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Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:13 pm

I've been searching for a simple way to add GPS tracking but would like to avoid any ongoing fees. I couldn't find any solutions out there but had this idea I wanted to run by the community:

Note: I don't need tracking for anything other than if the vehicle was stolen.

IDEA:

Buy the Trackmate GPS for $49.99:

https://www.amazon.com/TrackmateGPS-Tracker-Vehicl...=trackmate

Hardwire it in the vehicle, activate the tracking service, then cancel the subscription.

If the vehicle gets stolen, Activate the subscription to track the device.

I saw this in the last page of the FAQs on the Trackmate site:

"FAQS: Can I keep the unit installed and not pay for a subscription, and pay for a subscription if the vehicle goes missing?
Yes, you can. However, you can only activate the device during business hours. In the event you want to track immediately, you'll be delayed until the office re-opens."

Thoughts?[/b]

Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:28 pm

Is $6/month such a burden?

Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:37 pm

Main problem is that it'll probably get stolen in the middle of the night, you won't know until the next morning, and by that time it could have been moved into a building where the GPS won't function.

kind of defeats the purpose, but I do like the idea of only paying when you need it (I have spot trace).

most likely it'll be stolen by some drug addicts, thrashed, lived in for a few days, and abandoned. In which case you'd probably be able to recover it. club or a clutch lock or kill switch is probably better than GPS in that case.

Wed Sep 05, 2018 7:57 am

erste wrote: I do like the idea of only paying when you need it (I have spot trace.

$150/year is a lot of $$ for monitoring service, more than cellphone service (in some countries) for a tiny periodic spit of data. If a shepherd in Africa with a yearly salary of $200 can afford a cellphone, that tells you the data costs for monitoring can’t be more than a few pennies. But The communications investment sector is strong here in the US. If you invest in “communications” you can afford even a $1200 cellphone bill. Perhaps more.

I like this discussion, need to get a vehicle tracking system in place. I have a hidden killswitch to stall the old-school thieves, and want to add tracking in case a thief drags it up on a flatbed.

$6/mo sounds better. How much more insurance can be added for $6/mo additional?

Wed Sep 05, 2018 8:18 am

magicmike wrote:
IDEA:
Buy the Trackmate GPS for $49.99:
https://www.amazon.com/TrackmateGPS-Tracker-Vehicl...=trackmate
Hardwire it in the vehicle, activate the tracking service, then cancel the subscription.

I like the idea, my concern would be knowing that it would work when I needed it. If the battery dies at anytime does that permanently shut off the tracker? And how could you test it once in a while to make sure it is still working? If you were absolutely not going to buy a service, then having it in the van would be better than nothing but it seems risky to me.

I have a T-Mobile $3/month sim card. It works well on the current networks not just 2G. I think it would work in that trackmate but I haven't tried it. I use it as an emergency and message cell phone. Coverage on TMobile isn't as good as AT&T or Verizon, but it works anywhere but the boonies. I heard T-mobile is merging with Sprint so maybe things will change but I like this arrangement. I was going to try it on a tracker but I called Spot to cancel my service and they just lowered the price so I renewed. $99/yr for those wondering. Spot is normally about $175/year now.

Wed Sep 05, 2018 8:42 am

My tracker has a built in battery which will last up to 30 days on it's own. Whenever the rig is moved I get a text. I can track it via my phone's ap or my laptop. I would not want to deal with having to activate it only during business hours, after it was stolen say on a Friday night, especially since I pay around $6 per month. I also have a 24/7 hot line to call in case I think it's been stolen.

Oh and I also have a kill switch. Yes, I sleep pretty well at night :D

Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:54 am

There is a huge thread on all sorts of GPS tracking devices already running.
The Problem with older threads is that they do get dated as technology advances. I usually,start with the last page on old long threads and read backwards.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=568723

I'm on the fence if I should lock this and direct the discussion to this existing thread.

If we keep this discussion to FREE tracker options, this thread has value. If we are going to be getting into "mine only cost $x dollars" well, then it is no better and of no more help than the existing thread and I'll go ahead and lock it.

Dave

Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:50 pm

Here is one thing you can do without a monthly service fee.

