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Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:09 pm

Hello Samba friends!

I just picked up a '56 ragtop project last weekend. We trucked it home in the middle of a snowstorm like a couple of idiots, but all went well and it's safely tucked away in my garage. I'm still looking through the boxes and boxes of stuff that came with the car, but it seems pretty darn complete, only missing its rear fenders and windshield (so far...). I'll attach some more detailed photos as I dig through it, but for now, here are the photos that the seller posted:

PO blasted it:

and primed it:

On the trailer, headed "home":

Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:35 pm

I've had a little time to sort through some boxes over the past couple of days. Beyond the normal switches, door mechanism stuff, glass and such, there were some interesting/fun things:

In a bag labeled "rear view mirror", this cool compass thingy:

Pop out quarter windows:

A cool little chrome pull for the glovebox:

Big M radio:

And a question. I'm thinking this is a windshield washer pump and knob? It has vintage rubber hose attached to it. Were these VW accessories? From some other car?

Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:51 pm

some info maybe,see user srm1956 pics.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=577520&highlight=windshield+washer+pump

ernstben wrote:
And a question. I'm thinking this is a windshield washer pump and knob? It has vintage rubber hose attached to it. Were these VW accessories? From some other car?

some info maybe
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=577520&highlight=windshield+washer+pump

Fri Feb 15, 2019 6:57 am

Boom. You're totally correct. It looks like it was installed to the left of the speedometer near the top of the dash. There's no reservoir or any other parts, so I'm not sure if I'll reinstall, but that's lightyears down the road. Thanks!

Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:04 pm

Very cool! You are WAY ahead with it being blasted and sealed (I hope and not high build primer). Were you lucky enough to get all the ragtop mechanism with it too? Please post up pictures of the parts as you get to it. Always good to see someone elses good fortune!!

Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:24 pm

SWF window wash installation with the square glass water container and steel cage.

Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:08 pm

motofly196 wrote: Were you lucky enough to get all the ragtop mechanism with it too? Please post up pictures of the parts as you get to it.

The person who disassembled the car did a pretty good job of bagging and labeling things, luckily enough. I dug out the ragtop and took some pictures:

A bag of random rollers, screws, bolts, and washers:

So... any experts out there see anything I'm missing?

Fri Feb 15, 2019 8:20 pm

Lots of sheetmetal. H apron, pan halves. Front apron looks repairable. How are the door bottoms? From the looks of the rust in the front apron, I would really poke around in the rear wheel wells for rust.
Where I live, it seems like the right side gets it the worst. Snow melts with salt, and flows to the right edge of the roadway. So that nastiness is getting splashed up into the right side wheels the most.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 10:39 am

Ben, that's an ambitious project! What are your plans- stock restore? Body on IRS chassis with later engine, 12V, front discs; etc for a vintage-appearing cruiser?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:30 am

Rome wrote: Ben, that's an ambitious project! What are your plans- stock restore? Body on IRS chassis with later engine, 12V, front discs; etc for a vintage-appearing cruiser?

That's a really good question. As soon as it gets above 20 degrees here, I'll take some more detailed pictures of the rust situation and post them. I think the direction I take it is going to be dictated by the state of the chassis (already I've noted some rust through in the beam, pan head, and rear torsion area.). I am open to any and all advice and opinions people have on the best way forward.

I like stock appearances though, so I think I'd want to stay with 5 wide rims one way or another. The 36er is locked up, so whether I can free that up may also dictate the direction.

Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:23 am

Ben, the reason I asked if you already had a master plan was to decide on the rear apron. An original H apron looks correct and works well for a 36hp engine. But if you decide to install a later engine, especially a 1300cc or later, the engine is much more of a hassle to fit into the engine compartment during installation & removal with an H. You probably know that the H apron comes up higher on each side of the rear quarter panel. Due to the slope of the body line, you are reducing your front to rear clear distance. Instead, if you fit a later "40 hp" apron, you have maybe 2 more inches of front to rear clearance space to maneuver the engine in.

30 years ago I had a '56 oval with an H apron. A PO installed a 1300 engine. When that seized a few months after I bought the car, it was really tough to pull the engine out.

25 yrs ago I bought a Dec. '52 Zwitter that already had a later apron, and a non-running 1500 engine. Once I had the fresh air heater boxes off the engine while the engine was still in place, it was easy to remove the engine due to the later apron.

