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LAGrunthaner Sat May 09, 2020 6:44 am

I've been using my 5s for many years and I've even replaced my battery this year(removing the old battery adhesive was the most difficult). I can get by for another year but soon they will stop allowing upload of apps like with my old iPad.

Has anyone purchased the new SE or have any info share? I only need 2 things more hard drive space and low light photography for work and VW hobby.

Is the new SE equipped with low light photography I don't care about multiple lenses that the 11 has but I might have to pay 2x as much for low light photography in the 11 although 1K-1.5K is crazy. I'm not even happy with the SE at $500. but if it has low light ability I might pony up.

KTPhil Sat May 09, 2020 10:57 am

Are you an Apple-only guy? There are good cameras on other brands, too.

VWsArent4Hippies Sat May 09, 2020 6:32 pm

LAGrunthaner wrote: I'm not even happy with the SE at $500. but if it has low light ability I might pony up.

FYI, they start at $399. If you have Verizon, AT&T, or Sprint, you can get one starting at $199 through WalMart

Zeen Sat May 09, 2020 7:31 pm

Hard drive space?

windfish Sat May 09, 2020 9:04 pm

^ I mean, yes, but you know what he meant.

This article seems to answer your question - https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/22/21230308/apple-...mera-price
"...but the disappointment comes with low-light photography. The iPhone SE simply doesnít do as well there as it does in other situations. Thereís no night mode, and in dim light, thereís just too much noise. Itís almost like the whole camera stack panics and overcorrects, especially on portraits."

Depending on how much of that is software there may be future improvements, but I wouldn't count on it.

Edit - this looks interesting though - https://petapixel.com/2019/08/28/neuralcam-night-p...o-iphones/
I ordered a new SE as a replacement to my four year old SE, will be in on Thursday. If you're still on the fence I can post a few example shots, though I'm sure there's a fair number online.

Abscate Sun May 10, 2020 8:16 am

I take a long time to jump but just went I phone 6 to iPhone 11 Pro


The camera, including low light capability, is ridiculously good.

Iím guessing at least iso 3000

Erik G Sun May 10, 2020 8:43 am

I'm phone shopping too. No longer need to be on the bleeding edge of technology, I don't use voice assistant much, don't need facial recognition, etc. I've had both apple and android and they both have pluses. my current phone is an essential, a little niche company that a few guys here on thesamba worked at, its no longer and they are no longer making updates. I'm leaning on the new pixel 4a that should be coming out at the end of the month. looks like the best bang for $400. I could buy a $1K phone but just don't see the need

LAGrunthaner Sun May 10, 2020 10:17 am

Yes Erik G the Pixel is a great phone and did low light 3 years ago. For me I didn't want to have to learn how to get all my photos on my MacBook Pro. I also have a PC form work as all my CAD classrooms are PC only. I might be better off with buying an oder Pixel with the low light as I know how it works and just use it for work photography but then I have 2 and that would be a pita :wink:

Erik G wrote: I'm phone shopping too. No longer need to be on the bleeding edge of technology, I don't use voice assistant much, don't need facial recognition, etc. I've had both apple and android and they both have pluses. my current phone is an essential, a little niche company that a few guys here on thesamba worked at, its no longer and they are no longer making updates. I'm leaning on the new pixel 4a that should be coming out at the end of the month. looks like the best bang for $400. I could buy a $1K phone but just don't see the need

Wow that is amazing thanks Abscate.

Abscate wrote: I take a long time to jump but just went I phone 6 to iPhone 11 Pro


The camera, including low light capability, is ridiculously good.

Iím guessing at least iso 3000

Yes windfish exactly what I need to read, yes please can you take a pic of your VW in low light and post here? That would be a big help. I strongly doubt I will ever pay 1K-1.5K for a phone but it is like having a camera too. I teach engineering design and I take photos of work all the time also the VW projects. I would most likely get a ton of use out of any upgrade I just need to do more homework on it. I am not switching to an android as I had one and not going back now.

Thanks for everyones help, a great option is pay on time which would be less painful on my wallet. To me itís hard to believe they can even ask for 1K-1.5K for a phone/camera.
Linda

windfish wrote: ^ I mean, yes, but you know what he meant.

This article seems to answer your question - https://www.theverge.com/2020/4/22/21230308/apple-...mera-price
"...but the disappointment comes with low-light photography. The iPhone SE simply doesnít do as well there as it does in other situations. Thereís no night mode, and in dim light, thereís just too much noise. Itís almost like the whole camera stack panics and overcorrects, especially on portraits."

