TheSamba.com :: View topic - February 1963 with sunroof, actually just boxes of parts LOL

Thu Jul 30, 2020 4:52 am

I messed up :oops: . The Schley brothers are Paul and Mark.

Dean and Ken were the Lowrey brothers, also VW performance pioneers who were contemporaries of Paul and Mark Schley.

[quote="Rome"] Quote: I believe they're talking about NLA Deano Dinosaur VW Speed Parts? Close. dyno-Soars. Sounds the same, but purposely spelled differently.

Brothers Dean and Ken Schley were among the pioneers of hi-po VW tuning in the 1960's and '70's. They campaigned a very successful Beetle drag racer named Lightning Bug,

Thu Jul 30, 2020 6:32 am

djway3474 wrote:
I can feel good engagement shifting into all gears. I can pick any gear and I can rotate both wheels either direction with NO motor resistance.

What happens when it is on the ground and in gear? Both wheels will spin without motor engagement if one is not locked in place. How does the clutch pedal feel? Maybe try backing off the adjuster?

Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:40 am

Jason37 wrote: djway3474 wrote:
I can feel good engagement shifting into all gears. I can pick any gear and I can rotate both wheels either direction with NO motor resistance.

What happens when it is on the ground and in gear? Both wheels will spin without motor engagement if one is not locked in place. How does the clutch pedal feel? Maybe try backing off the adjuster?
Both wheels same direction, no engagement.
I will completely remove the clutch adjuster to make sure no issue with cable.

Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:55 pm

How’s does the clutch feel?

Thu Jul 30, 2020 10:39 pm

Motor has been in and out a couple of times today. First I thought it was the throughout bearing as it did not pivot on the forks well at all and took both hands to return to upright from angled position. Found some small burrs on the fork, quick file and the bearing moved fine. Put motor back and still no connection between trans and motor so it must be something with the pressure plate clutch plate assembly.
I have confirmed that the shift rod is moving the gears visually at the connector and the positive clunk when gear engages.
I have placed the clutch disc on the input shaft and blocked wheels with feet and I can feel the wheels trying to spin when I turn disc by hand.
I have placed the car in gear on the ground and in any gear the car just rolls.
I have backed off the clutch cable adjuster so that there is extra pedal movement before bearing contacts pressure plate.
Clutch, once bearing contacts pressure plate, is stiff until release point when it becomes easier.
Engine cranks over well.
These are the parts involved.
AA conversion flywheel for T4 motor to T1 transmission
Pilot bearing is in place in the flywheel
68 Swing axle
Kennedy Stage 1 Pressure Plate
I don't remember clutch plate brand.
Sachs T/O bearing.
Looks like the trans builder used the Empi heavy duty clutch fork.
Tomorrow I will attempt to measure depths to see if the clutch plate is even reaching the splines on the input shaft.

Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:00 pm

Could the clutch be in backwards? There should be one side that has a snout on it that faces the transmission.

Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:51 pm

Jason37 wrote: Could the clutch be in backwards? There should be one side that has a snout on it that faces the transmission.
I didn’t take a picture before I took that apart but I wouldn’t be surprised if it is possible, assuming the snout would not run into the flywheel. Will check if possible tomorrow.

Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:29 am

check your release height too, I've had ones that need shimming, and ones that don't. engagement feels like crap on the ones that need shimming.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...p;start=20

Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:05 am

W1K1 wrote: check your release height too, I've had ones that need shimming, and ones that don't. engagement feels like crap on the ones that need shimming.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...p;start=20
Thank you for the link. I will check for the 29/30mm height from collar to flywheel. The thing that concerns me is that they had bad feel, I got nuttin :shock:
I just went out to make sure the input shaft was not dislodged somehow and I could not feel any forward aft play so that kept me up all night for nuttin :oops:

Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:28 pm

I think I may have found a potential problem.
Following the suggestion that said to measure from the collar to the flywheel and that measurement should be around 29/30mm.
I installed the pressure plate/clutch plate again, tightened then measured. The measurement was way off suggested.
After some poking around I discovered that the pressure plate was going in the recess of the flywheel only partially. It is sitting level by all appearances though.
I was placing enough pressure on the bolts that I was concerned of causing damage. I don't have tools accurate enough to try to figure out if the flywheel opening is under or the plate is over, and I don't have the measurements.
On the plate it does look like there is a small beveled edge and that looks like about the depth the plate is going into the flywheel.
So I have never experienced this before, should I attempt a file?

Fri Jul 31, 2020 12:50 pm

Quote: AA conversion flywheel for T4 motor to T1 transmission

I would suspect the machining was not right on the flywheel then. I've never had a discrepancy on the pressure plate dimensions where it fits in the flywheel

Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:42 pm

I smoothed the edges on the pressure plate lightly after which I could get it all in except one mount location. I ran the file there a few more times and I could get it to snug down. The collar is not perfectly level so I took multiple measurements an got an average just below 29.
For the pressure plate bolts what should I use? 8.8 or 10? Hex with lock washer or flange head? The pacK of Empi flange bolts seemed to be too tight like the threads were off.

Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:56 pm

Got the motor back in. At first it sounded like the teeth on the input shaft and clutch plate were rubbing. Pushed the clutch pedal in a few times, which felt more normal, tried to rotate a tire with one blocked and it is doing what I expected in the first place.
Thank you @W1K1 for your suggestion, it set me in the right direction.
Now put it all back together, again :?
Until the next problem!