You certainly can fit the 36hp engine with the later apron, but will need a crescent-shaped extension for your rear engine breast plate to fill the gap to the apron. Might also be able to run a 40hp stale air breast plate if the left sunken area clears the side-mounted 36hp fuel pump.

Or, you can buy one of each type aprons and make them removable, to match the type of engine being installed... Paint them both when you paint the car.

Mon Feb 18, 2019 8:08 am

Rome wrote: You probably know that the H apron comes up higher on each side of the rear quarter panel.

Or, you can buy one of each type aprons and make them removable, to match the type of engine being installed... Paint them both when you paint the car.

I didn't know that! Thanks for the heads-up. I strayed away from VWs with my last project car (a '68 Volvo 1800) and have found that I really like being able to go 55mph and then stop without needing large leg muscles. I think I'm starting to come up with a loose plan:

- Replace the front beam (that's pretty rusty anyway) with a stock width/height one but with disc brakes
- Replace the transmission with a later, tunnel case (from '68 with the higher ratios? Freeway flyer?) using the bus nosecone.
- Replace the engine with something like a 1776cc or so.
- 12v conversion

So... with that setup, there'd be clearance issues if I bought this apron?

If so, is the only alternative that would fit a non-H apron? I don't know if I'd be down with that as I'd like to leave the body stock. Thanks for the input!

Mon Feb 18, 2019 9:44 am

ernstben wrote: So... any experts out there see anything I'm missing?
Are the 2 steel tubular roof bows & their steel springy trailing arms hidden inside between the headliner & top?

kind of hard to tell if they are there as I don't see the ends poking thru where the pockets should be...

Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:18 pm

Do either of the reproduction aprons come with the internal support (the one the rubber seal slides into)? The early repros (wolf?) I have seen did not have this piece and was the outer skin only. If that is still the case it makes it easy to install whatever inner piece works for your application.

Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:32 pm

Looks like the wolf still is outer skin only, looks to be the more correct of the two and the price reflects it

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1378721

Autocraft does have the inner support

http://www.autocrafteng.co.uk/shop/beetle_63/panel...1--55_173/

Mon Feb 18, 2019 5:23 pm

0nebadbug wrote: ernstben wrote: So... any experts out there see anything I'm missing?
Are the 2 steel tubular roof bows & their steel springy trailing arms hidden inside between the headliner & top?

kind of hard to tell if they are there as I don't see the ends poking thru where the pockets should be...

There are 2 tubular bows and a single square slider in between them. I'll do some research, but it seems like I probably have at least the majority of parts.

Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:16 pm

That autocraft latch piece has wrong shape, plus that’s an early one. You can fit a bigger motor, removing the crank pulley helps a lot when putting in or out.

Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:18 pm

Good start on your project. Looks like it got punched in the nose pretty good. Are you going to replace the quarters or just find a clip?

Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:33 pm

Major Woody wrote: Good start on your project. Looks like it got punched in the nose pretty good. Are you going to replace the quarters or just find a clip?

Yeah, it definitely suffered a pretty bad smack to the face at some point in its life. I've been keeping an eye on the classifieds for a front clip just on the off chance that something pops up close by. The ripples seem to stop right about where the gas tank starts and the front apron is actually nice and straight. When it finally warms up around here, I'll roll it out, take some pictures, and probably ask for advice.

Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:37 pm

Ben, since your apron is off now anyway, how about buying the H apron to look original, but make it removable? This way, you can quickly pull it off, have unlimited space to the rear for engine installation/removal, then whip it back on once the engine is in?

Transmission from a '67 or '68 will be fine, with its 4.12 final drive ratio. Don't need a later one with the 3.88. My '64 Ghia Cabrio has the 4.12 unit in the '70 IRS chassis. With a mild 1600 would enjoy doing 80-85mph on Michigan highways (@ 70 mph speed limit) when I'd be out there for the Michigan Vintage VW Club meets in May.

Hopefully you'll mate the transmission to narrow axles so that you don't have the telltale wide rear track that came with a '67 transaxle. I'd also recommend upgrading the rear brakes. I don't know what later models ('67, maybe?) bolt onto an oval's rear hub and still keep the wide-5 lug pattern, but you definitely want more brakes than the originals when you have front discs.

For your 1776 you can stay mild with stock-valve heads (ported), mild cam, balanced and/or CW crank. Single-throat dual carbs will be fine, mostly due to cramped space in the oval's engine compartment. But you'll need more air coming to the engine compartment.