"green" coolant vs vw coolant

[Wildthings]

For years I used one of the Nalcool products because it was readily available right down the road, don't remember which one as it has been too long at this point. Once the old couple who sold the Nalcool closed shop and retired I started using the stuff NAPA sells. A reading of the label doesn't make it sound super good for a Vanagon cooling system, but I have had excellent luck with it. I use the recommended dosage.

My 91 Vanagon is presently undergoing a Subaru swap. I intend to do the front hoses before I finish the swap and pull and check the radiator. Weighing the radiator should give a pretty good indication of how much corrosion I have had over the years.

Does anyone off hand know the weight of a new stock radiator?

BTW, ethylene glycol does not go bad it is just the additive packages that get depleted with time and need to be supplemented. I assume the same is true for Sierra and other types of antifreeze.

[bucko]

"Does anyone off hand know the weight of a new stock radiator?"

I just missed out giving you this information, as I dropped a new BEHR unit off at the repair shop. Unlike the originals though, the base and the top are a plastic now. My original was completely metal (some sort of alloy).

I'm just not sure of any additive used to "seal" leaks. How does it know how to seal a leak, yet not plug a radiator tube???
_________________
Current VW drives: 1984 Westfalia

Past VW drives: 1967 Beetle, 1973 Beetle, 1977 Bus, 1971 Military Type 181

[tencentlife]

Normally it's reaction with sufficient free oxygen.

[Wildthings]

[tencentlife]

That's a good point, and I believe it is why aluminum engines also benefit from use of a low-silicate coolant, as well as phosphate-free. Silicate acts as a fine abrasive in the system, so it scours the protective oxide that would form on the aluminum surfaces. The Dexcool I'm using is both.

The silicate may also end up being one of the components of scale that eventually blocks radiator passages. I'm not sure of that, but low free mineral content within the system seems like a good idea. That's the rationale for using distilled or deionised water as well, besides the paramount concern of controlling pH. Actually if pH is kept neutral, it doesn't matter what dissolved minerals are in water; they will only precipitate out of solution if pH gets high.

And what Wildthings sez is quite true: just like oil, glycol doesn't "wear out". It's the additive package that gets depleted. If you can responsibly replenish it, especially to correct pH, there is no need to replace the bulk of the fluid in either case. With glycol, that is doable, which is why I was curious about what conditioners work. Dumping 4 gallons of toxic waste every few years is environmentally irresponsible, and I'd like to avoid doing it if I can, just like how I'm shooting for longer oil change intervals by keeping my oil cool and well-filtered. Changing coolant yearly is, in my opinion and with no offense meant to those that choose to do so, extreme overkill and environmentally harmful. I think every three years is reasonable and that's the program I'm shooting for.

But it isn't doable to replenish the additive package with multi-vis oils, as far as I know. There may be things that will restore pH buffers (the Total Base Number, or TBN), and replenish anti-wear additives, etc., but I don't know of anything that will replace the long-chain polymers that are what gives multi-vis oils their Viscosity Index rating. And it is these polymers that are damaged by heat.

[74Standard]

Well, all things considered, I won't be adopting any long term fluid change program on any of my cars. When I rebuilt the engine in the 535i I got too see first hand the effects of using tap water in a cooling system that has anything to do with aluminum. It (looked) like it actually rusted. PO must have had a high iron content in his water.

I take all my used fluids to onbe of the oil change places for recycling. I live outside city limits and have a well, so "dumping" isn't even an option for me - NOT THAT I WOULD EVEN THINK ABOUT DOING IT!!!

I have a hard time with the 15k oil change idea simply due to the fact that your oil "filters" the air that cycles through your engine also and captures the dirt. Plus, after 15k, the oil is jet black.

I've been running Prestone green in my car for a number of years now - with DISTILLED water - and have no evidence of corrosion. You are not supposed to run it, but antifreeze has had many changes since my car and these vans were new. It's not as toxic as it used to be, you can't use it to kill stray dogs that no one will come and get - not that you could get close enough to catch it anyway - Also much "safer" for aluminum engines. Prestone would have been out of business about 25 years ago if you couldn't use the stuff in an engine that has aluminum. I'm having a hard time coming up with a car on the road that doesn't have at least aluminum heads...

