TheSamba.com :: View topic - Need help please... grandfather / grandson project

Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:28 am

We started on the re-wire yesterday but stopped to place an order for split loom, cable clamps, and more wire.

The Ooogah horn and signal flasher were 6 volt and we want to chage it to a 12 volt system. We already recieved a 12 volt Ooogah horn (not near as well built as the old one). In addition, we ordered a 12 volt LED flasher for the new lights.

The windshield wiper motor seems to be froze up. If I can get it moving my plan is to add an in-line voltage reducer and use it. If it doesn't work I guess we will need to find another one, (12 volt).

Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:58 am

Looking for some help please.

We are starting to make a list of parts needed to rebuild the braking system.

The master cylinder and reservoir the buggy has on it now is shown in the pics. We are needing to know if someone can identify the year or provide a part number so we can order new ones, or if there is a better replacement for it that you may know of.

The pieces of the old wire harness were not connected to the cylinder brake switch so we are not sure how to wire it up.

Another question, why does it have two brake switches?

Thanks in advance for any help you can give.

Sun Aug 09, 2020 1:51 pm

vwbobby , what is that little white jewel in the backround in previous picture :?:

Sun Aug 09, 2020 2:16 pm

Mickey bitsko wrote: vwbobby , what is that little white jewel in the backround in previous picture :?:

1940 Chevy Business Coupe.

The frame was sandblasted and painted and it now has the Fatman front end parts and a Trans Am rear axle.

Its pretty close to getting some paint but for now it's in a light gray primer.

Sun Aug 09, 2020 3:01 pm

sounds like another fun project.

Sun Aug 09, 2020 3:12 pm

Your brake master cylinder is a two-circuit style, which means there's a rear and a front. It was a safety design so that if there was a leak or problem with one wheel, at least fronts or rear brakes would still work.

There are dual brake switches because of the brake warning light system, which would illuminate a bulb on the dash if there was no fluid in the master cylinder. It would be glaringly obvious that your brakes don't work long before that bulb would ever light up!

You can wire your brake lights with those style of switches, but you can also get earlier two-prong brake light switches.

https://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=VWC%2D113%2D945%2D515%2DH

Search the Technical heading on this website, there are plenty of wiring diagrams. But you could have someone put their foot on the pedal and test for continuity on the prongs, when pedal is down (one switch is simply jumpered to the other)

Sun Aug 09, 2020 4:17 pm

VW Bobby wrote: Matt Wilson wrote: Your brake master cylinder is a two-circuit style, which means there's a rear and a front. It was a safety design so that if there was a leak or problem with one wheel, at least fronts or rear brakes would still work.

There are dual brake switches because of the brake warning light system, which would illuminate a bulb on the dash if there was no fluid in the master cylinder. It would be glaringly obvious that your brakes don't work long before that bulb would ever light up!

You can wire your brake lights with those style of switches, but you can also get earlier two-prong brake light switches.

https://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=VWC%2D113%2D945%2D515%2DH

Search the Technical heading on this website, there are plenty of wiring diagrams. But you could have someone put their foot on the pedal and test for continuity on the prongs, when pedal is down (one switch is simply jumpered to the other)

Thank you Matt!

Mon Aug 10, 2020 2:13 pm

I'm really fond of Burros.

In 1965, a friend of the family, Elmer "Ernie" Waring was working with Tiny Thompson and Les Choate building Burro buggies. He was also working Technical and Safety Inspection along with my family at SCCA sports car road races in SoCal. I was 9 years old pushing 10 and working as a Tech Inspector (adult racers HATED to be told by a 9 year old kid that their race car that cost more than my family's home in the San Fernando Valley could not race because it failed Tech Inspection!). At one race at Willow Springs Raceway, Ernie drove to the race in his Burro. During the lunch break, Ernie asked me if I wanted a ride in his buggy. I was VERY interested. So we took off and headed up the hill above the track. The little 40hp engine pushed that buggy right up that steep rocky hill like it was going up a driveway. We looked around from the top of the hill for a little while as we ate our bag lunches provided by the race organization for workers, then Ernie drove down the back side of the hill and around the desert for about 20 minutes. There were no fences around the track then or any other properties around it. Just open desert with old open vertical mine shafts that we had to watch out for. Ernie later went on to be the Chief of Tech for NORRA that did the Baja races and SCIDA that did the short track buggy and Bug races at places like Ascot in Gardena California. He later became my brother's father in law too. So he was family.

