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1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube???
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jimmyp1000
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2022 8:07 am    Post subject: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

I have a 1950 Beetle that came incomplete.
I am trying to figure out how the accelerator cable exits the chassis and links to the engine, because as far as I can see there is no bowden cable to take up the "flex" as the engine moves on it's mounts, and so if the engine moves on the mounts it in effect can pull the accelerator cable.
What am I missing here?
Where those conduits exit the chassis I can push on a bowden for the clutch, but the accelerator has nothing for a bowden to push onto as it seems recessed compared to clutch and choke conduits.
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D. Haviland
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:43 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Accelerator cable does not use a bowden tube. I'm not sure about a 1950, but my 1952 zwittter, i believe has an oval shaped rubber grommet type thing where the cable exits the tunnel.
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rod_vw
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2022 1:02 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

No Bowden outer on the clutch cable either.

That came in at 1st October 1952.
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jimmyp1000
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2022 4:54 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Thanks for the answers.
This explains why I couldn't find any of the parts I was looking for (that don't exist......).
It is odd, and I also couldn't find any pictures how it should be.
Presumably this all works OK, but it does feel wrong, as the engine/trans moves it affects the relative position of and the tension on the cables.
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rod_vw
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2022 5:30 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

It all works OK on our '46 but the early transmission with the cone shaped front mounting doesn't move any where near as much as later types.

If you are struggling for diagrams etc. feel free to give me a shout and I'll see what I can find.
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3foldfolly
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:06 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Split bugs didn't have clutch cable boden tubes?
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sled
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2022 7:29 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

3foldfolly wrote:
Split bugs didn't have clutch cable boden tubes?


that is correct, they did not.
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jimmyp1000
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:39 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

rod_vw wrote:
It all works OK on our '46 but the early transmission with the cone shaped front mounting doesn't move any where near as much as later types.

If you are struggling for diagrams etc. feel free to give me a shout and I'll see what I can find.


Hi Rod,
If you have a diagram that shows the routing it would be great.

Thanks
James
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Eric&Barb
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:28 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Not till the early 1960s did the accelerator bowden tube get used as a factory part.

Down on the first page of the below thread there is an image that shows the earlier kind of paper clip bracket used probably back to 1938.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=400171&highlight=accelerator+bowden+tube
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Blue Baron
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 02, 2022 10:04 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Unless the transmission mounts are weak or broken, movement of the drive unit is not enough to noticeably affect the accelerator cable.

On the other hand, clutch judder was a problem with splits (ask me how I know), necessitating the addition of the bowden tube.
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Tsettle
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2023 4:09 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Hey I thought I’d jump in on this as I’m going through the same thing on my 49.
I’ve actually fitted a later 53-59 split case box with early bus nose cone.
Pretty much the same setup minus all crash gears.
I have a mount on this box for a Bowden tube, if I were to fit one would I need to buy a longer cable? Will the Bowden fit into the hole where the clutch cable comes out of the chassis.

Cheers Terry
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Eric&Barb
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2023 5:16 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Interesting question!

Can only say right now that you need to fix those axle boots or they are going to get torn up all too soon.
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Tsettle
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 4:48 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Eric&Barb wrote:
Interesting question!

Can only say right now that you need to fix those axle boots or they are going to get torn up all too soon.


I’ll give the boots a quick swivel and tighten when I’m back in the garage.

Be good to know what/if anyone has done this sort of think with clutch cables before.
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peter schepens
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2023 10:55 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Eric&Barb wrote:
Interesting question!

Can only say right now that you need to fix those axle boots or they are going to get torn up all too soon.

That means.. the seam with the row of bolts.. sits on 14 hrs.. Not 12. Better is 15 hrs.. Flat.. WHY? The seam will be pushed in when the body is on the chassis and been driven.. in and out due to the action on the axles.. But a flat seam wil just be bend a bit.. And it is written in the VW workshop manual. There is not that much oil in the tubes.;
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2023 1:53 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

peter schepens wrote:
Eric&Barb wrote:
Interesting question!

Can only say right now that you need to fix those axle boots or they are going to get torn up all too soon.

That means.. the seam with the row of bolts.. sits on 14 hrs.. Not 12. Better is 15 hrs.. Flat.. WHY? The seam will be pushed in when the body is on the chassis and been driven.. in and out due to the action on the axles.. But a flat seam wil just be bend a bit.. And it is written in the VW workshop manual. There is not that much oil in the tubes.;


Cheers for the info. I’ll be sure to sort them.
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nlorntson
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 10:12 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

My 49 but it has it's original crashbox:

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splitjunkie
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:12 pm    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

There isn't anything to mount the front of the bowden tube to. Cars that had bowden tubes had a piece of the clutch tube of the correct diameter that the front metal sleeve of the bowden cable slipped over. That isn't present on earlier cars so retrofitting one would require some modification and fabrication work. Splits had an oval shaped tube that came out of the pan that the clutch, accelerator and choke cables all came through. The rubber boot visible in nlorntson's pictures show the location. Bowden tube cars had the clutch tube pass through and extend far enough for the bowden tube to slip onto. It would take some innovation to fit a bowden tube on an early car.

The boot is number 4 in this diagram and you can see the oval tube on the pan.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Later cars had this arrangement.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Tsettle
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 3:12 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Ha great thanks Chris and Crazy VW Lady for the information. I think I’ll go ahead with the stock clutch cable setup on the later spilt case box and see how it goes. 👌🏼
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rod_vw
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 3:26 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

I think there was only 6mm difference in the length of the inner cable between the two versions.
Also as far as I remember the reason for the provision of the outer tube was to make clutch operation smoother. i.e. movement of the engine / transmission assembly was isolated from the cable. Probably made more pronounced as engine mountings became more flexible in an effort to reduce noise inside the car.
I don't find it any problem with the '46 and at this point I have a later crash box fitted with similar gearbox mountings to your three synchro one.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2023 11:35 am    Post subject: Re: 1950 Beetle accelerator cable - no bowden tube??? Reply with quote

Hey Rod

Thanks for adding in that information. Really helps and makes me feel confidant about the way it’s all going. 🙌🏼
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