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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 80630
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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 Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2025 2:58 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| Bobs67vwagen wrote: |
| In reviewing some of the arguments made in this thread it brought me back to 1970 when my father and I went down to a local VW dealer and bought a new bug for $1839 plus tax so total cost around 2k after ny taxes. It was a good quality economy car, inexpensive to repair and could easily last more than 5 years if so desired. A comparable economy car today will cost 25 to 30k, 12 to 15 times the 1970 cost. Yes cars are better today, but are they that much better? |
FYI, $2000 in 1970 is equal to $16601.26 today. A new Subaru Impreza is $24,000 and yes, it's that much better. AWD, fuel injection, AC, power windows, airbags, lane departure..... etc.
So yes, it's only 0.5 times more and you get a much better and safer car.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
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oprn
Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016
Posts: 15289
Location: Western Canada
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| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2025 4:31 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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Glen... air bags qualify for the "safer" bit, FI is the "better" but the rest is just more stuff that is prone to failure especially the "etc." part.
I am a minimalist fan when it comes to cars and trucks. Stuff that don't make the wheels go around is just more junk to bite you in the asp at some point and THAT my friend accounts for the majority of the price increase I would wager. You are paying for all the added bling!
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Glenn
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 80630
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2025 4:42 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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Agreed, I had a 2025 service loaner for 4 months and turned off most of annoying safety stuff.
Give me roll up windows and knows for hvac.
_________________
Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2025 6:38 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| oprn wrote: |
Glen... air bags qualify for the "safer" bit, FI is the "better" but the rest is just more stuff that is prone to failure especially the "etc." part.
I am a minimalist fan when it comes to cars and trucks. Stuff that don't make the wheels go around is just more junk to bite you in the asp at some point and THAT my friend accounts for the majority of the price increase I would wager. You are paying for all the added bling! |
Airbags are safer till they arent. The Takata AirBag recall for example. Plus there is the long term reliabilty, will they still be safe after 50 years?
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Give Peace a Chance.
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Abscate
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2014
Posts: 24497
Location: NYC/Upstate/ROW
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| Posted: Fri Dec 12, 2025 7:02 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| Bobs67vwagen wrote: |
| In reviewing some of the arguments made in this thread it brought me back to 1970 when my father and I went down to a local VW dealer and bought a new bug for $1839 plus tax so total cost around 2k after ny taxes. It was a good quality economy car, inexpensive to repair and could easily last more than 5 years if so desired. A comparable economy car today will cost 25 to 30k, 12 to 15 times the 1970 cost. Yes cars are better today, but are they that much better? How do you factor in an electronic breakdown which may leave you stranded for an extended period of time and cost a lot to repair? I drive a 27 year old civic as my daily driver and it does everything I need it to do at a very low cost. I service and repair it and I am happy I can still do that to keep it as a dependable driver. I would never consider buying one of those new VW vans even though I can. I have always believed hybrids were the way to go until better technology comes along. I think what the governments in collaboration with the auto industry have done is the proverbial putting the cart before the horse. What else is new? |
You’ve price anchored in unadjusted dollars. You get a lot more car for capital dollar , probably since 2000 on
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2025 12:34 am Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| Abscate wrote: |
| Bobs67vwagen wrote: |
| In reviewing some of the arguments made in this thread it brought me back to 1970 when my father and I went down to a local VW dealer and bought a new bug for $1839 plus tax so total cost around 2k after ny taxes. It was a good quality economy car, inexpensive to repair and could easily last more than 5 years if so desired. A comparable economy car today will cost 25 to 30k, 12 to 15 times the 1970 cost. Yes cars are better today, but are they that much better? How do you factor in an electronic breakdown which may leave you stranded for an extended period of time and cost a lot to repair? I drive a 27 year old civic as my daily driver and it does everything I need it to do at a very low cost. I service and repair it and I am happy I can still do that to keep it as a dependable driver. I would never consider buying one of those new VW vans even though I can. I have always believed hybrids were the way to go until better technology comes along. I think what the governments in collaboration with the auto industry have done is the proverbial putting the cart before the horse. What else is new? |
You’ve price anchored in unadjusted dollars. You get a lot more car for capital dollar , probably since 2000 on |
Much of that modern electronics in new cars is a lot more un-need crap, more stuff to fail, harder to fix, not as user friendly. New cars suck.
