TheSamba.com :: View topic - Torn CV Boot

Thu Oct 21, 2021 10:47 am

Hey folks, I've been hearing a klunking sound coming from the rear of my van, mostly slow speed turns. The van is a 1984 GL, 2wd. 4 speed.

I took a look and the Pass side CV boot is torn on the axle side, outer boot. Grease is slung all over the inside of the trailing arm.

When I bought the van last year, the PO gave me a used spare axle and said that it was probably better to rebuild that one, rather than buy new replacement axle/CV joints.

Here are some pics of the used axle.

Obviously it's hard to tell the condition of the used axle. And it must have been taken out for a reason (maybe the weird cut open part of the boot?).

So what I'm looking for are suggestions of what to do. Should I pull apart, clean and inspect this used axle? And if it looks good, repack it and get a new boot or boots? Then I can do an axle swap with the one on my van.

Or should I simply remove the axle from my van and clean/inspect/repack and new boots? I was hoping to not have the van apart for days at a time.

Thanks for the help!

Thu Oct 21, 2021 10:55 am

Hi
Is your van automatic or manual? Automatics have different axle lengths on each side.
I would take apart the used axle you show in the picture. After taking it apart and cleaning it, you'll inspect it and judge whether it is a good rebuild candidate.

Make sure you know which part goes where, don't mix the inner cage from one side with the outer cage from the other side for example.

Thu Oct 21, 2021 10:57 am

A couple of resources:
https://www.vanagononline.com/articles/cv-joint-servicing-all-vanagon/
http://volksweb.relitech.com/cvjoints.htm
Have fun!

Thu Oct 21, 2021 11:10 am

If the CV Joint(s) was klunking, it is highly likely pretty bad worn. However, I've experienced similar circumstances but took care of them almost immediately with good results.

So, it could be a toss up whether or not a new boot and grease will extend the life of the CV Joint(s). I would have no issue giving it a try. Some folks don't like having to remove and install, thus would not make the gamble.

As for the used CV Joint, I suspect it may have been clunking too! As suggested, take it apart and clean up the grease for a good inspection. Show us the pics.

Thu Oct 21, 2021 11:24 am

You've to take it apart to see the wear in order to assess whether it's a candidate for rebuild.

Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:05 pm

So you do not rebuild an axle. The axle is the metal shaft that the CVs are mounted on. Old axles are fine as axles it is the Cv joint that wears. In order to see the condition of the old CV and the one on your bus that was clunking you need to remove them from the axle and take them apart and clean and inspect. This is a messy but not technically difficult thing to do. There are several good topics here on doing this.

I am on my phone so hopefully someone can direct you to some good references.

Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:09 pm

Thanks for the links! The van is manual trans VicVan.

I also noticed I was able to slide the axle in and out much more on the bad side, but I figured the boot being torn probably allowed more movement on that axle.

The driver side (good boots) still slides in and out some, but not nearly as much.

If the CV is already toast, how bad is it to drive it for a couple more weeks?

Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:32 pm

Probably not a problem, but no can give you an answer with 100% certainty. CVs can bind and pop apart suddenly if something catches a worn spot.

If you plan on just putting it back together, pull the boot back and clean it out with brakekleen/carb cleaner and then stuff it full of fresh grease. Even just wiping off any grease you can reach and adding fresh grease will be an improvement. It just takes a bit to clean it.

Or don't. Whatever. :)

Thu Oct 21, 2021 4:50 pm

69tr6r wrote: Thanks for the links! The van is manual trans VicVan.

I also noticed I was able to slide the axle in and out much more on the bad side, but I figured the boot being torn probably allowed more movement on that axle.

The driver side (good boots) still slides in and out some, but not nearly as much.

If the CV is already toast, how bad is it to drive it for a couple more weeks?

CVs are supposed to slide in and out, they have to do so to instantly adapt to different lengths as the suspension moves up and down. Besides noise, the only way I know of to tell if a CV is bad while it is still installed on the vehicle is to raise each wheel in turn and move the axle in and out while applying heavy torque to the tire wheel assembly. If you can feel the balls popping in and out of the divots the joint may well be past it's service life. Once you have taken the half axles off the car the only way to determine wear and life expectancy is to tear them down.

