TheSamba.com :: View topic - Advise on Front suspension Setup Super beetle: adjusting Camber

Mon Nov 21, 2022 4:56 am

Last week I saw a TV show where they replaced the old and worn out rubber suspension bushes by new polyurethane ones on an old car. I remembered the way the rubber bushes on my super beetle look and decided to replace them. Yesterday I disassembled them and as you can see on the second picture the stabiliser bar bushes are quite worn. I will replace them by polyurethane bushes, as well as the trailing arm bushes. Hopefully the handling will improve.

The trailing arms are mounted on the chassis by excentric bolts, so camber can be adjusted. I made some markings on them before disassembling them as can be seen in the third picture. Unfortunaly it took some effort to get them out on one side and the markings have gone... :roll: I was already having doubts about the position/alignment considering the difference between the left and right side.

Is there a way to set the camber by yourself? And what are the influences of the camber on the handling? Or is it not that important except for uneven tire wear? Hoping to get some more info here.

Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:07 am

Wow, those bushings very very ripe for replacement. You're going to enjoy a substantial improvement in handling and feel after replacing everything.

Unless you have previous experience setting camber, it's probably worth your while to have the alignment specs set professionally, then you can make note of the settings on the car for future alignment needs. With bushings that worn, it's pointless to try to note the current settings as they will be quite different with the new bushings.

By the way, I've had six different Super Beetles since the early 90s and ALWAYS replace all front bushings with urethane immediately with excellent results.

H2OSB

Mon Nov 21, 2022 7:07 am

Yes, have your car aligned.

Those eccentrics, and the bushings, ultimately determine the track width of the front end. This in turn changes the toe in/out specs, simply replacing the bushings will have altered the alignment.

Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:53 am

X2, have your car professionally aligned. I wasted a day doing a garage alignment on my standard. We really thought it was close...NO WHERE near! Plus there's adjustment to be made at the rear suspension as well. Mine was quite a bit out. Let me tell you, the difference in handling was night and day!

Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:11 pm

Be careful, professionally aligned kind of depends on your definitions of the words "professional" and "aligned".

In my own personal experience, most "professionals" don't have a clue how to align a Beetle. I've never seen one properly set and lock the steering box before the alignment. I've had more than one try to tell me there was no way to adjust the camber and caster on "these cars". The last time I took my machine to an alignment shop, I watched the guy put it up on the rack, try and fail to find the specs, take it back off the rack and drive it around the parking lot for a while. He then told me it was all good and charged me $25.

I've done my own alignments ever since. Very accurate, 4-wheel alignments are really not difficult if you understand what you're trying to achieve, and why. A flat and level floor, two string lines, a good ruler and an angle finder are all you need.

Tue Nov 22, 2022 5:01 am

Thanks for the comments. I will replace the bushes and will have the car aligned.

Can the rear suspension also be aligned? I am considering to replace the rubber bushes on the rear by PU bushes as well but I just read it is not an easy job. Don't now the state of the bushes on the rear, but it wouldn't surprise me if they are in the same state. Can I check by just removing the plate?
Of course, if it ain't broke, don't fix it...

Tue Nov 22, 2022 9:41 am

put some grease on the backs and sides of the big eccentric washers...i've seen alignment shops turn the bolts and rather than spinning, the rear washers stayed put and the bolt rounded out the D shaped hole in the washer...the bolts with coarse threads (10x1.5) were more prone to do this than the earlier fine thread ones....past experience with people that replaced the rear spring plate bushings with red urethane ones was that they squeaked so badly that they removed them and went back to rubber...this wasnt observed to be an issue with the fronts and urethane ones were superior to aftermarket rubber ones that were too soft and caused the front end to shimmy

Tue Nov 22, 2022 9:50 am

mr2cv wrote: Thanks for the comments. I will replace the bushes and will have the car aligned.

Can the rear suspension also be aligned? I am considering to replace the rubber bushes on the rear by PU bushes as well but I just read it is not an easy job. Don't now the state of the bushes on the rear, but it wouldn't surprise me if they are in the same state. Can I check by just removing the plate?
Of course, if it ain't broke, don't fix it...

Urethane can be noisy and harsher. Rubber lasted 50 years, why change what works?

Big job, but there are threads (see "lowering" topics). Do this before any alignment. In all likelihood, it won't need to be changed once new bushings are in place. Rear alignment is just for toe; camber is built into the design and will be correct if toe is even close. Shops will not know how to adjust rear toe... it means loosening the diagonal arms and sliding the spring plate forward or backward. Most will not touch it! You will probably need to take it to a VW/Porsche specialist if you don't do it yourself.

Thu Nov 24, 2022 11:26 pm

So I mounted the new PU bushes in the front suspension yesterday evening. Not a hard job. I managed to get the setup the same as it was (position marks were very visible on the chassis). When the car was on it's wheels again I held a level against the rims: the setup is completely off. I think my camber is at the moment 6° instead of 1° and have been driving like that since I bought the car (some 2500 km ago). So next job is to have that corrected! I'm very curious how the car will drive with new bushes and corrected wheel geometry.

Fri Nov 25, 2022 6:03 am

I've heard many times urethane bushings can be noisy, so out of an over abundance of concern I always use copious amounts of the silicone grease that usually comes with urethane bushings. I've literally not heard a single squeak associated with the urethane bushings on the 4 cars I've replaced them on.

Regarding harshness, I came into Super Beetles from a race prepped VW GTI that was my daily driver, so the suspension has never felt too harsh to me. Sporty,but not harsh or punishing.

H2OSB

Fri Nov 25, 2022 10:29 am

mr2cv wrote: Thanks for the comments. I will replace the bushes and will have the car aligned.

Can the rear suspension also be aligned? I am considering to replace the rubber bushes on the rear by PU bushes as well but I just read it is not an easy job. Don't now the state of the bushes on the rear, but it wouldn't surprise me if they are in the same state. Can I check by just removing the plate?
Of course, if it ain't broke, don't fix it...

The urethane bushings you want to use are the black graphite impregnated ones like the ones Energy Suspension sells.

https://f1-fabrication.myshopify.com/products/ener...gs-9-9105g

There are 2 sets of bushings on the rear spring plates. An outer and inner one on each side.

Sat Nov 26, 2022 9:04 pm

beetlenut wrote: mr2cv wrote: Thanks for the comments. I will replace the bushes and will have the car aligned.

Can the rear suspension also be aligned? I am considering to replace the rubber bushes on the rear by PU bushes as well but I just read it is not an easy job. Don't now the state of the bushes on the rear, but it wouldn't surprise me if they are in the same state. Can I check by just removing the plate?
Of course, if it ain't broke, don't fix it...

The urethane bushings you want to use are the black graphite impregnated ones like the ones Energy Suspension sells.

https://f1-fabrication.myshopify.com/products/ener...gs-9-9105g

There are 2 sets of bushings on the rear spring plates. An outer and inner one on each side.

This is absolutely true, and the only bushings I've ever used.

H2OSB

Sat Nov 26, 2022 9:50 pm

The Bentley manual has a small section on alignment with toe and camber adjustments, with the specs and tolerance range. An optical alignment machine *should* help get as close as possible to factory numbers, but it all depends upon the mechanic doing the job. There is no magic to it, just numbers and angles.