Fri Aug 21, 2020 11:05 pm

First attempt at starting today, still here so no major explosion.
Turned the key and the car fired instantly, which startled me and I switched the car off.
Tried again it made one sputter then nothing.
Intermittently the starter would not work or the fuel pump would not work.
My guess is two spots the connectors have been compromised with all the in and out the motor has been through.
I suspect the wire to the solenoid and the pump side of the L Jet double relay.
Lack of knowledge is really hurting me here in an attempt to diagnose.
L Jet question hopefully someone may know. I know the yellow wire from starter to relay is power to pump with key on, what I don't know is if the pump always is on while the key is in the start position or does it shut off at a certain pressure. I can see no sensor that would shut it off unless internal to the pump but I don't want to assume.
I will ask in some other places also.
Used the timing light to make sure juice was shooting down the spark plug wires so I am pretty sure it is fuel delivery that is the problem.
I am encouraged that it tried to fire so quickly.

Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:58 pm

First, make sure you are getting power everywhere you should be in the fuel system. From your symptoms, my first suspicion would be a wonky electrical contact in the ign. switch.

Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:26 pm

Tram wrote: First, make sure you are getting power everywhere you should be in the fuel system. From your symptoms, my first suspicion would be a wonky electrical contact in the ign. switch.
Well, I spent some time sweating in the humid dry heat and I think I have tracked it down to the never used before starter.
I was worried about the ignition switch also so I hooked up a remote start button to the starter and gave it a shot. Pump fired up but nothing from the starter.
I pulled the plastic cap off the column and put a test light on the power to starter lug. It lit up but no starter.
So I know there is a problem in the starter for sure, cheap Orileys part, but I can't rule out and intermittent switch problem. I will get a new starter in there and see what happens.
Thanks.

Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:45 pm

My luck continues. Got a call that my chrome was ready. This is though a guy that knows a guy that does work for Aerospace.
Bumpers are beautiful. Headlight reflector beautiful, headlight rings look worse than what I took in. Looks like finished with sandpaper before chrome.
Here is the good part, the rear view mirror post and both door winders are missing. Odd that the 3 most expensive parts are missing, and that both winders were misplaced. No reply for several days after they "would look into it"
With the headlight parts back I was able to finish up electrical as far as lights, signals etc. Having the fuse block, push button unit and the fuel gauge all in the basic same location is a pain in the ........
Had all of it in and out several times but as of this evening all that worked. Side markers are now part of the running light system as well as the bulbs inside the headlight reflectors and the signal housings. Hopefully I will be seen at night. Just need to tidy the wires up a bit and that is a done deal.
Now back to the motor.....I am adding extra fire extinguishers to my collection......

Sat Aug 29, 2020 10:55 pm

These are the headlight relays so the push button does not have to handle the current.
There is the high beam, low beam and the power in is switched so that the key must be on for the headlights to work.
I think my finger wanted to be on the internet :?

Mon Aug 31, 2020 1:33 am

Accidentally found the issue that kept the car from running. I could smell something weird in the cabin after a bit of cranking. When looking around I just caught a glimpse of smoke rising behind the battery. Stuck my hand back there and a finger let me know I had found a thermal incident. Apparently there was not enough raw metal to contact with the ground strap due to the rock hard Por15 so I scraped it away, bolted down the ground strap again and the car fired up. Seems the intermittent or weak ground was confusing the brain.
I discovered that one valve cover must be bent as several gaskets could not solve the leak, changed cover and issue solved.
Another leak was where I used a metal woven brake line to come off the t4 case to the pressure sender, finally used Teflon tape on the threads as I wasn't going any tighter. 2 problems down. I have a feeling it will take a while to get all the remaining drips out from the leak up top.
Huge amount of smoke when the exhaust paint got hot, freaked me for a bit.
Old Smiths tach not giving anything, hopefully just a wire issue.
I have a feeling that the "rebuilt" AFM unit has the spring too tight as I have to open the throttle a bit to get it to fire and won't idle.
Everything up to this point I thought would be the easy part :shock: , next will be making sure the AFM spring gives me a good fuel mix at least at idle and throttle up but I won't be able to dial it completely until I can get it on the road and watch the WideBand meter when the engine is under load. Getting that installed will be next. Down the L Jet rabbit hole.....
I also will remove the retard line on the dual advance distributor and see if that changes anything.
I can report that the muffler has a very cool deep rumble and the motor sounds awesome. It is a 2.5" in and out unit which I added a reducer down to 2" to hopefully create a small back pressure and help the muffler absorb some of the pressure waves. Time will tell on that front.
Now the real work begins and hoping it doesn't blow up.

Wed Sep 02, 2020 9:45 pm

Found a nice write up on the Smiths Tacho (as the Brits say) and found the correct wiring for my version. It works :D
Cleaned up more wiring under the dash and added wiring for the AirFuel gauge. I also added some wiring to have interior lights in the footwell.
Pulled apart the fan air intake system just to make sure all is working well. Found one tiny spot on the adapter that looks like it was just knicking the fan. Will clearance that and re assemble.
Getting another 7pin AFM ready to swap in and see if there is any change in the idle.
Inch by inch.