Thu Oct 21, 2021 7:33 pm

They will make noise with minimal damage for 5-10k

You need to clean and repack them every 30k. Those are 90k overdue.

Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:24 am

In my experience very few new parts have proven to be as good as a lightly worn original part.
The exception is of course cooling and fuel components. It is smart to get that aging plastic out and replaced with new metal.

However CV joints are useable way beyond just light wear.
Clean them up and examine them.

For boots?
There is a thread on here about using Tiquan genuine VW boots. I am 10,000 miles on mine now with no failures.
So many of the “proper” replacement boots are failing very early.

Clean up the joints, there are many how tos on here and if you question the wear post photos here.

DAVE

Fri Oct 22, 2021 6:07 am

Thank you guys. I have been looking at the Tiguan boots too, based on the forum thread.

I will keep this post updated as to what I find. I'm pretty busy with work and life at this point, so it may be a few weeks.

Fri Nov 12, 2021 5:50 am

So I took apart the spare axle that came with my van. I will not have to worry about using this axle. Take a look at the first section I cleaned up.
I stopped right there. No need to see anything else.

I may take apart the axle on the van tomorrow and see what that looks like.

Fri Nov 12, 2021 7:07 am

Yep, that is toast.

Just to be clear on terms. What you have in the pics is the Constant Velocity (CV) joint.

The axle is the metal shaft that the CVs slide onto.

Even if the CVs are toast keep the axle itself as a spare. You can put new Lobro CVs on it and you'll have a good easy to swap in part for the future.

Original axles are much better than the replacements available today it seems, they are machined better IMO.

Fri Nov 12, 2021 3:50 pm

Actually, if the balls are good …… clean it, lube it, flip the rotational wear mounting, install new boots, go run it!

Dave

Fri Nov 12, 2021 4:44 pm

Is that van lifted? That’s a really nasty failure for a CV

Driving through Shelton twice a week!!

Sat Nov 13, 2021 8:54 am

I took apart the axle (gonna keep calling it that dobryan :wink: )that is on the passenger side of the van. Both boots were torn, and that was the side that I could hear klunking. One of the bolts on the wheel side was about to fall off, and another was only hand tight. Not a good sign.

Anyway, I disassembled the wheel side CV joint, and this is what I found.

Definitely worn, but not as bad as the spare I had. I also found, in the box of spare parts the PO gave me, a couple of CV boots in good, usable condition. I briefly thought about rebuilding the CV's, installing the good boots, and flipping the axle.

Then I said nah, I'm going to order new CV joints and do it once.
Anyone have experience with these joints from FCP Euro? I order a lot of stuff from them, they are local to me and they have lifetime warranty on everything.
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/porsche-cv-joint-gkn-94433190100

The van is not lifted, as far as I know Abscate. Cool to hear you swing by my neck of the woods! I'll keep an eye out for another Vanagon!

Thanks for the advice guys!

Sat Nov 13, 2021 10:30 am

You got me thinking Dave. Maybe I should clean it up and flip it?

The balls don't look too bad. I have to see if I can figure out which way the tranny side was though. When I took it off the axle, I just didn't pay attention to which end is which.

The wheel side is still laid out like I remember.

I suppose it's not the end of the world if I mess it up and install it the way it was. It will just wear sooner?

Ugh, I hate having my van in pieces waiting for parts!

T/A

Sat Nov 13, 2021 10:44 am

It doesn't reverse the CV wear pattern to swap the ends of an axle.
You have to move the CVs or complete axle to the other side of the tranny.
Which CV goes to the tranny doesn't matter there either.

It isn't the direct of rotation of the CV joint that matters to the wear points.
It is the locations of internal contact forces due to the twisting of the axle by the tranny flange under engine load.

Mark

Sat Nov 13, 2021 3:22 pm

Thank you Mark. I understand now.

Looking over the inner CV joint parts, and I see wear on 2 areas in the groove where the balls sit. Does this mean the axles may have been flipped already?

Or is that just normal wear?

Thanks