You can hide a "Tile" in your van. They are low power bluetooth chip and the internal battery will last a year or two, then you toss it and buy another. It tells you when the battery is getting low too. They are typically used for luggage but you can use it on anything. The tile is small and fits on a keychain or luggage tag. If you loose your luggage, you go to the tile app and request to be notified when it is found. If it is close enough, your own iphone will find it, but if it is across town, you have to hope someone walking by has the Tile App installed on their iphone. If so, it will locate your item and notify you. The reason it works so good for luggage is there are usually a lot of people in airports with iphones so if your bag went to London, you can just tell the airline where it is. Certainly better than nothing.

https://www.thetileapp.com/en-us/how-it-works
"Your very own search party.
The Tile app connects you to the world's largest lost-and-found community, where friends and strangers work together using the Tile app to find everything that matters.

The world's largest lost and found community.
Every app updates the location of each Tile device it detects. With more than 10 million Tiles sold and over 3 million items located every day, our network is the largest, fastest and most powerful lost and found community in the world."

Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:13 pm

davevickery wrote: Here is one thing you can do without a monthly service fee.

You can hide a "Tile" in your van. They are low power bluetooth chip and the internal battery will last a year or two, then you toss it and buy another. It tells you when the battery is getting low too. They are typically used for luggage but you can use it on anything. The tile is small and fits on a keychain or luggage tag. If you loose your luggage, you go to the tile app and request to be notified when it is found. If it is close enough, your own iphone will find it, but if it is across town, you have to hope someone walking by has the Tile App installed on their iphone. If so, it will locate your item and notify you. The reason it works so good for luggage is there are usually a lot of people in airports with iphones so if your bag went to London, you can just tell the airline where it is. Certainly better than nothing.

https://www.thetileapp.com/en-us/how-it-works
"Your very own search party.
The Tile app connects you to the world's largest lost-and-found community, where friends and strangers work together using the Tile app to find everything that matters.

The world's largest lost and found community.
Every app updates the location of each Tile device it detects. With more than 10 million Tiles sold and over 3 million items located every day, our network is the largest, fastest and most powerful lost and found community in the world."

We use Tile around the house for phones, keys, mother-in-law

How widespread is the app? Ive never tried to track my luggage on a trip - are there enough Tile users out there for that to work?

Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:33 pm

With bluetooth I think you have to pair the two devices together - thus creating somewhat level of security.

Wed Sep 05, 2018 4:03 pm

"Every app updates the location of each Tile device it detects. With more than 10 million Tiles sold and over 3 million items located every day, our network is the largest, fastest and most powerful lost and found community in the world."

Wed Sep 05, 2018 9:24 pm

davevickery wrote: "Every app updates the location of each Tile device it detects. With more than 10 million Tiles sold and over 3 million items located every day, our network is the largest, fastest and most powerful lost and found community in the world."

the dude in the "How to find your stolen motorcycle with Tile" video seems to work for SAP Labs:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/andreasmuno/

the other dude in the video, "Co-founder / CEO" of Tile" Mike Farley...
seems to work for Concur Technologies (which was acquired by SAP in 2014)
https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-farley-aa4024b/

Not sure about the timing or coincidence of all of that, but it's probably safe to say that the video is exaggerated / a commercial.

davevickery, not trying to be dismissive here, but I am skeptical. I'd like to find a cheaper way to keep track my van with GPS etc, and all of these suggestions are helpful.

This is the first time I've seen Tile. It's neat, but maybe not the best way to keep track of a vehicle given the proximity and app requirements. I seriously doubt the claim of "3 million items located every day." That's a lot of shit in the lost and found given their claim of 10 million Tiles sold.

Thu Sep 06, 2018 8:51 am

erste wrote:
davevickery, not trying to be dismissive here, but I am skeptical. I'd like to find a cheaper way to keep track my van with GPS etc, and all of these suggestions are helpful.
I agree with you. That looks like an infomercial. But I had a tile and they are always on, battery lasts more than a year, maybe 2, just activate it and you're done. And to fit the requirement of this thread of no monthly service charge is tough.

I wouldn't recommend a Tile for a stolen vehicle, but you can buy a 4-pack for $40, use three for your keys, cat, whatever and then toss the extra one in the van somewhere. Better than nothing.

Thu Sep 06, 2018 8:54 am

davevickery wrote:
I wouldn't recommend a Tile for a stolen vehicle, but you can buy a 4-pack for $40, use three for your keys, cat, whatever and then toss the extra one in the van somewhere. Better than nothing.

X2.

Sat Sep 07, 2019 7:58 am

Interesting thread !