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Give Peace a Chance.
Words to live by. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17989
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2025 12:10 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| zerotofifty wrote: |
| New cars suck. |
yes/no/maybe
I'd much rather drop a car in gear with heated seats vs fuck around with a carburetor
where we went wrong (in my opinion) is making all these cars "show cars" meaning all the crazy bullshit they'd show at the LA Auto Show or the New York International Auto Show on new or "future" models
Trying to integrate (and force) some of that shit has put a lot of people off, even the young people looking for a car. This is one of about a million articles about bringing back buttons:
https://www.motor.com/2025/11/carmakers-dial-back-screens-buttons/
Some of the new shit is nice, powerful but is built by fucking bean counters. Almost every transmission failure today is due to plastic fucking check balls in the valve body that wear down and get ingested into the rest of the transmission.
Stuff like that makes new cars a real headache. Same with electric water pumps. Now, cars have an "on demand" water pump instead of being mechanically driven. Those are a real treat to buy and install....
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Shonandb
Samba Member
Joined: January 12, 2019
Posts: 2321
Location: Vancouver, BC
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| Posted: Sat Dec 13, 2025 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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Saw 4 different ID Buzz when out for a drive today here locally in my Bus. I've been seeing a few each day when commuting. They seem to be selling fairly well here.
Additionally, I don't hesr anything about the problems with new cars that you guys are speaking about. Where is this info coming from? In the news or do you actually know people who are experiencing all these issues?.
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*******************************
76 Westy with a 2.5L Subaru SOHC + Vanagon (010) Automatic Transaxle
Build & Trip Thread: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=758760
Previous 1973 Panel Bus:
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Evil Clown
Live
Joined: January 08, 2009
Posts: 1493
Location: Wacky Macs
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2025 11:20 am Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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I call them the SK-ID (row) Buzz boats...
I spoke with this nice couple adventuring from Ohio back home...
She was very excited that I stopped and shared some stories with them...
He was kind of ready to get on the road!
I mean come on man they had chargers in the '60s before Hot Wheels that are better than this crap! Juice chargers etc etc stuff like that...
We can do better....
Carbon buzz print 
_________________
Quote from a Styx '83 song Mr (AI) Robocop
I'm schizophrenic, and so am I
| Quote: |
| kiss my airy VW ass |
| Quote: |
| Smoke the Rice Paper? |
Zeen wrote: "why would a bleedin' tree go to the post office?"
Because G.Washington used an axe on it 😂
Last edited by Evil Clown on Sun Dec 14, 2025 12:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2025 11:43 am Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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I rather have to rebuild a failed carb than deal with a failed central computer touch screen.
My Dad had a Mazda, many many years ago, top of the line, used motors to adjust the climate control vanes. It quit working, so he couldnt use the window defog function any more. It turned out it was a failed computer board, and the price for a new board was so high that he simply sold the car, at a discount. An older car uses cables and push rods to control the vents. easy stuff to fix, rarely breaks.
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Give Peace a Chance.
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Evil Clown
Live
Joined: January 08, 2009
Posts: 1493
Location: Wacky Macs
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| Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2025 12:22 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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True true...
Here is a good example from 2023 when I was in the Tesla plant parking lot talking to an engineer in Cupertino, California....
The articles were released about Tesla's battery drain from running the AC and other components...
I told the engineer in Tesla's parking lot to tell Elon to have the flip up (safari) windshields to vent the air directly without any power source...
He said well that'll bring in dirt and bugs etc...
I told him well you'd have to put some kind of a filter screen or something but temporarily it would ease the pain of the battery drain...
