181 1600 Dual Port Timing

JeffsThing · Posted: Fri Mar 24, 2023 2:27 pm Post subject: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Now that she is running again I wanted to check the timing. There are many threads about timing and the degree to time it also varies greatly. I have a timing light however my pully wheel only has 1 V mark. Not 3 marks as seen on many threads. I have a timing light but how do I know how much advance to set it at. And how do I know when it is set without the extra marks?
It has the Flame Thrower 40K coil, Pertronix ignition and a 34 PICT 3 carb. Vacuum advance and also the Retard but that line is just plugged. It runs fine but stumbles and backfires out of the top of the carb when you goose the gas or try and bring up the idle quickly. This is why I am thinking I need to adjust the timing. Am I wrong?

Deckard · Posted: Sun Mar 26, 2023 7:40 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Back when I could not afford a timing light I did it with a test light, aka static timing. This should put you in the ballpark. This link has instructions, plus a template for your pulley, assuming you have the stock one

https://hot-spark.com/Hot-Spark-009-VW-Type-I-Pulley-Degree-Template.pdf

heimlich · Posted: Sun Mar 26, 2023 9:27 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

What distributor do you have? Timing depends on the type of distributor and how many vacuum hoses connect to it.
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JeffsThing · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 6:16 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Thanks for the reply and the template. I have the dist. with 2 vacuum ports. The one on the front for vacuum advance and one on the back for the retard. I tried the test light set up and the car would just not run. I did the old school and turned the dist. at idle until it was "happy" or the highest RPM. then backed it off a hair. The car idles fine now bur it shows the timing mark way advanced. Almost to the point I can't see it with a timing light light. It is way to the left as you look at it from the rear of the car. If I set the timing per the template it would never start.

heimlich · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:10 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

74 Thing · Samba Member Joined: September 02, 2004 Posts: 7389

Post a picture of your engine.

Why is the retard line not hooked up?

With both the advance and retard vac hoses attached it should be timed at 5 degrees ATDC at idle.

You can check if your retard side of the dist is functioning by using your timing light and with it on when you disconnect the line from the distributor your timing should advance.

If you are just going to run the advance vac hose then timing should be 7 BTDC with the vac hose removed and plugged

JeffsThing · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 9:24 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Here is the Pulley wheel and the dist. Also there is no port for me to use for the Retard port from the dist. I have the EGR valve which goes to the front port, Advance to the side port to left and the cleaner to the bottom port left side. This is a 34 Pict 3 Carb.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

JeffsThing · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 9:25 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

I had used the "finding TDC" article to set this TDC for my pic. That was from Rob & Dave's.

JeffsThing · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 9:26 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

heimlich · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 9:54 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

If you are unfamiliar with your engine it is best to find TDC from the #1 spark plug. If you have used your engine in the past and you know it is correct you might not need to do that.
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JeffsThing · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:36 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

The engine ran fine before I had an engine fire. I was just making sure I actually had TDC and it lined up with the #1 spark plug.

heimlich · Last edited by heimlich on Thu Mar 30, 2023 6:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

74 Thing · Samba Member Joined: September 02, 2004 Posts: 7389

You have the egr hooked up to the wrong vacuum port on that carb. The one it is hooked up to is above the throttle plate and is for the retard port on the distributor.

The vacuum port on the passenger side of the carb is for the vacuum advance and yours is hooked up correctly.

The egr valve is supposed to connect to the fitting that is below the throttle plate and is low on the carb base and near the alternator and is capped in this photo
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=2194298

JeffsThing · Posted: Mon Mar 27, 2023 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Thanks for the pic. I was told by someone else that the port I have the EGR valve in was wrong for the retard. I don't have the lower port on my 34 PICT 3. I will try just capping the EGR and using that port for the retard.

74 Thing · Samba Member Joined: September 02, 2004 Posts: 7389

Good idea-you probably have the wrong 34pict3 carb for that set up.

JeffsThing · Posted: Tue Mar 28, 2023 11:05 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

It was on the car when I purchased about 5 years ago. I just went out and was going to make a solid gasket to block off the EGR. That way I could use that port. Low and behold the previous owner had already done that! Hooked up the Retard to it and checked the timing and played with the idle and air screws a little more. She seems to be running pretty good. No backfires out the carb anymore when I goose the engine. I will try a test drive later to see if it bogs down still or runs the wat she should. Thanks for all the help and suggestions.

JeffsThing · Posted: Wed Mar 29, 2023 12:04 pm Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Ok timed it with a dwell meter to just under 50*. I know it should be like 48* but I figured it was close enough. I played with it for a while. Idle now is right around 950 but fluctuates a little. I can goose the engine with no backfiring now but she really has no power under load. I start off and it is really sluggish. Plugs show a little on the rich side but not terrible and you can't smell it when when standing behind while idling. I am out of ideas now. Not sure what else could have been damaged with the fire. She doesn't sound the same as before but can't pinpoint what is different.

Anyone in the Sarasota FL. area that might know what they are doing? Any shops down here that are good that know the VW engines?

heimlich · Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2023 6:06 pm Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Send me a message and I can get you to a shop in FL. There's a few that have been around for a long time and know what they are doing.
_________________
www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here)

SilverThing · Posted: Thu Mar 30, 2023 10:22 pm Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

Did you check to make sure the plug wires are going to the right plugs? I got two backwards on my rig once. It idled surprisingly well on two cylinders, but had almost no power, unsurprisingly.

Did you set the timing with a timing light? It is possible to get 950 rpm idle even with the wrong timing.
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JeffsThing · Posted: Fri Mar 31, 2023 8:19 am Post subject: Re: 181 1600 Dual Port Timing

I will double check my plug wires again. Thanks


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