TheSamba.com :: View topic - EJ22 Phase 2 Timing Belt breakage, syncro hi-top

Sun Jan 26, 2025 7:50 pm

Heading North on I5 today just South of Ferndale (WA) my engine started missfiring and then all power lost, Engine spins freely but no compression at all. Presuming my timing belt broke. I have 70k miles on the belt, no idea what the engine mileage is but way more than 100k for sure, the van has 280k.

Question now is how much damage and how to remedy at reasonable time/cost.

It's an interference engine (EJ22 phase 2 from a 99 Imprezza). My guess at minimum is head/valve job, might need new engine. I can't find any EJ22 phase 2 engines for sale online. Any suggestions for the best way forward from here?

Sun Jan 26, 2025 8:04 pm

have you called these guys
https://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/ptd/d/mountlake-terrace-jdm-japanese-used/7819092825.html

Sun Jan 26, 2025 8:08 pm

Thanks, I will try them

Sun Jan 26, 2025 11:28 pm

If I can't find another EJ22 phase 2 are there any other Subaru engines that would be almost plug and play using more or less the same adapter plate, engine mounts and electronics, manifold, plumbing etc.

Sun Jan 26, 2025 11:50 pm

l'm no expert, but l think as long as the exhaust ports are the same, and the intake ports are the same, you should be able to use an EJ25.
some subaru's have a single port exhaust, some have twin exhaust ports.
post a picture of your engine.
l think if you keep all your intake, and there for electronics, and if the exhaust is the same, you are set.
l think your engine has a single port exhaust, from my limited experience with them.
long boring story, someone sold an engine to a customer of mine, claiming it to be a california legal EJ22, OBD1 engine, l knew it wasn't, because unfortunately l helped load it into the van, then the guy my customer bought it from, purchased it, and l told him that the engine was not legal here, he said the van it was going into was from out of state and it didn't matter, so it went to LA, my customer drove up there to get it, as soon as he got to my place with it, l recognised it immediately as l'd put the straps on it, to hold it to the cart it was on.
my customer was an unhappy man, and has friends in legal places, so he was able to be refunded pretty quickly, anyway, that engine was a 1999 EJ22, it had single port exhaust heads.
that engine stayed here for a bit, and now is in a van that's l think on long island.

Mon Jan 27, 2025 12:09 am

Thanks, so you are saying that if I transferred my intake and exhaust manifold (single port) from my EJ22 to a EJ25 it should all work with minimal other work?

What year EJ25 would I be looking for?

Mon Jan 27, 2025 1:58 am

potentially, yes, if the outsides look the same.
like l said, l don't know, l've got limited experience, and now you know almost as much as l do.
if there's a junk yard near you, take a walk though it, even if there's not a complete engine, look at what's there.
take a few pictures.
usually the year of the car is written on it, when they are there.

shepherdsond wrote: Thanks, so you are saying that if I transferred my intake and exhaust manifold (single port) from my EJ22 to a EJ25 it should all work with minimal other work?

What year EJ25 would I be looking for?

Mon Jan 27, 2025 2:41 am

From Brent Weide's page (links)there is John Lemley for used engines if he's still in business (down the road near Portland I think) 800 5719955
https://www.weidefamily.net/vanagon/

Mon Jan 27, 2025 5:57 am

70k on a timing belt seems a bit soon. Wouldn’t it be simpler and less money just to replace the bent valves?

Mon Jan 27, 2025 7:11 am

If your looking for a 2.2 the Lynwood pick and pull has one that is very clean. Looks like it was rebuilt.

But like above, rebuild your heads and a timing belt would be the way I would go. I think the 2.5 single cam heads also fit with better flow and build.

Good luck

Mon Jan 27, 2025 9:01 am

2.2 was 60k, then bumped up to 100-105K, I can't recall at the moment. But people fail to realize that TIME is an issue, so 60k or 5 years, 8 years or 100k whichever comes first

I bet you had an idler fail. usually the cogged one gets really raspy and blows up

You're looking at valves, minimum. These bounce back pretty well even after the pistons kiss the valves.

The other thing is you can throw all of the above intervals to the trash is you have an exhaust cooking the timing belt. So if your muffler is in close proximity, I would do the 60k/5 year no matter what engine you have

Mon Jan 27, 2025 9:06 am

Good point on new belt and old idlers.
Also was the new belt Aisin or Amazon?

Quote: 70k miles on the belt, no idea what the engine mileage is but way more than 100k for sure,

What do you mean by "way more"?

100k more? 200k more?

I don't know what a '99 Impreza 2.2 looks like but maybe call Smallcar.com and ask them if you can use an EJ25.
WHat "conversion kit" do you have?
There is an oilpan change in 2010 that you'll have to deal with, maybe just buy a new SmallCar 5qt oilpan.
If your conversion can fit it.

A 130hp EJ22 is safer for your (very expensive) 90hp gearbox than a 165HP EJ25.

=========================================
=== My Subaru JDM EJ25 Saga (mostly the good parts) =====
=========================================
I bought a total turd EJ25 from https://www.jdmenginedepotinc.com in New Jersey.
It was an absolute nightmare. Exhaust manifold covered in oil, inside and out. They were well-versed in "keeping my money".
They had many tricks, and zero intention on making good, even though their website stated that they would guarantee the condition.
VISA denied my chargeback two times as the NewJersey seller fought hard.
Each time VISA said it was their "FINAL" decision.
There is very very little protection buying 'used parts'.
I eventually got my money back, but it was easily $2000 of (my) effort.
So it was still a net-loss.

Then from "recommendations"..... I bought an EJ25 " ~2010 JDM engine" from Foreign Engines (^^Markswagen link^^) and they went to a decent effort to show me it was good before purchase, and said if not they'll exchange it.