Depending on how much of that is software there may be future improvements, but I wouldn't count on it.

Edit - this looks interesting though - https://petapixel.com/2019/08/28/neuralcam-night-p...o-iphones/
I ordered a new SE as a replacement to my four year old SE, will be in on Thursday. If you're still on the fence I can post a few example shots, though I'm sure there's a fair number online.

LAGrunthaner Tue May 12, 2020 3:53 am

Oddly my 5s just updated to the newest IOS. Being the new SE does not have low light capability I might have to let another year go.

raygreenwood Tue May 12, 2020 2:44 pm

So....what is interesting about the iphone 11 camera system?...mind you I am an Android guy....but I own about 8 cameras....and do a lot of industrial photography.

And....there is not a single "phone" in the world...that can do what I do with my SLR's....you just do not have the lenses. None of them are "cameras"...in my opinion. But....for about 95% of what the average person "needs" a camera for.....your modern smart phones are very, very damn good!

So the i-phone 11. Back in ...October I was in China. I cannot tell you who I was working for....but on the way in to the plant one morning (long drive)...I got to play with a pre-release, engineering copy of the i-phone eleven with the three lens system :wink:

The fact that it has three lenses is not amazing. What it does via software...and algorithm....IS amazing.

So...in normal digital SLR photography...when using high end macro lenses and professional lighting to photograph...."difficult"....surfaces and materials (transparent, shiny, chrome, multilayered etc)...items that are actually easy to photograph with FILM.....are difficult with digital because the sensor produces too much data in some areas and not enough control of depth of field in others....and its too sensitive to refection and certain light wavelengths.

So....its common....for professional photographers to mount the camera on a stable tripod....and set the lighting and depth of field...and take a picture. Then without moving the camera....reset the depth of field and lighting and take another picture at a different exposure. You might take five mechanically different photographs on the same focal axis.

Then you load that into PS or Lightroom using one of numerous software packages....which digitally stitch together or "laminate" all of those lighting and detail views....into one photograph.....that much more closely mimics the actual massive depth of field and lighting....that you get with the human eye.

That......is what the I-phone 11 camera system is capable of doing....in the phone...in the camera.

To a certain extent...any of the systems like the pixel are working with largely the same technology....but the apple system with the three lenses takes it one three tweaked digital axes.

Very impressive. These features of the 11 and the pixels....are as close as they have gotten to A. the human eye response and B. getting around the the advantage that the SLR lens system and sensor size have. Ray

KTPhil Tue May 12, 2020 3:16 pm

Plus, you can't fit a Nikon D810 in your pocket...
;-)

oprn Tue May 12, 2020 4:46 pm

Just got one today. I will see how it goes...

Had to pay $690 + tax Canadian dollars.

Abscate Tue May 12, 2020 5:55 pm

KTPhil wrote: Plus, you can't fit a Nikon D810 in your pocket...
;-)

My 300mm EDIF 2.8 needs a big pocket, too.

KTPhil Wed May 13, 2020 9:36 am

Abscate wrote: My 300mm EDIF 2.8 needs a big pocket, too.

She: "Is that a 300mm EDIF 2.8 in your pocket, or are you just glad to see me?"

Abscate Thu May 14, 2020 1:28 pm

KTPhil wrote: Abscate wrote: My 300mm EDIF 2.8 needs a big pocket, too.

She: "Is that a 300mm EDIF 2.8 in your pocket, or are you just glad to see me?"

Donít come near me without a lens cap....

ach60 Thu May 14, 2020 5:21 pm

New iPhone SE, OH GOD No!
I'm a former Apple Addict, but the luster has well worn off for me.
Honestly after using HP computers for the last 10+ years, at work,
as my Apple products at home died, I replaced them with HP's, Dells, and Google Books at 1/3 to 1/2 the cost.
My Sister died 2 years ago and left us 2 Mac Books, one old, and one brand new.
These, Mac Books were both unusable,
but my wife spent 4 hours at the Apple Store, and they were able to get them running again.
I am impressed that my Super duper iMac with a 27" screen from 2008, is still running good, but hadn't had an update in 4 years.
Phones/Pads/Computers/Washing Machines are commodity appliances,
The Apple is just not that better, or more stable a platform, than the commodity brands like HP.
The AT&T salesman was shocked by my attitude towards spending $300+ on a f&&&ing phone.