Years ago when you had all the cast iron engines out - sure... but now? I think your worried about "an old wives tail" that may have been true 25 years ago or more, but not now.

And I have to agree ANYTHING that stops leaks is a band-aid, not a perminant fix and will bite you in the ass one day on that long trip to somewhere. Then you will wish you would have found out what really happened as you sit in po-dunk nowhere trying to get parts for your 25 year old VW van. You'll get them - eventually... Stop leak is a used car salesman trick, and yeah I limped a car home on it and then I replaced the blown head gasket and flushed it out.

[tencentlife]

Who said anything about 15k oil changes?

I'm going with the factory-recommended 7500 miles. There's just no good reason to do it more often than that, unless you chronically overheat your oil. Now I know a lot of these motors, even though they're watercooled, do just that. But addressing the chronic high oil temp by adding external cooling is better for the engine, the environment, and far cheaper over the long run than changing oil every 3k. If you think your oil is too dirty before it's time to change, change the filter halfway. Color of oil is not an indicator of its condition as a lubricant.

[Wildthings]

[74Standard]

[dr. no]

It's toxic enough to put you on dialysis if you don't kick off sooner, if you drink enough (like a quart or so). The dog was way smarter than you with it's immediate "self-flush".
_________________
Scott
http://lungehphoto.com

'83.5 Westy s/p 1.6td JX and 4sp DK transplant--wonderful!
'86 MB 300GD
'06 MB Sprinter
'17 BMW X1
'89 Isuzu Trooper


PAST VWs:
'82 NA diesel Vanagon
'86 7-passenger Vanagon
'77 Bay
'71 Bay
'74 Things (2)
'69 Karmann Ghia (the only one I miss--in nice weather, anyway...)
'91 Fox

[tencentlife]

The dog probably self-flushed because she wolfed down all that food at the same time, so she had plenty to purge. Plus, soaking food with it would delay uptake; the dog would have to begin digesting the food, and uptake would be both delayed and slower as a result. If she hadn't vomited, her death would have been a drawn-out version of an already dependably slow and agonising process.

Ethylene glycol is ethylene glycol. They don't make a less-toxic version. That's absurd. I've never heard anything about a teaspoon, either. The dogs will lap up a quart or more PDQ, though, the stuff smells so sweet.

Your story angers me. Don't you have rifles up there?

[DAVEURO]

[74Standard]

[DAVEURO]

I kinda think we are getting off of any VW type theme here :snipersmile:

[tencentlife]

If you live in town, then get your animal control to deal with the dog. And don't call me a dumbass, that's totally uncalled for. I've been handling guns since I could pick one up, and safely. There's a lot of things I could call you, but I will refrain. Your actions anger me. Not you. Mistreatment of animals will always earn my contempt. Human beings should try to be better than that.

[74Standard]

[tencentlife]

It's called "sarcasm". So was that.

I have nothing to add that would be constructive. Let's let this drop.

[danocox]

green to red makes no difference. as for now the industry is still stuck in a limbo on coolant in general. in the end water can transport and displace more heat than anything else. but coolant is insurance and also has a little lubricating effect to it. a phosphate-free propylene glycol mix would be the best mix for the van. water MUST be distilled. there should be no questions about that. the problem is the EGR, with the introduction of exuahst gas it quickens the rate of oxidization, causing the coolant(water no the mix of both) to reach its exchange time in only several months. a higher water to coolant mix with extend serive intervals.

I use water alone in the summer with an additive that lubricates. thats the best. the industry is looking into sealed systems that will not need service for up to five years or mabye even the life of the car using propanediol (PDO) or maybe something more "space age". so in the end coolant is only for varied climates and any system in my opinion should be flushed every three months.

don't think colors think composition and purpose. dex-cool is a gimmick. if not so involved with your cars workings just follow the maufactures recomendations.
_________________
daniel

would marry the van if it was leagal

[74Standard]

Red Line "Water Wetter" and distilled water is what I use in the BMW during the summer. In the winter, I add about 25% antifreeze. It doesn't get that cold in San Antonio...

[GeorgeL]