Well.....it turned out to be an oil drinker, but I didn't wanna take it out and "THOUGHT" I could "heal it" with special elixirs etc. Anyway it drank a quart every 1100 miles. I tell myself that all the exixirs and effort may bave reduced consumption from 1100 to 1200 miles per quart, but you cannot really measure that accurately.

I never asked Foreign Engines if 1100 miles was enough consumption for an exchange. Apparently Subaru was NOT warrantying new cars at 1200 miles per qt, so I didn't think the Foreign Engines would. And time passed.

The engine ran great and I kept feeding it oil, eventually stopped draining oil altogether, because I was replacing the oil every 5,000 miles anyway with the total loss oiling system (like a 2-stroke). I changed just the filter periodically. I have to admit total loss was a little easier than then draining ritual. But it WAS dispersing 5 qts of oil all over the 'varmint.

Anyway I had a timing belt problem because it was an automatic engine without the "Subaru Belt Guide" (for manual gearboxes). I bent a bunch of valves (in my driveway). I was told by a Subaruguru that if I bent valves "with the starter", it was feasible to "simply" replace bent with new, but I did not listen....
and had the heads fully rebuilt - at eye-popping expense.

But one thing I did different was,,,,, the cylinders and rings measured out to be well within Subaru specs. My engine appeared to be "low miles". And I suppose the pistons nd rings were very well-lubed. So I replaced ONLY the oil-rings with new Hastings rings, re-using the original Subaru compression rings. The engine doesn't drink a drop of oil now. The old Subaru oil rings were totally 'relaxed', almost no cylinder-wall pressure at all.

So..... if you do find that a JDM EJ25 will bolt up to your exhaust and intake, you might consider putting in new Hastings oil rings. Just a thought. Not particularly "easy" job but it's not costly. Maybe bore-scope the cylinders and if they have cross-hatch in the high-wear zones, ....... you may find yourself in the Sodozone....

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=10190932
EJ25 JDM that I've put 25,000 miles on (and took it apart!)

Also I unbolted my intake and hoisted it up, hanging on straps,
crapping out the longblock from below,
in the dead of winter,
on gravel.
It was misery.

Stuffed the engine back up from below,
and dropped the intake back on.

The engine lit instantly, like I just shut it off yesterday.
That was kinda fun at the very end....
Spirited discussion with all my Samba homies was fun too.

Mon Jan 27, 2025 9:10 am

skills@eurocarsplus wrote: The other thing is you can throw all of the above intervals to the trash is you have an exhaust cooking the timing belt. So if your muffler is in close proximity, I would do the 60k/5 year no matter what engine you have

I had this thought when I was installing my exhaust. Thank you for confirming. I think this is a really critical thing for swapped vanagon owners to keep in mind.

Mon Jan 27, 2025 9:13 am

4Gears4Tires wrote: skills@eurocarsplus wrote: The other thing is you can throw all of the above intervals to the trash is you have an exhaust cooking the timing belt. So if your muffler is in close proximity, I would do the 60k/5 year no matter what engine you have

I had this thought when I was installing my exhaust. Thank you for confirming. I think this is a really critical thing for swapped vanagon owners to keep in mind.

Can you cook a belt thru the plastic Subaru belt cover?

Mon Jan 27, 2025 10:24 am

Sodo wrote:

Can you cook a belt thru the plastic Subaru belt cover?

of course you can

The newer setup with the cat/crossover that cooks the belt from the factory has some pretty good heat shielding on the OE pipes, but every time I get in there plastic is brittle and crumbling, especially on the right inner timing cover.

and to answer the o/p yes, your manifold should work on a 2.5. it's late enough (obd2) that it shouldn't be an issue. It was the OBD1 stuff that wouldn't work

but don't go doing the 2.5 lower end and 2.2 heads to build out a "frankenmotor" I did this with great results, but the reality is I could have built out a 2.5 way easier than CC'ing heads and getting custom head gaskets made

Mon Jan 27, 2025 10:38 am

I made a heat shield for my 2.2L Subaru that mounts the same as the original WBXer one, took two tries but the second one fits well and it very easy to remove and reinstall, maybe five minutes to take it off and ten to put it back on, max.

Mon Jan 27, 2025 2:53 pm

In a situation like this, I’d do an autopsy then decide how to proceed. I wouldn’t necessarily throw the baby out with the bathwater yet.

Mon Jan 27, 2025 3:40 pm

MarkWard wrote: In a situation like this, I’d do an autopsy then decide how to proceed. I wouldn’t necessarily throw the baby out with the bathwater yet.

valves are for sure bent, no way around it. if he's at the point of "not sure what to do" with a ton of miles on this, it would make sense to re-power imho, but that depends on the finances

Mon Jan 27, 2025 5:05 pm

I have a bad habit of fixing things. :wink:

Mon Jan 27, 2025 5:15 pm

I'd stick to putting a 2.2 back in there. Or keeping your heads and doing a 2.2/2.5 franken build (I know skills says NO). Swapping fully to a 2.5 will be a new harness and computer and more work than you want to do or pay to do. (looks like you were researhcing frankenbuilds in 2016 - did you take out a motor in the same way then??)

Options local to Bellingham - Reed auto machine (out off bakerview) can be hard to get ahold of and hard to keep to a schedule but can do whatever head work or bottom end work you might need if you can get the engine to them. I've had them do some work and was happy. I think this is where Josh at reference takes machine work for subaru swap stuff he works on.

Rallysport NW would likely also work on your van/engine but will be more expensive than reed/diy or reed/reference. Same for SK on iowa.