I was sold on offroading from that day and would have ordered a Burro that week if I was older. Now I would build myself a Burro with my own modifications to the design...except I already have too damned many cars: Baja Bug, Hi Jumper buggy, Glitterbug fiberglass buggy, Toyota pre-run truck, etc.

For the wiper, there is an outfit that advertised or still does on Samba that re-winds your 6-volt wiper to 12V. I did that for my '58 Baja after decades of using a voltage dropping resistor. WAY better as a 12V.

Mon Aug 10, 2020 2:49 pm

dustymojave wrote: I'm really fond of Burros.

In 1965, a friend of the family, Elmer "Ernie" Waring was working with Tiny Thompson and Les Choate building Burro buggies. He was also working Technical and Safety Inspection along with my family at SCCA sports car road races in SoCal. I was 9 years old pushing 10 and working as a Tech Inspector (adult racers HATED to be told by a 9 year old kid that their race car that cost more than my family's home in the San Fernando Valley could not race because it failed Tech Inspection!). At one race at Willow Springs Raceway, Ernie drove to the race in his Burro. During the lunch break, Ernie asked me if I wanted a ride in his buggy. I was VERY interested. So we took off and headed up the hill above the track. The little 40hp engine pushed that buggy right up that steep rocky hill like it was going up a driveway. We looked around from the top of the hill for a little while as we ate our bag lunches provided by the race organization for workers, then Ernie drove down the back side of the hill and around the desert for about 20 minutes. There were no fences around the track then or any other properties around it. Just open desert with old open vertical mine shafts that we had to watch out for. Ernie later went on to be the Chief of Tech for NORRA that did the Baja races and SCIDA that did the short track buggy and Bug races at places like Ascot in Gardena California. He later became my brother's father in law too. So he was family.

I was sold on offroading from that day and would have ordered a Burro that week if I was older. Now I would build myself a Burro with my own modifications to the design...except I already have too damned many cars: Baja Bug, Hi Jumper buggy, Glitterbug fiberglass buggy, Toyota pre-run truck, etc.

For the wiper, there is an outfit that advertised or still does on Samba that re-winds your 6-volt wiper to 12V. I did that for my '58 Baja after decades of using a voltage dropping resistor. WAY better as a 12V.

Wow, you've had loads of fun with buggies, congrats!

Thanks for the info on the wipers I'll do a search for them.

Mon Aug 10, 2020 4:28 pm

Back in about 2010 I bought a DBHVW mag off the newstand. In it was an article about the Manx Club doing their first off road club event of the year. In the article were several pics of a recently restored red framed 1970 IRS Burro. There were also a couple of other Burros in the pics with all the Manxs and Towds, etc. That red Burro really attracted me as being everything I wanted in a VW based car.

Fast forward to earlier this year and lo and behold !!!! That exact Burro showed up on the Samba classifieds. About double the price I could justify spending and there is the whole tagging and insurance problem in GA plus it was in CA so no dice. I did contact the guy via email and he told me some stuff about the buggy and the magazine article. He was moving to Michigan iirc and was going to spend the Burro proceeds on a fishing boat.

I think the only way I could end up with a Burro-ish looking buggy is to start with a bug and shorten the pan 10" and cut away the body retaining just the windshield frame, the door jambs and the factory inner tin work from the nap hat area back to the cowl area and door jambs.

Mon Aug 10, 2020 6:09 pm

rayjay wrote: Back in about 2010 I bought a DBHVW mag off the newstand. In it was an article about the Manx Club doing their first off road club event of the year. In the article were several pics of a recently restored red framed 1970 IRS Burro. There were also a couple of other Burros in the pics with all the Manxs and Towds, etc. That red Burro really attracted me as being everything I wanted in a VW based car.

Fast forward to earlier this year and lo and behold !!!! That exact Burro showed up on the Samba classifieds. About double the price I could justify spending and there is the whole tagging and insurance problem in GA plus it was in CA so no dice. I did contact the guy via email and he told me some stuff about the buggy and the magazine article. He was moving to Michigan iirc and was going to spend the Burro proceeds on a fishing boat.

I think the only way I could end up with a Burro-ish looking buggy is to start with a bug and shorten the pan 10" and cut away the body retaining just the windshield frame, the door jambs and the factory inner tin work from the nap hat area back to the cowl area and door jambs.

