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  View original topic: Uninstalled Johnny Johnson No Hop Kit
BL3Manx Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:27 pm

I was wondering if anyone might have an uninstalled upright JJR No Hop Kit (like in picture below) that they might be willing to make some tracings and get some dimensions from. Joe Wheeler has already kindly offered to remove part of his kit from his Baja but he's also very busy getting ready for a cross country trip in his Manx.

I could probably get pretty close looking at pictures already posted on here and taking dimensions from a torsion housing and an RGB assembly and trying to reverse engineer it but actual traced outlines of the flat parts with a few critical dimensions would make it a lot easier.

If I can get the drawings I'll have the files done so the parts can be waterjet cut.


Dale M. Mon Jun 23, 2014 8:31 am

Isn't it basically like making rear suspension into a 4 link.... Should be pretty easy to just add some tabs and a adjustable link....

Guess you have already been to Google Images...

For those of you who do not know....

http://forums.norcalbajas.com/MGalleryItem.php?id=203

Dale

BL3Manx Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:03 am

That's a good picture, I hadn't seen it before. If there aren't any uninstalled kits around to copy I'll just try to wag it from the pictures and VW components.


Dale M. Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:18 am

Try Google IMAGE search "no hop kit"...

Dale

BL3Manx Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:58 am

This one shows the control arm at an angle to the butt line of the chassis I thought it was pretty much parallel.


dcamomanx Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:10 pm

I've got a set that I'd be more then happy to trace for you and take some measurement. Are you going to Big Bear? There should be a few buggies with the setup there.

I could bring them with me or mail the tracing to you.

The lower arm has to go inward as it would inter fear with cast lower suspension stop.


Doran

71StandardReduction Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:16 pm

It is supposed to be angled.
I have the kit that supposedly has a corvette? Lower control arm.
I have read that a few different places on the net, if someone knew for sure that it was a 'vette control then it would take a lot of guess work out of the project.

I have some pics in my build link but they aren't very good. I will be dissasembling mine for blast and paint but can't guarantee when.
But when the time comes, I will trace and measure.

I actually had Lawrence 0485 here on the samba make my tabs to mount the arm to my torsion housing.
I may have the measurements for those still.

BL3Manx Mon Jun 23, 2014 11:15 pm

Doran, Blake, Thank you both for your responses.

Doran, If you could make a tracing of one of the the flat plates (with its hole locations) which bolts to the RGB, I can get the dimensions from the hole spacing on the RGB. I also need to know the distance center to center of the holes on the control arm. I think I'm going to make the control arm from heavy wall DOM tube and threaded rod ends

Blake, If you still have the dimensions of the brackets that weld to the torsion housing that would be great.

Dale M. Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:51 am

BL3...

Upper front control arms for JEEP TJ....

http://www.energysuspensionparts.com/proddetail.asp?prod=KU70083BK

Upper rear control are for Jeep TJ...

http://www.energysuspensionparts.com/proddetail.asp?prod=KU70085BK

Can get you measurement off my 02 TJ if you want...

I don't actually have these, but control arm on stock jeep should be approximately the same (around 16 inches)....

Tabs for torsion tube can probably be had at AA Manufacturing...

http://www.aa-mfg.com/

http://www.aa-mfg.com/tabs/radius-tabs

Dale

BL3Manx Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:59 am

Dale, The Jeep control arms look perfect, the ball end in the rubber bushing is perfect for the angle mount. I'll find some in the junkyard and shorten or extend as required to match whatever length JJR used.

The AA MFG tabs look good, hopefully they have the same large radius as the torsion housing.

Thanks, Nelson

Zacrash65 Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:59 am

BL3Manx wrote: Dale, The Jeep control arms look perfect, the ball end in the rubber bushing is perfect for the angle mount. I'll find some in the junkyard and shorten or extend as required to match whatever length JJR used.

The AA MFG tabs look good, hopefully they have the same large radius as the torsion housing.

Thanks, Nelson

Hi,
Resurrecting this thread from the dead! I'm wondering what ever became of all this. I'm looking at lowering my '59 bus with IRS and then I'll have my reduction box tranny asking to be used. So I figured - lower the bus, raise the bug!
I've got a '61 bug. If anyone has an old JJ no-hop kit or info or stuff they're not using...

