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Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:09 pm

Just bought a 1964 Bug with stock 1200cc engine what you recommend for workshop/ service manual?

Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:22 pm

Lots of threads on this, but they boil down to... what is your skill and tool stash level? If a beginner, start with the John Muir so-called "Idiot Book" which is a great manual for old Bugs, and especially for beginners or those not familiar with VWs.
If you are more experienced, add the official service manual.
That combo will cover 99% of what you will need to do.

Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:09 pm

The absolute best manual you can own is the Robert Bentley Official workshop manual for your year range of cars. It covers literally everything in the car succinctly. Pretty dry read though, if that makes a difference to you.

I might sound odd, but I don't find the Muir manual anywhere near as useful, and it has a few errors. Good part of VW cultural history though.

Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:46 pm

FWIW, I'd endorse what KTPhil said.

If you're really new to the Bug, the Muir "How to Keep Your VW Alive Book" is really useful. Sure, it may have an inaccuracy here or there, and some of his recommendations are based more on his opinion than on anything else.

However, I found it was very useful, especially as an introduction to the air cooled "system oF systems." There are some quirks that the Bug has over other, more conventional autos. Also, Muir goes to great detail in explaining how to do the various procedures - the tools, expedient tools, etc. He also does a good job of explaining how the Bug works and how it's different from conventional autos.

I think the major downside to the Muir book is that it was originally based on the mechanics of the early '60s and '50s Bugs. It also assumes that you're looking at a bone-stock Beetle. It's pretty short on info on FI, too.

Once you've gotten familiar with your Bug, the Bently manual is more useful, especially if you undertake some of the more complicated repairs. Note that the Bently manual also assumes that you're working on a bone-stock car from the year range that it covers.

It will take a while to put your own car into the context of all of its previous modifications, changes and repairs. The Samba forums are the best place to reach out for help with that issue.

I can't remember the last time I actually referred to the Muir book - it's probably been years - but it got me going in the right direction when I needed some basic guidance.

For absolute technical applications, the Bently manual is what you need, but to get started far enough along to put much of the Bently manual into a usable perspective, the Muir book is totally still useful.

Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:51 pm

For your early Bug ('64), and if you get a Muir manual, I would buy one of the older editions, before they added the Type 3/4 models and late Busses.

Sure, there may be a small update or two you miss, but it is vastly easier to find information and procedures in the old, simpler editions. Anything later than '71 or '72 will be very cluttered with info about cars other than your Bug. Sort of defeats the purpose of a simple manual!

There are various editions advertised in the Samba classifieds, or on ebay. Go for vintage!

Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:28 pm

as a new bugger I would totally support the Muir book. I have done things on my bug I didn't think I would be able to so far.

Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:54 pm

Lingwendil wrote:
I might sound odd, but I don't find the Muir manual anywhere near as useful, and it has a few errors. Good part of VW cultural history though.

No, it does not sound odd to me. I've been saying this for years. It's an artefact of its time. Back when you had no choice but to spend buttloads of money to buy proper tools and jacks, forcing one to make do with creative alternatives. It's a humorous book that had some solid advice, but you need to filter it through a modern lens. Hell I even saw this when I first read the thing back in the late 80s.

No, when Robert Bentley first announced the reprint of the 61-65 Workshop Manual, I immediately made sure my local VW shop could and would get me a copy of it and plunked down the dollars to pay for it.

Wed Aug 22, 2018 8:02 pm

You mean this one:
https://www.amazon.com/Volkswagen-1200-Workshop-Manual-1961-1965/dp/0837617022

Also Someone gave me this one as a gift, what u think?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1850107297

Wed Aug 22, 2018 8:13 pm

mojan_n wrote: You mean this one:
https://www.amazon.com/Volkswagen-1200-Workshop-Manual-1961-1965/dp/0837617022

Yep that's the gold standard, the best one available, the Bible. Well worth every penny. That's the first one you should buy.

Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:27 pm

The Haynes you got as a gift, covers too many years, but it does have a lot of useful information.

Tim

Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:12 am

I was given a Muir book over 25 years ago....never used it. Bentley for me.

Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:42 am

Yeah but there is no denying that the artwork in the Muir book is worth the price of admission, especially if you buy them used.

Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:13 am

anthracitedub wrote: I was given a Muir book over 25 years ago....never used it. Bentley for me.

Pretty much sums it up for me too. Had a muir for 35 years, never once used it to work with on the Bug, cool drawings, but it lacks details. The Bentley book has covered about everthing I ever needed to do on the Bug. Scientific publications made a nice manual, Australian printed, much like the factory manuals. Chiltons, Haynes have ok books, but they are basic. I collect VW manuals, cheaper than the actual car collecting thing, and I dont need to register them with the State!

Bug On with information!

Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:23 am

Just do yourself a huge favor and get all of them Haynes, Bentley, Miur, Chilton Clymer, and any other ones you get your hands on.
Read all of them then decide how to do what you want to do.

Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:18 am

Got it from eBay for $20 only.... if you need go here:

https://m.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksi...al+vw+1200

Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:26 am

Those books are the "lite" version of the workshop manual. They are like the later Bentley manuals. They are official VW publications and have great photos, diagrams and specs, and very few errors.

It is a subset of the Workshop manual, but you probably don't need the big blue book, which as the name suggests, are intended for well-equipped workshops, not the home mechanic. Those make fascinating reading, though, for geeks like us!

The principal advantage of Muir's book is that at the start of every procedure, it lists the specific tools, parts, and resources needed to do the job. You don't have to deduce this-- it's listed right up front. I know of no other manual that is this helpful to the novice. The time and aggravation this can save is priceless, and is why I recommend you also buy it.

Later versions that cover all the models are harder to use, and include more errors (especially the Type 3 and FI sections). That's why I recommend you get a '71-vintage manual that just covers the Bu/Bus/Ghia.

The very latest versions have additional topics, but frankly, the Samba covers all those topics much better!

Thu Aug 23, 2018 10:16 am

Agreed Bentley is best, however...
'Come to kindly terms with your ass, for it bears you' ...The Muir book covers transcendental crisis /issues that no other shop manual did, or does now.
The Muir book is an artifact that helped guide the VW culture...

Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:15 pm

mojan_n seeing as you list your occupation as electrical engineer and your hobby as old cars, i gather this isn't your first time round the block, you have had plenty of experience working on old cars, already know how to use tools and deal with the specific issues old cars have.
plus know how the turn dry workshop manuals into completed jobs.

in that case i would suggest the blue book. i use old factory ringbound manuals (but I'm a bit of a wanker in that regard, plus got mine for less than a new copy).

by all means get an early copy of the muir idiots guide, artistically and as a cultural piece, it is a beautiful thing in its own right and is a throughly enjoyable read.

where it comes into its own is taking people like myself who had zero experience/knowledge and giving them a way to approach a problem, break it down into bite sized bits and work through the bits from "something is not working" to "fixed".

by doing that it stopped jobs from being overwelming, gave me a mental approach to use when solving mechanical problems. i built up the hand skills and most importantly built the confidence to give anything a go. for that i am eternally greatfull. now i think about it, i still use some of the mental aproaches i learnt from it back then, in daily life now.

Fri Aug 24, 2018 7:38 am

Got my manuals :) thanks all.