Seems like more products are coming out yearly, and maybe a low cost solution will pop out.

Tile is now making a version of its product that allows batteries to be changed easily.

* * * *

I did some searching online and saw the product *Lowjack* (opposite of highjack). Has a small, easily hidden transmitter. This would be the perfect solution if it were cheap but it appears to run about $700, but it's a one-time charge. It's been around for years and doesn't need a subscription service to access it.

From an article, [hwww.lifewire.com/what-is-lojack-534878] "If a vehicle that has LoJack is reported as stolen, a remote command can be sent to activate its transmitter. The LoJack system in the vehicle will then start broadcasting on a set frequency, which allows police in the local area to home in on its location. The broadcasting range of LoJack can differ depending on the position, height, and composition of buildings and other obstructions, but police cars within about a 3-5 mile radius will typically be able to receive the signal."

Google "Lowjack" for more. Wonder if anyone's tried to get them to offer volume discounts through state VW clubs or the like?

Sat Sep 07, 2019 8:47 am

Regarding free GPS, it's interesting that US taxpayers put GPS satellites into orbit and now have to pay to use them. Oh well, I guess we also don't get unlimited use of F-15s, tanks or awesome off-road vehicles.

Sat Sep 07, 2019 9:30 am

jimf909 wrote: Regarding free GPS, it's interesting that US taxpayers put GPS satellites into orbit and now have to pay to use them.

GPS is free. it is reporting the GPS data back to a remote location that costs.

there's 4 ways i see to do this over a widespread area:
- cellular network. carriers have this pretty well locked down so that if you use it, you'll pay for it.

- satellite network. communication devices that send a signal back up to an orbiting satellite. again, you ain't using this for free.

- business radio/amateur radio: these services CAN be free, Hams do it all the time with APRS, Automated Packet Reporting System that can send periodic GPS data bursts to repeater stations. it's very cool and uses radios operating on shortwave frequencies, your data is NOT private however. Business radio systems will do this also. Subscription services eg LoJack & LotSmart operate in the 173MHz range. options abound if you are a licensed ham.

- Peer2Peer networks. things such as the Tile devices communicate with other users who are in turn connected to the internet and can hence report back to you. reporting is dependent upon being in proximity to a user with the app running on their smartphone.

any others?

Sat Sep 07, 2019 11:36 am

I wonder how long it will take to find a Tile activated in a car in a typical city. Maybe Ill try this out, turn off the Tile app pn my phone and report my keys lost at MIT, see how long it takes for a Tiler to walk by.

Sat Sep 07, 2019 11:33 pm

[quote="DanHoug"] jimf909 wrote:
- amateur radio: these services CAN be free, Hams do it all the time with APRS, Automated Packet Reporting System that can send periodic GPS data bursts to repeater stations. it's very cool and uses radios operating on shortwave frequencies, your data is NOT private however.
I never even thought of that. But lets say you buried an aprs handheld somewhere hidden, wired 12v to it, and hid an extrenal antenna under the fiberglass luggage rack or something, or something) youre still only as good as the range to whatever tower you have dialed up, correct? Even dmr/fusion etc require you to select a frequency/repeater tower and they wont do it automatically like some commercial votescan systems, right?

I, personally, having experience w cell based profession trackers, and how inconsistent they are, wouldnt trust a bluetooth option.

Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:08 am

APRS uses a single frequency nationwide to broadcast/receive the X.25 data protocol. That allows everyone to be on the same frequency (mobile operators, stationary receivers, and internet gateways). If there are lots of users, or lots of data in the X.25 packets, the system can fail. We don't typically see that in APRS because usage is generally low, even among hams.

I have used APRS in my van for years to track progress on mountain trips. It's also useful for sending messages--there are SMS to APRS gateways that let APRS users message SMS users and vice versa--very useful when you have no cell service, but have APRS service. There's also an APRS protocol in the 30 meter HF band, but it's very low bandwidth.

Below is an APRS map and elevation track from a 2015 mountaineering trip. You can see we entered some pretty rural areas, but the signal integrity was pretty good. Straight lines denote areas where we had no signal--most notably near Boise City, Oklahoma.

I'm still using a TK103 cellular tracker from Amazon (see my post on the GPS tracker thread). On my Ting wireless plan the device costs $6 per month and it works almost everywhere there is cell signal. Six years, no problems.

kourt