Engine/transmission frame mount points out of alignment

[BDorsey]

Hi all,

I could use some advice on how best to solve this problem.

1982 van, 2.0 L air cooled rebuilt engine and an 84 transmission, with a custom mount bracket at the nose, I believe.

Problem: The three mount points of the engine and transmission can not all be bolted at the same time. That is, with the transmission bolted to the frame at the nose, only one end of the mustache bar lines up with the bolt holes on the frame. If both mustache bar ends are bolted, the transmission mount doesn't line up. I believe the body is out of square, probably from a past collision. The old motor mounts are clearly bent out of shape from being under stress for years. The mustache bar is not bent, as far as I can tell.

So, these are the options I have thought of so far:

1. Bolt the mustache bar at both ends and modify/rebuild the transmission mount to align with the bolt holes. My concern with this is the effect it might have on shifting with the transmission not aligned correctly. Also, it's the hardest for me to accomplish. It would require welding and I am not a welder. But, I do have a friend that is, so not impossible.

2. Bolt the transmission mount and drill new holes in the frame for one of the mustache bar ends. This one is the easiest but has two possible drawbacks. First, the holes may be quite close to the edge of the frame such that it won't be sound. Second, this puts the engine to the back of the engine bay and the front seal is not super tight.

3. Bolt the transmission mount and force the mustache bar to align by pulling it into place. This is what the PO apparently did and I can make it work but it does wrench the motor mount rubber. It clearly worked for years, but I guess I just don't like the idea of stressing the motor mounts. That may be an unnecessary concern.

Any opinions on my solutions would be greatly appreciated. Any other solutions are welcome as well.

Thanks!
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1982 2.0L Aircooled Country Homes Camper

[Sodo]

[BDorsey]

Yep, the code indicates 1984.

The problem is more that things are out of square rather than the overall length being wrong. The photo shows the transmission mount when the mustache bar is bolted to the frame.

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1982 2.0L Aircooled Country Homes Camper

[ALIKA T3]

Usually it's the mustache bar that's out of square before the body

They get caught up and bent, it's not rare.

It's a tight fit to install a 091/1 transmission in place of the 091 on an aircooled, I saw it documented on TheSamba a while back, only once. Post pics of your transmission mount to help others!
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Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
Syncro http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...num+gadget

[markswagen]

l have a feeling that the moustache bar can be bolted on two ways around, one will let things align, the other way won't
on water cooled vanagons, there's a bolt sticking out in the center of the bar, that bolt, holds onto the exhaust shield, l'm not sure it's there on an aircooled.
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markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.

619 201 0310

[BDorsey]

Thanks for the thoughts.

There is a correct orientation for the mustache bar but I've confirmed that the mustache bar is connected correctly, arrows facing forward. I've also checked for any bend but it is straight along its length.

Here are some pics of the transmission mount:

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1982 2.0L Aircooled Country Homes Camper

[DanHoug]

i can't offer anything on 091 > 091/1 but your front trans mount rubber is ripped away from the carrier. as long as you're doing all the dicking around, get a new mount in there. mebbe your rear mounts have sagged out and tipped, causing everything to slough forward?? dunno.

the moustache mounting system is kinda pendulous with a fair amount of to and fro until the nose is locked in. looks close enough to fit with some shove. prolly time to measure the length of an 091 vs 091/1
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-dan
60% of what you find on the internet is wrong, including this post.

'87 Westy & '89 Westy both 2.1 4spd

Past projects can be found at--
www.thefixitworkshop.com

[ALIKA T3]

[ALIKA T3]

I would loosen the bolts from mustache bar to chassis and just pry that sucka from the nose cone end until it's happy sitting. The only parameter in this is the rubber mounts... Maybe something is off there? Or on the aluminum carrier somehow? If all checks good, just use persuasion until it sits lining up without prying.
_________________
Silicone Steering Boots and 930 Cv boots for sale in the classifieds.
Syncro transmission upgrade parts in the Classifieds.
Subaru EJ22+UN1 5 speed transmission
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=416343
Syncro http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...num+gadget

[MarkWard]

The center frame member where the transmission mounts up is likely correct. You need to build off that. A proper new bushing or a Delron bushing will locate the nose. Measure between the inner and outer drive flanges and equal those up. Then attach the engine bar however you securely can. You don’t want anything inside tension.
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[markswagen]

in this first picture, side to side, looks close enough to me, to be nudged across and bolted up.
front to back, with the bolt through, the two parts, again, with the slack in the various mounts, it looks to me like it'll bolt up.

[BDorsey]

Hey all,

Thanks much for all the replies. I have to clarify that the pictures I posted of the transmission mount were with it mostly disassembled and just to show the structure - it's not a good representation of the alignment. I realize that the mount itself is not custom, but maybe the bracket connected directly to the transmission is - I just remember seeing "custom transmission mount" in records I have from the PO.

Anyway, I ended up basically following MarkWard's advice. I agree that the nose mount in the center of the body is the least likely to be off so I bolted that up first. Then, with the engine bolted to the transmission, everything should be in alignment. Even prying the mustache bar forward to align the holes doesn't change the position of the engine, it just stretches the motor mounts.

So, I drilled new holes in the frame on the driver side to match the position of the mustache bar holes and used a 1/8" plate to reinforce it. I figure everything is in the same position it was before I removed the engine, except for that side of the mustache bar, and the engine mounts are now not under tension.

If anyone sees a flaw in the logic or implementation - please raise the alarm.

Cheers
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1982 2.0L Aircooled Country Homes Camper

[MarkWard]

Would be interested to hear how the tin work aligns in the engine compartment and how well it seals. Otherwise sounds fine.
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[BDorsey]

Mark - just to follow up, the tin fits fine but everything is shifted just a bit to the rear. The engine bay seal makes good contact everywhere except along a small section at the left front where it is just touching. I think it is good enough to seal though.

Got it running today! Timed, but idling a little high. Going on a two week road trip next week but can't get it fully broken-in in time so will have to take the 4runner - such a bummer.

Thanks again for the advice folks.
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1982 2.0L Aircooled Country Homes Camper