He said well I'll pass this idea on to Elon...
Right 
_________________
Quote from a Styx '83 song Mr (AI) Robocop
I'm schizophrenic, and so am I
| Quote: |
| kiss my airy VW ass |
| Quote: |
| Smoke the Rice Paper? |
Zeen wrote: "why would a bleedin' tree go to the post office?"
Because G.Washington used an axe on it 😂 |
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oprn
Samba Member
Joined: November 13, 2016
Posts: 15289
Location: Western Canada
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 9:36 am Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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A few years back my brother bought a Ford Escort. About 1/2 way through the winter the climate control quit. No heat, no defrost, no fan, nothing! He got checking around - asking knowledgeable people.
"Does it have a traction control light on?" "Yes, it just came on yesterday." "That is the problem, it's interconnected with the heating system." "You have got to be joking!" "Nope!"
Diving in the ice and snow had broken off one wire on one of the wheel speed sensors. A new speed sensor fixed the heating system! 
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Our cars get old, we get old but driving an old VW never gets old! |
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 10:59 am Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| Evil Clown wrote: |
True true...
Here is a good example from 2023 when I was in the Tesla plant parking lot talking to an engineer in Cupertino, California....
The articles were released about Tesla's battery drain from running the AC and other components...
I told the engineer in Tesla's parking lot to tell Elon to have the flip up (safari) windshields to vent the air directly without any power source...
He said well that'll bring in dirt and bugs etc...
I told him well you'd have to put some kind of a filter screen or something but temporarily it would ease the pain of the battery drain...
He said well I'll pass this idea on to Elon...
Right |
Tesla cant even do normal door handles, nor even on the glovebox door. You got to use the fucking touch TV screen to open the glove box, and the trunk too. That screen goes bad, and you are kind of screwed. Dead battery, good luck opening any of that!! hahahahahaha So stupid. Oh and that cyber fuck disaster.
I had to drive one, I was backing up, with a truck behind for parallel parking The rear view mirror is useless for view, but the tesla has a back up camera, but it showed a much bigger space between than I knew was there, so I opened the door a bit so I can lean my head out and look back while moving slowly in reverse, that dam car wont let the car move with the door open. Fuck that. Oh and I had to us a telephone app to drive it, pain in the ass. You see I got the tesla cause it belong to a friend I took to the air port, driving back a notice appeared on that dam TV screen telling me it didnt recognize my telephone any more, and thus I would not be able to drive it after I parked. Fortunately my friend was still at the airport so he was able to reload the app. Of course every time I walked by that stupid car parked at my house with my telephone it would wake up and unlock. I was concerned about taking that tesla anyplace for what if my telephone battery ran out?
Just use a dam metal key like has worked for decades. All this stupid complexity.
Oh and that dam lane assist. kept pulling the steering wheel every time I crossed a parallel line, such as to give space for a bicycle, or double parked truck or such, annoying as hell. Car had no steering feel either. a dull boring car at best, a computer pain in the ass much of the time. features for the sake of features. a touch screen for the radio, for the heater and defogger, what a pain to use. I guess they determined the lane assist was needed as drivers will drift while trying to use that dam touch TV screen, So much for night vision too with that dam TV screen Oh and the turn signal arm, it returns to center position while the signal is on. then you must look at that dam TV screen again to see which way the signal is flashing to you can figure out which way to move the center position arm to cancel the signal. It is a car designed by morons.
_________________
Sorry About That Chief.
Give Peace a Chance.
Words to live by.
Last edited by zerotofifty on Mon Dec 15, 2025 12:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17989
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 12:02 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| Shonandb wrote: |
Additionally, I don't hesr anything about the problems with new cars that you guys are speaking about. Where is this info coming from? In the news or do you actually know people who are experiencing all these issues?. |
it's everywhere, just google it. any tech/shop will tell you the same thing. for example, google ford/chevy/toyota/kia/hyundai engine recall. it's staggering the amount of garbage is getting put out there.