windfish Thu May 14, 2020 10:03 pm

ach60 wrote: New iPhone SE, OH GOD No!
I'm a former Apple Addict, but the luster has well worn off for me.
Honestly after using HP computers for the last 10+ years, at work,
as my Apple products at home died, I replaced them with HP's, Dells, and Google Books at 1/3 to 1/2 the cost.
My Sister died 2 years ago and left us 2 Mac Books, one old, and one brand new.
These, Mac Books were both unusable,
but my wife spent 4 hours at the Apple Store, and they were able to get them running again.
I am impressed that my Super duper iMac with a 27" screen from 2008, is still running good, but hadn't had an update in 4 years.
Phones/Pads/Computers/Washing Machines are commodity appliances,
The Apple is just not that better, or more stable a platform, than the commodity brands like HP.
The AT&T salesman was shocked by my attitude towards spending $300+ on a f&&&ing phone.

There are cheaper Android phones, but at it's pricepoint the new SE is very competitive.
That's kind of Apple's "thing" -- if you directly compare their products to the competition they're usually not that far off. Apple just chooses not to do a low-end option most of the time.
A lot of people will pay a bit more to avoid dealing with Android / Windows as well.
imo Apple does a better job at privacy protection than Google because they don't really have anything to use your data for, and selling your data would harm their brand more than any profit they'd get.
Google datamines everything. I say this as a Gmail user, the amount of info Google has collected on everyone is a bit creepy.

I absolutely get the aversion to spending $400 "on a phone".. but these things aren't really phones anymore. They're small computers that happen to have a phone app, and I use mine quite a bit throughout the day.
If you just want a flip phone by all means do that, but don't pretend that there's no utility gained with a good smartphone.
Just having a decent camera on you at all times is amazing, the recent gen smartphones are really impressive for casual pictures.

Anyways.
Three weeks after ordering it my new SE arrived today, shipped directly from China which I thought was interesting.

I'm happy with it so far, but I was happy with my original SE too.
It's a bit quicker and bit larger (though thankfully not by too much), missing the headphone jack but I'll deal.
It does better with low-light pictures than my four year old SE, but not spectacular.
Will post a couple example shots later.

KTPhil Thu May 14, 2020 10:19 pm

I'll weight in on the HP/Apple comparison. It was about 8 years ago that the HDD on my HP desktop began to get wonky. I added a second hard drive to back up my data, then sought to replace the primary drive and re-install Windows from the CDs I bought with the PC (full price, mind you).

Between Window's anti-piracy routines and the similar HP proprietary hardware, it never worked again. Oh, I could have spent over $600 for an HP-branded HDD that literally was the $150 generic unit plus HP software pre-installed on a special part of the HDD... effectively making it NOT a clone and NOT open architecture, but rather a proprietary, HP-only relic.

If I am going to pay Apple prices, I want Apple reliability. HP would not budge and that's the last HP PC I bought (after three for home and of course many at work). Never again.

So I bought a 27" non-retina display mac just after the retina models came out, so it was cheap. I loaded it with memory and a large HDD.

It's fast enough for office applications and mild Photoshopping, and I'm not a gamer. So 8 years later it runs the latest OS and apps, and has crashed a total of 4 times in 8 years. Solid as a rock, and other than a broken keyboard my wife drowned cleaning. It's been bulletproof.

Turned out the be the least expensive PC I ever bought, when you consider it's yearly life cycle cost.

OB Bus Fri May 15, 2020 9:38 am

I'll chime in here with KTPs comments.
I was a PC person from 1987 forward. I would smirk at people with their expensive but glamorous Apple products that would not run the ordinary software that "everyone" used.

That was until we had 3 PC laptops fail over a 3 year span. Major fails. Data lost. I consulted with our tech crew (our 3 adult children) about what to do. Their opinion was unanimous: get a Mac. Eldest son: "Dad get the Mac, you will be much happier." So 6 years ago we bought a refurbished MacBook Pro from Apple for about $1800. Except from one broken key on the keyboard (a cat walked across the keyboard and hooked a key) it has been perfect. Cheapest $1800 I have ever spent.

We have since converted to iPhones and an iPad also. And Apple's phone help is outstanding.

EverettB Fri May 15, 2020 9:39 am

The HP-only hard drives sound insane but I immediately wonder if there is some way around that. Changing the BIOS or something to get around it and use any off-the-shelf drive.
I can't see numerous computer people putting up with that sort of crap and they would figure out a way to make it work.



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