Tried searching for a pic of the Red Burro in your post but no luck. Sounds like a nice one for sure.

I'm interested in finding out what the curb weight of the buggy is when I'm finished. It seems to be really light weight.

Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:03 am

Mickey bitsko wrote: sounds like another fun project.

Yes sir, loads of fun. Cars have been a long-time hobby of ours and I’m happy to see that all of the grandchildren enjoy it as well.

Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:30 am

The first 2 pics are from the magazine article and the third is from the Samba ad.

Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:36 am

Here is the rest of the Burro brochure. The back cover is the pic I posted earlier.
Front cover

page 1

page 2

Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:44 am

rayjay wrote: The first 2 pics are from the magazine article and the third is from the Samba ad.

Very nice!

We have a CJ5 soft top on order and the pics gives me ideas on how to fit it up.

He carried the extra fuel on the front, didn't think about doing it that way.

The Baja side bars have been reworked to fit ours and we planned on strapping some small jerry cans to that. I'll get some pics up later.

Thanks for posting!

Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:46 am

rayjay wrote: Here is the rest of the Burro brochure. The back cover is the pic I posted earlier.

Thank you! I'm adding those to my VW pic library for future reference.

Tue Aug 11, 2020 6:21 am

Might want to look in GOOGLE IMAGES for "VW Burro"....

Lots of pics and inspiration...

Dale

Tue Aug 11, 2020 7:54 am

Dale M. wrote: Might want to look in GOOGLE IMAGES for "VW Burro"....

Lots of pics and inspiration...

Dale

Thanks, will do. It's interesting trying to find out more about the buggy.

The uncle that put it together has been deceased for many years so we don't have all the information we would like to have. The pics of the Burro frame looks very similar to the one we have with a few minor differences.

The welds on the tubing appear to be solid but they didn’t look good. They weren’t ground down and had lots of spatter and chicken scratching’s. I’m told that my uncle was a great machinist, but whoever welded it up needed some more practice. If he ordered the frame parts from Burro, it doesn’t look to me like the company welded any of it together.

I remember that the buggy was a four-seater when purchased by the uncle I picked it up from. He removed it and welded the corrugated metal in its place to haul newspapers.

Thu Aug 13, 2020 2:02 pm

Disassembled the wiper motor, cleaned and lubed it up to include the linkage. Everything seems okay now so I ordered a 12v to 6v step-down module for it. It’s yet to be seen if it will all work together when the installation happens.

Started on the pedal assembly rebuild. Used degreaser and a power washed to remove the big stuff. The gas pedal was stuck.

It’s soaking in diesel for now and I hope to have it finished on Friday.

Feels like we are making some progress, (yeaaa) but we are still looking for a motor or someone to rebuild the one that’s in it.

.

Fri Aug 14, 2020 11:38 pm

VW Bobby wrote: rayjay wrote: Back in about 2010 I bought a DBHVW mag off the newstand. In it was an article about the Manx Club doing their first off road club event of the year. In the article were several pics of a recently restored red framed 1970 IRS Burro. There were also a couple of other Burros in the pics with all the Manxs and Towds, etc. That red Burro really attracted me as being everything I wanted in a VW based car.

Fast forward to earlier this year and lo and behold !!!! That exact Burro showed up on the Samba classifieds. About double the price I could justify spending and there is the whole tagging and insurance problem in GA plus it was in CA so no dice. I did contact the guy via email and he told me some stuff about the buggy and the magazine article. He was moving to Michigan iirc and was going to spend the Burro proceeds on a fishing boat.

I think the only way I could end up with a Burro-ish looking buggy is to start with a bug and shorten the pan 10" and cut away the body retaining just the windshield frame, the door jambs and the factory inner tin work from the nap hat area back to the cowl area and door jambs.

Tried searching for a pic of the Red Burro in your post but no luck. Sounds like a nice one for sure.

I'm interested in finding out what the curb weight of the buggy is when I'm finished. It seems to be really light weight.

Says on page 2 of the brochure that the approximate weight of the Burro is 950lbs for the 2 seat and about 1200lbs for the 4 seat.

To rayjay, to build your own Burro is not so terribly tough. There is a guy in central California who builds new copies. The brochure pictures show you enough about the frame design to imitate it quite well. One thing I would change is building it basically in 1.5" x .095 wall round tube instead of in 1" x .065 wall square tube. Some of the tubes would go away, some would be added or changed a little. But the overall look would be the same.