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Fri Oct 02, 2020 7:22 pm

I was installing an ARB awning to my '84 using the GoWesty bracket kit, and -- with one side fully attahched -- the awning slipped off the gutter while I was making a final adjustment to the clips, pulling the rivnut in the finished side clean out of its hole.

I feel pretty dumb and I know it's ugly -- but for now I'm mostly interested in getting a secure hold for the bracket so I can finish with the awning and move on to other projects for a while.

Any suggestions would be welcome. Feel free to make fun of me.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 7:30 pm

Some kind of toggle bolt maybe? I can't be the first one to have done this....

Fri Oct 02, 2020 7:35 pm

Bummer, sorry for that.
It does make the point that you never want either mount letting loose.
Especially at 60 mph, passing by people on walking the side of the road etc.

I'm trying to think of ways to use an M6 bolt, nut & washer to flatten out the edge of that hole.
If the 10mm head will go thru that hole, maybe between a washer and the shoulder of the head can help to flatten the hole.

And you go around the hole, flattening it.

Maybe grind the 13mm head of an M8 bolt such that it roates into the hole.
The head has just one sector of shoulder that you can clamp the hole edge with.

And then put another rivnut in it.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 7:40 pm

Sorry this happened. Was the rivnut fully compressed? A bad thing happened to my buddy on his fiamma awning. He used the wrong bolt thread and started to strip his rivnut. He couldnt get the bolt back out as it spun the rivnut in place. I feel like he cut the bolt and carefully ground the rivnut down and knocked it in. Kinda hacky I know. Then I believe he was able to reinstall another rivnut in the existing hole without issue. Not sure if this is any help to you, but Im wondering if the hole is reusable for another rivnut or is compromised?

Fri Oct 02, 2020 7:54 pm

Instead of a toggle bolt there is a product called a "well nut" or "rubber nut". These insert into the hole and then expand inside as you tighten the screw.

https://www.lowes.com/pl/Well-nuts-Nuts-Fasteners-Hardware/4294546117

https://www.boltdepot.com/Product-Details.aspx?pro...26%20Bolts

Hardware store often stock them in various sizes. Even Lowes or Home Depot.
Some have thinner heads than others.

Mark

randalieren wrote: Some kind of toggle bolt maybe? I can't be the first one to have done this....

Fri Oct 02, 2020 7:59 pm

another option, would be to go up a size of bolt, i don't know the GW bracket, but if they are like any of the others, you should have room to go up a size, maybe your rivnut kit has the next size up, in it.
a fix done in less time, than the post took to write perhaps.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 8:11 pm

Don't use a rubber well nut. It's not appropriate for this application/load.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:23 pm

Hmm, so is the hole notably wider than the hole size for the rivnut you used? Say , is the hole now 12mm but was originally 8mm? If so , then I would cut a strip of maybe 16 gage or thicker steel to 12mm wide by 30mm long. Drill a new 8mm hole in the center of it and insert it into the hole with some sort of glue on it and back the wallowed hole with it. Install new rivnut.
If the footprint of the bracket offers more coverage you could drill out the hole larger to accommodate a wider strip of metal giving more margin along the sides of the new rivnut hole.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:34 pm

I was using the rivnuts provided by GoWesty w/ the bracket kit. I like the idea of trying a wider gauge nut -- but where can a person find different-sized rivnuts for retail sale? Auto parts stores?

Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:38 pm

Yeah I've bought them at Napa , some times called jack nuts. My go to supplier for anything fastener is Tacoma Screw in washington.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 9:46 pm

randalieren wrote: I was using the rivnuts provided by GoWesty w/ the bracket kit. I like the idea of trying a wider gauge nut -- but where can a person find different-sized rivnuts for retail sale? Auto parts stores?

You can get pretty good variety packs on amazon, if you can't find them locally. And it may give you a better idea of what will fit, if you have 4 or 5 sizes on hand
Possibly harbor freight too, I don't know if they have those in BC though?

Fri Oct 02, 2020 10:03 pm

Cross nut/plusnut. Small shoulder rivnut aren't good for that application.

Fri Oct 02, 2020 10:10 pm

I was just looking at videos of plusnut installations. I think that might do it -- and I was able to locate some nuts. Any thoughts about the best assembly tool that I can put together w/ box hardware store parts?

Sat Oct 03, 2020 4:29 am

I once had a blind nut problem. Cut a strip of 1/4" stainless and tapped it for the bolt. It was only an 1/8th wider on each side of the threaded hole. With a piece of string I made a toggle around a stick of wood. Carefully filled the threaded hole with Vaseline from the back. Didn't want any where it might prevent adhesion. Smeared JB weld all over the stainless. Pushed the stainless into the hole and pulled the string tight. Centered the threads in the hole and waited overnight. The next day, I cut the string and slowly and careful ran a tap into the new toggle nut to clean out any of the JB weld that might have fouled the threads.

Worked great.

Duncan

Sat Oct 03, 2020 4:39 am

1 yes, plus nut. Great things. Yakima uses them on roof rails installs.

2 I've had luck installing the same size rivnut if I flattenrd the old hole.

Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:24 am

This is why I don’t like rivnuts. That’s a huge hole there.

Anyhow I understood the awning bracket load was carried on the gutter and it was go Westy that recommended the securing bolts.

This came up before where the owner managed to drill in the wrong spot and found an inner panel that prevented the rivnut from seating.

There was a discussion about using a modern adhesive to secure the leg of the bracket of the side of the van vs the Swiss cheese method.

I hate when a project takes an ugly turn. Best of luck sorting it out.

Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:36 am

You need a jack-nut. Google it.

Sat Oct 03, 2020 7:44 am

Here is a rivet nut kit on amazon.
https://www.amazon.com/Metric-Plated-Rivnuts-Tread...NrPXRydWU=

Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:10 am

Bulli Klinik wrote: You need a jack-nut. Google it.

NO!..jack nuts are thin versions of Plus nuts. The jack nuts can be effective in some applications but tend to be weak metal. The plus nut (cross nut) is MUCH stronger and need s a smaller hole for the relative bolt size

Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:23 am

If it were me, at this point, I would tap it flat, paint to prevent rust, and snap in a plastic cap with silicon. The bracket foot will hide the repair. You can weld it if/when you repaint.

I have driven ~15k miles with my ARB hanging off the gutters on my 86, highway and offroad with double nuts on the gutter pinch bolts and have never had any concern it would come off.
In fact it is a PIA to get off even with the brackets loosened up, so I saved those rivnuts and their headaches for a rainy day.

Perhaps 84 gutter profile differs or GW redesigned and the bracket making it less secure?