A fellow Volvo tech just messaged (with a bunch of photos):
(the IHFA is the Inverter Hi Voltage Front Axle)
When plugging into a level 2 charger, it made a loud boom. Front motor shorted to the case. Fried the IHFA. Polestar 3. 250 miles. Just keeps getting better.
These "legacy" manufacturers are a joke these days
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 12:22 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| Shonandb wrote: |
Additionally, I don't hesr anything about the problems with new cars that you guys are speaking about. Where is this info coming from? In the news or do you actually know people who are experiencing all these issues?. |
it's everywhere, just google it. any tech/shop will tell you the same thing. for example, google ford/chevy/toyota/kia/hyundai engine recall. it's staggering the amount of garbage is getting put out there.
A fellow Volvo tech just messaged (with a bunch of photos):
(the IHFA is the Inverter Hi Voltage Front Axle)
When plugging into a level 2 charger, it made a loud boom. Front motor shorted to the case. Fried the IHFA. Polestar 3. 250 miles. Just keeps getting better.
These "legacy" manufacturers are a joke these days |
Funny, I dont need a certain "level" gas pump to refuel my normal car, done in under five minutes, even if using a jerry can to fill up.
Under five minutes gives me plenty of time to clean my windshield while filling up the gas tank, any longer is a waste of time.
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Sorry About That Chief.
Give Peace a Chance.
Words to live by. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 17989
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 3:36 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| zerotofifty wrote: |
Funny, I dont need a certain "level" gas pump to refuel my normal car, done in under five minutes, even if using a jerry can to fill up. |
the point being is were this a level 1 (120v) charging say in a house, it more than likely would have burnt the house down.
I haven't spoken with him, but I'm going to guess the L2 charger was out in public somewhere. Either way, with the motor short it more than likely would have ended poorly if charged with a L1 setup
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| zerotofifty wrote: |
Funny, I dont need a certain "level" gas pump to refuel my normal car, done in under five minutes, even if using a jerry can to fill up. |
the point being is were this a level 1 (120v) charging say in a house, it more than likely would have burnt the house down.
I haven't spoken with him, but I'm going to guess the L2 charger was out in public somewhere. Either way, with the motor short it more than likely would have ended poorly if charged with a L1 setup |
Id think, Id hope there will be some fuse or breaker at the house to protect the house wires from a short.
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Sorry About That Chief.
Give Peace a Chance.
Words to live by. |
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Xevin
Samba Member
Joined: January 08, 2014
Posts: 9134
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| zerotofifty wrote: |
Tesla cant even do normal door handles, nor even on the glovebox door. You got to use the fucking touch TV screen to open the glove box, and the trunk too. That screen goes bad, and you are kind of screwed. Dead battery, good luck opening any of that!! hahahahahaha So stupid. Oh and that cyber fuck disaster.
I had to drive one, I was backing up, with a truck behind for parallel parking The rear view mirror is useless for view, but the tesla has a back up camera, but it showed a much bigger space between than I knew was there, so I opened the door a bit so I can lean my head out and look back while moving slowly in reverse, that dam car wont let the car move with the door open. Fuck that. Oh and I had to us a telephone app to drive it, pain in the ass. You see I got the tesla cause it belong to a friend I took to the air port, driving back a notice appeared on that dam TV screen telling me it didnt recognize my telephone any more, and thus I would not be able to drive it after I parked. Fortunately my friend was still at the airport so he was able to reload the app. Of course every time I walked by that stupid car parked at my house with my telephone it would wake up and unlock. I was concerned about taking that tesla anyplace for what if my telephone battery ran out?
Just use a dam metal key like has worked for decades. All this stupid complexity.
