unless you want to be tearing into the stove jets or refrigerator jet to clean out that piece of tape that broke off & was floating around inside of that tank--

Fri May 09, 2014 10:55 am

Terry Kay wrote: The 80% valve, or bleeder valve MUST BE OPEN TO FILL THE TANK--PERIOD.

Now, you found Manyard G Krebs of propane land that doesn't know which end of the hose to connect.

It's a another common sense issue here Mom's & Dad's, Boy's & Girls.

The manual fill valve & bleeder has been around eons prior to some madman coming up with that Autostop Fill valve that failed.
Most propane attendants don't have a clue what in the hell that gizmo is---and 9 times outa ten , usually can't get the tank full hooking up to it--or won't hook up to it because it simply looks strange.

So, in reality, if this fool didn't known how to use a tried & true, easy to use, been around for 100 years, manual fill & bleeder valve, I'd report him & the place he's working at to the department of transportation, the EPA, the FBI, RCMP, KGB & the Gestapo for being dangerous to public health & well being.

Don't go back to see this idiot, he for sure doesn't belong in a propane filling station.

Terry you sound like your are feeling your old self again. Glad to read it. When we travel, we don't spend all day looking for a propane fill. We leave with a full tank and after a week of constant use, I start to keep my eyes open for a place to get a fill. Most places aren't filling tanks all day long. I'd say as long as it is not overfilled and they are not introducing moisture or air into the system and charging only for what they put in. What is the problem really?

I hope you were joking about getting the attendant fired over this.

Fri May 09, 2014 10:55 am

Terry Kay wrote: The 80% valve, or bleeder valve MUST BE OPEN TO FILL THE TANK--PERIOD.

Now, you found Manyard G Krebs of propane land that doesn't know which end of the hose to connect.

It's a another common sense issue here Mom's & Dad's, Boy's & Girls.

The manual fill valve & bleeder has been around eons prior to some madman coming up with that Autostop Fill valve that failed.
Most propane attendants don't have a clue what in the hell that gizmo is---and 9 times outa ten , usually can't get the tank full hooking up to it--or won't hook up to it because it simply looks strange.

So, in reality, if this fool didn't known how to use a tried & true, easy to use, been around for 100 years, manual fill & bleeder valve, I'd report him & the place he's working at to the department of transportation, the EPA, the FBI, RCMP, KGB & the Gestapo for being dangerous to public health & well being.

Don't go back to see this idiot, he for sure doesn't belong in a propane filling station.

Terry you sound like your are feeling your old self again. Glad to read it. When we travel, we don't spend all day looking for a propane fill. We leave with a full tank and after a week of constant use, I start to keep my eyes open for a place to get a fill. Most places aren't filling tanks all day long. I'd say as long as it is not overfilled and they are not introducing moisture or air into the system and charging only for what they put in. What is the problem really?

I hope you were joking about getting the attendant fired over this.

Fri May 09, 2014 11:06 am

I for sure don't think that any idiot that dosen't know how to do the job he was hired to perform should be replaced.

I wouldn't want him working for me--maybe you'd want him working for you.

And then dispensing a hazzadous materials--yea--I want him doing that job--

Dairy Queen, Or Walmart --maybe he could handle that operation.

I feel lke crap today-thanks for asking.

Fri May 09, 2014 11:26 am

I work alone thank you. If I were getting a fill at a propane depot that was their only business, I would expect a certain level of ability. Most of my fills are at hardware stores in tiny towns off the highway, Flying J truck stops, etc. The same attendants that are paged to handle propane refills probably, mop the floors, clean the bathrooms, stock shelves, take out the trash, and man the cash register. We are not talking about employees with CETP Certificates.

Sorry you feel like crap today. mark

Fri May 09, 2014 11:53 am

If Danny Dweeb has zero skills & the ability to do the same job the same way more than once, yea I'd fire his ass in answer to your first question.

And if he doesn't have the brain's to open up the 80 % valve prior to filling the tank, should be shot.

The owner of the vehicle obviously doesn't know, one would assume that the guy doing the loading should -—ya think?-
If not run like crazy from the Green Acres Propane Fill Joint--WFO.