Thanks!

rayjay Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:02 pm

I would put a section of rubber hose on the axle tube to seal up the new rotating sleeve. Either one clamp or no clamp or a large nylon tie. Help keep the dirt out of the joint.

richardcraineum Wed Jan 13, 2021 7:05 pm

its really not rocket appliances, just need to turn it into a 4 link and the lower arm angled down lowers your instant center ( i think, unless i have terms screwed up ).
i put a large nut rgb in my 65 baja, couldn't take the way it drove so brought it back in the shop. split the spring plate and added a heim at the end where itd connect to the axle tube. welded some tabs to the torsion housing and put a drag link to it and the lower part of the reduction box. walla! no raise and no squat, rear end stays completely neutral. thats kinda weird too btw. it wasnt near as hard to build as i expected, you gotta quit thinking too much and just do it.
there should be pics in my baja build thread..

rayjay Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:34 pm

I wonder if these ends would have enough angularity travel ? then you could use simple threaded tubes and have some adjustability.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-Forged-Ste...25122.html

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/AFCO-5812-12-Steel-Tube-5-8-Thread-Black,266627.html

JWHracing Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:01 am

rayjay wrote: I wonder if these ends would have enough angularity travel ? then you could use simple threaded tubes and have some adjustability.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-Forged-Ste...25122.html

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/AFCO-5812-12-Steel-Tube-5-8-Thread-Black,266627.html

Those ends are only meant to run perpendicular to the bolt holding them. There is no angle in them. They are a bushing meant to travel up and down perpendicular to the mounting bolt. You'd need a heim joint with misalignment spacers to be able to have it pivot at an angle.

rayjay Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:40 am

JWHracing wrote: rayjay wrote: I wonder if these ends would have enough angularity travel ? then you could use simple threaded tubes and have some adjustability.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-Forged-Ste...25122.html

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/AFCO-5812-12-Steel-Tube-5-8-Thread-Black,266627.html

Those ends are only meant to run perpendicular to the bolt holding them. There is no angle in them. They are a bushing meant to travel up and down perpendicular to the mounting bolt. You'd need a heim joint with misalignment spacers to be able to have it pivot at an angle.

That's what I was thinking also. I just don't consider heim joints to be appropriate for anything but racing cars. Lots are used on the street or for recreational use but most are not replaced when they should be and are dangerous when worn out.

For the no hop kit rubber bushings and a flexible link are probably the right way to go. Some deflection in the rubber bushing and some lengthwise twist available in the steel trailing link. This is what GM did on the upper arms of the Chevelles [ F body and G body I think ] . The arms were rigid fore and aft but could twist a good bit torsionally.

JWHracing Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:47 am

rayjay wrote: JWHracing wrote: rayjay wrote: I wonder if these ends would have enough angularity travel ? then you could use simple threaded tubes and have some adjustability.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-Forged-Ste...25122.html

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/AFCO-5812-12-Steel-Tube-5-8-Thread-Black,266627.html

Those ends are only meant to run perpendicular to the bolt holding them. There is no angle in them. They are a bushing meant to travel up and down perpendicular to the mounting bolt. You'd need a heim joint with misalignment spacers to be able to have it pivot at an angle.

That's what I was thinking also. I just don't consider heim joints to be appropriate for anything but racing cars. Lots are used on the street or for recreational use but most are not replaced when they should be and are dangerous when worn out.

For the no hop kit rubber bushings and a flexible link are probably the right way to go. Some deflection in the rubber bushing and some lengthwise twist available in the steel trailing link. This is what GM did on the upper arms of the Chevelles [ F body and G body I think ] . The arms were rigid fore and aft but could twist a good bit torsionally.

The majority of things on a race car are safer than half the crap on regular street cars. If you spend the money on quality, performance parts, they don't wear out like today's poorly manufactured parts.

richardcraineum Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:50 pm

not to mention all you have to do is inspect your heims for wear and replace as needed, no different at all than a balljoint and all of which you should be inspecting anyhow. these vehicles aint the average F body built for the general population...
the lower links and heims i used were actually used parts from a dirt track car.



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