Oh and that dam lane assist. kept pulling the steering wheel every time I crossed a parallel line, such as to give space for a bicycle, or double parked truck or such, annoying as hell. Car had no steering feel either. a dull boring car at best, a computer pain in the ass much of the time. features for the sake of features. a touch screen for the radio, for the heater and defogger, what a pain to use. I guess they determined the lane assist was needed as drivers will drift while trying to use that dam touch TV screen, So much for night vision too with that dam TV screen Oh and the turn signal arm, it returns to center position while the signal is on. then you must look at that dam TV screen again to see which way the signal is flashing to you can figure out which way to move the center position arm to cancel the signal. It is a car designed by morons. |
Your friend didn’t give you the key card to use. That’s on him.
_________________
Keep on Busin'
| 67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!  |
| Clatter wrote: |
| Damn that Xevin... |
| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| I respect Xevin and he's a turd |
| SGKent wrote: |
My God! Xevin and I 100% agree  |
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zerotofifty
Samba Member
Joined: December 27, 2003
Posts: 4327
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 10:22 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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| Xevin wrote: |
| zerotofifty wrote: |
Tesla cant even do normal door handles, nor even on the glovebox door. You got to use the fucking touch TV screen to open the glove box, and the trunk too. That screen goes bad, and you are kind of screwed. Dead battery, good luck opening any of that!! hahahahahaha So stupid. Oh and that cyber fuck disaster.
I had to drive one, I was backing up, with a truck behind for parallel parking The rear view mirror is useless for view, but the tesla has a back up camera, but it showed a much bigger space between than I knew was there, so I opened the door a bit so I can lean my head out and look back while moving slowly in reverse, that dam car wont let the car move with the door open. Fuck that. Oh and I had to us a telephone app to drive it, pain in the ass. You see I got the tesla cause it belong to a friend I took to the air port, driving back a notice appeared on that dam TV screen telling me it didnt recognize my telephone any more, and thus I would not be able to drive it after I parked. Fortunately my friend was still at the airport so he was able to reload the app. Of course every time I walked by that stupid car parked at my house with my telephone it would wake up and unlock. I was concerned about taking that tesla anyplace for what if my telephone battery ran out?
Just use a dam metal key like has worked for decades. All this stupid complexity.
Oh and that dam lane assist. kept pulling the steering wheel every time I crossed a parallel line, such as to give space for a bicycle, or double parked truck or such, annoying as hell. Car had no steering feel either. a dull boring car at best, a computer pain in the ass much of the time. features for the sake of features. a touch screen for the radio, for the heater and defogger, what a pain to use. I guess they determined the lane assist was needed as drivers will drift while trying to use that dam touch TV screen, So much for night vision too with that dam TV screen Oh and the turn signal arm, it returns to center position while the signal is on. then you must look at that dam TV screen again to see which way the signal is flashing to you can figure out which way to move the center position arm to cancel the signal. It is a car designed by morons. |
Your friend didn’t give you the key card to use. That’s on him.
|
true that, he didnt, he did some app thing on my telephone Still tesla should just use a plain old key, easy peasy. Oh and them stupid door handles, you need two free hands to open the door from the outside. One hand to push in part of the handle, and while pushing that, the other hand to pull the other part of the handle. They designer never considered that folks may be holding a package, or a baby, or a purse, or have a bum arm that is in a sling or cast. I have many cars, and used many many more other cars and every last one of them only requires one hand to operate the door handle. Oh sure tesla got rid of the need to use a key, then they F'd up and designed a stupid handle that requires two hands to operate. I hear that the handle ices up in freezing wet weather and sometimes wont work.
To get out you need to push a stupid button, no real handle, except for a hidden emergency handle. Sure it has heated leather seats, but much of that car is just plain annoying stupid crap.
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Give Peace a Chance.
Words to live by. |
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67rustavenger
Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2015
Posts: 11652
Location: Oregon
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| Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2025 10:32 pm Post subject: Re: New EV Bus announced this morning - Buzz |
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I'd rather be driving an ID Buzz than, being caught driving this wrecked Frigidaire freezer.
What a Childs whet dream!
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!
There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!
2003 Astrovan? GFYS again, Xevin! 
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