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Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:53 pm

Does anyone make thicker wall 1641 cylinders but with stock-diam spigots (no case machining)?

Mon Jul 01, 2013 8:00 pm

AA makes 88mm thickwalls but your heads have to be opened to the 90.5 size.

Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:20 pm

88's would make it a 1679, not a 1641 if that is the size he wants to stick with.

Mike

Tue Jul 02, 2013 1:27 pm

I was going to also recommend the 88s as well. Are you cc limited or something? Anyways, the answer is no.

Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:45 pm

Thanx guys. I'm just evaluating options for improving hp within stock parameters (ie, no machining of block or heads), but I've been advised not to use 1641 cylinders as they're too thin not to warp from heat.

I also like the idea that I can inexpensively repair the engine using easily available stock VW P&Cs.

Anyway, due to finances, my next engine is probably going to be some variation of an "optimized" 1600.

BTW - I know that everyone just uses P&C sets, but are there non-VW pistons that can be fitted to slightly-overbored 1600 cylinders?

Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:58 pm

the ultimate questions you need to answer are

1) are you going to buy new heads, or re-use your existing ones?
2) is there a shop nearby to machine your heads, if you are going to re-use them?

Tue Jul 02, 2013 3:59 pm

You can get AA p n c's on the cheap too, up to 94's. Just an fyi..

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:00 pm

You can get AA p n c's on the cheap too, up to 94's. Just an fyi..

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:03 pm

if you bore a 1600 for a larger piston you still wind up with a cylinder that's too thin

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:25 pm

volksworld wrote: if you bore a 1600 for a larger piston you still wind up with a cylinder that's too thin

OK, but not so bad as an 87 mm bore if its only bored to 86.0 or 86.5 mm....

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:26 pm

[email protected] wrote: the ultimate questions you need to answer are

1) are you going to buy new heads, or re-use your existing ones?
2) is there a shop nearby to machine your heads, if you are going to re-use them?

1. Use the heads from the 2nd engine I have;
2. VW Paradise sees me regularly...

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:28 pm

volksworld wrote: if you bore a 1600 for a larger piston you still wind up with a cylinder that's too thin
Disagree on this one. Several people run bigger stuff, myself included, with absolutely no problems.

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:29 pm

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Piston-Cylinder-Set-88mm-x-69mm-Slip-In-p/vw8800t1k.htm

If you use these, you'll have the best of both. They'll slip into your stock case, IF you bore the heads to the 92/90.5mm size. Nice thick walls, not like the slip in 87s and 88s.

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:32 pm

you really think you'd feel 20 cc's when you floored it?

Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:32 pm

Why are you intimidated by machine work?

Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:07 pm

vwracerdave wrote: Why are you intimidated by machine work?

X 2

Tue Jul 02, 2013 5:51 pm

I'm not intimidated by anything. I just don't want to machine the cases for the next engine, and I've already given a couple of reasons.

The thickwall 88s do look interesting, however.

Somewhere down the line I may build a 2300 with aftermarket cases, but not this engine.

Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:32 pm

Use the slip-ins. Bore the heads. Done. They're the thickest cylinders available right now.

Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:19 pm

[email protected] wrote: http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Piston-Cylinder-Set-88mm-x-69mm-Slip-In-p/vw8800t1k.htm

If you use these, you'll have the best of both. They'll slip into your stock case, IF you bore the heads to the 92/90.5mm size. Nice thick walls, not like the slip in 87s and 88s.

These look interesting, I want to build a torque motor using one of the cranks Jose [DPR] sells that is offset ground to use chevy rods, it comes out to about 73mm and its pretty cheap if you get it un-counter weighted. I have a set of 311 Single port heads that some one had cut for 90.5/92. I woulf put a set of ICT's on it and a very mild cam, it should be able to pull stumps.

Casey

Thu Jul 04, 2013 7:55 pm

Dr OnHolliday wrote: Thanx guys. I'm just evaluating options for improving hp within stock parameters (ie, no machining of block or heads), but I've been advised not to use 1641 cylinders as they're too thin not to warp from heat.

I also like the idea that I can inexpensively repair the engine using easily available stock VW P&Cs.

Anyway, due to finances, my next engine is probably going to be some variation of an "optimized" 1600.

BTW - I know that everyone just uses P&C sets, but are there non-VW pistons that can be fitted to slightly-overbored 1600 cylinders?

In the past yes, there were a few oversizes, maybe you can get some NOS ones if you look hard.

Now there is no demand for such things, since boring the cylinders is more expensive than buying new ones, and also because the cylinders generally outlive the pistons anyway. (they are some hard iron!)

It is the same as all engines, thinner cylinders do often have more problems. You cannot make the top of the cylinder thicker without boring out the heads. So bore out the heads, or use stock size cylinders.
the 1641cc kits are probably just bait for cheapskates, good way to make them spend more money. :lol: