TheSamba.com :: View topic - Empi & Flat-Four Repro Banjo wheels... Same MFR?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 9:51 am

Curious if anyone has put one of these on recently... Are the Empi branded ones the same MFR as the Japanese made Flat-Four branded repro ones? ...I saw the flat four one installed early last spring on a car at a show & the Flat-Four branded one looked decent so Just Curious if the Empi one is the same MFR...

And does anyone have some insight on the quality & fit? And any advice for the correct boss/adapter for a '57 24 spline shaft & does anyone maybe have a pic of one installed so I could see how these look installed? Are there any issues with cancellation of the signal switch using these wheels & adapters?

Can't really seem to decide on black or a white/beige one... if you have a pic of them installed please post one up if you can...

Thanks...

...Need to replace my 57's original wheel as age has taken it's inevitable toll on it & since a few giant chunks fell off it this past driving year forces me to replace it...

Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:07 am

You can have the original recast.

Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:40 am

Yes I know they can be recast and I might consider having it done down the road in the in the future as I'd never ever toss the original one away... :lol:

I've always just really liked the way the Banjo's look & heck, lets face it, owning an original Petri well, that's not in many owners budgets... So if I'm going to pick up a repro to just kill some time while sitting idle this winter while I can't drive them (our cars never ever go out on salted roads, ever!)

And while I've seen the Flat-Four one installed, they are a pretty nice representation of the original Petri but just started seeing the the Empi reproductions pupping up very recently, so just curious if anyone has bought one (or hands-on with one) to see if anyone knows they are all made by the same MFR, Flat-Four that everyone else is importing from FF in Japan... Lets face it, the minute they brand just about anything with the EMPI brand name, the quality drops like a brick in water...

Wed Dec 26, 2018 10:51 am

I bought the flat4 one many years ago, first impressions were the paint was crap, it was thin and thick in spots and had inclusions in it and there was overspray on the spokes, I wasn’t too worried about that because I was going to repaint it anyway the correct color. The “off-white” one is more like an yellowy eggnog color, just seeing that color is an instant sign it is a repro.

Then I installed it, what a piece of crap! The flex in that steering wheel was absolutely insane, it was almost like it was made out of rubber. I took the wheel right off and sold it. I forgot to mention that prior to me installing this wheel, I noticed the horn button had air bubbles in it (I got the Golden Lady) and it was sent back three times before I got one that was acceptable and even then I wasn’t too happy with it.

Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:19 am

What was rubbery with it... The spokes? The outer wheel? Connections? Everything?

At the show I saw one installed on last spring & the F4 one he had just ordered & installed a month prior to the show, according to him he loved it and its feel & when we were talking while I was in the car checking it out, I'll admit the finish was a bit lacking but when I had my hands on it, it didn't seem flexible or rubbery (but I also didn't drive the car obviously)... I can understand it not being up to VW or Petri specs & the way things were built back in the 50's but ...elaborate if possible.

And while you had one in the past when these just started hitting the market, maybe they've improved since, possibly?

Wed Dec 26, 2018 11:50 am

“Rubbery” as in it wasn’t solid and had too much play. Just holding the wheel and moving around with it, the entire wheel flexed in and out by a LOT at the hub where the spokes went in, at th rim and the rim itself. The amount of play was completely unacceptable. The play at the rim was almost as if they didn’t put a metal hoop inside the wheel rim. You have to forgive me, it has been over a decade so I can’t remember everything that happened, I remember now that I sent that rim back and they sent me another and it was identical in paint finish and play.

For anyone that mentions it, yes I tightened the spokes at the frets that didn't change anything.

After getting rid of mine I saw quite a few others complaining about it too. I got that one about 13 years ago, from what I have read from many others, it looks like nothing has changed. I was talking to another guy that had one in his volksrod, I noticed he put a different steering wheel in and asked him why he changed it, he said the flat4 one broke while he was driving, the hub failed. He too complained about the flex. I believe he got his about 5 years ago or so.

I hope to all hell something has changed and the consensus is they are solid, because I want one again.

Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:24 am

Ok, I can get the lack of quality from a decade ago sense...

Not trying to be biased, but I pit this in the same argument when I asked around when asking to purchase cheap cip1 6v semaphores so I could just run a pair of sem's VS. my failing OG 6v and a $600 rebuild bill...

Everyone said don't do it, they suck, you get what you pay for, you'll regret it etc... But in the end I still bought them, $200 for the pair... and even bought an extra 12v set (just in case I ever grow up and convert to 12v)... and now Ive had them in for 2 years & added the self-flashing LED's and, for lack of better words, have run flawlessly on the 1,000+ nice-weather miles a year I put on my Oval...

So, I guess, the repro banjo's sort of fall into the same argument... Some love them, some hate them, some are on the fence waiting for the next argument.. Maybe I'll just buy the Empi brand one $215 and see what happens...

Still wish I knew if the new EMPI brand ones were still the FlatFour just rebranded to EMPI or, a complete different MFR...

I suppose there is only one way to really find out...

Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:44 am

0nebadbug wrote: Ok, I can get the lack of quality from a decade ago sense...

Not trying to be biased, but I pit this in the same argument when I asked around when asking to purchase cheap cip1 6v semaphores so I could just run a pair of sem's VS. my failing OG 6v and a $600 rebuild bill...

Everyone said don't do it, they suck, you get what you pay for, you'll regret it etc... But in the end I still bought them, $200 for the pair... and even bought an extra 12v set (just in case I ever grow up and convert to 12v)... and now Ive had them in for 2 years & added the self-flashing LED's and, for lack of better words, have run flawlessly on the 1,000+ nice-weather miles a year I put on my Oval...

So, I guess, the repro banjo's sort of fall into the same argument... Some love them, some hate them, some are on the fence waiting for the next argument.. Maybe I'll just buy the Empi brand one $215 and see what happens...

Still wish I knew if the new EMPI brand ones were still the FlatFour just rebranded to EMPI or, a complete different MFR...

I suppose there is only one way to really find out...

I get that, but I hadn’t seen any negative feedback on the repro semaphores myself, in fact I have seen many positive feedbacks on them. I have seen many negative feedbacks on the steering wheel on VW and Porsche forums. Obviously you are interested in it and lean towards getting it, there’s really only one way to find out if it is good and that is to buy it. Some people just live with the fact that an item has issues and never mention it since their car is mostly a show car or weekend driver and doesn’t get driven. You can always return it if the quality is crap. I hope this one is a quality piece, I want to get another.

Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:41 am

i've installed a black Flat4 banjo, too. (3 years ago)

the flex you mentioned indeed is really bad.

but the quality (surface, color, spokes) was okay on mine.

last year on maikäfertreffen i stumbled over a sale-stand from these. https://www.vandoorenclassicvwparts.nl/

they make petri repros (banjo, porsche etc) and these are really good. absolutely no flex and superior quality, i was stunned. but expensive.

maybe i'll visit them in netherlands this summer to check how it fits in the car.

Sun Dec 30, 2018 9:49 am

Yeah, really nice but, cripes $1k+ & I can imagine the shipping...

*sigh*

I do know where there are 2 original Petri's complete just sitting & rotting in a field, but it's unfortunate that they reside in one of those "I'm going to fix that car" mentality and neither of them have moved an inch, other than another inch into the ground, in a 20+ year realm... LOL

Tue Jan 15, 2019 9:32 pm

Back to the original question. Yes, the manufacturer of both the Flat4 & Empi branded banjo wheel is the same. I believe Moon Eyes also uses the same wheel manufacturer. Grant USA is the supplier to all 3 distributors