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wolfej1
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 679
Location: North Royalton, Ohio
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 Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: Heating Element in Westy water tank |
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Have been searching for some info about using the westy water tank in conjunction with a electric heating element to provide a constant source of hot water for washing dishes and showering.
Any help appreciated as my current project:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=309438&highlight=hot+water
is on hold until pending investigation of this option. Since I have built the interior shower enclosure it would seem logical to use the Eurovan faucet/sprayer with a extended hose for showering purposes.
It would seem that if the tank were insulated and filled with hot water prior to leaving home, it could be feasible.
Thanks
_________________
1982 Westy
2004 KDX200
2008 Kawasaki KLR 650
1979 Yamaha DT 175
1995 Toyota 4Runner |
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a914622
Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004
Posts: 840
Location: Westend of HWY2 , Wash
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| Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:33 am Post subject: |
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OR
Look into the Mercedes window wash fluid tanks . I ran into one at the wrecking yard a few months back and thought That would be perfect.
It has a stainless coil inside that is run off the heater hose. There is also a thermostat in-line, inside the tank. So the water gets hot from the coolant and then shuts off .
If i remember right, it was a 450 sc around 89 vintage.
Ill see if i can find any pics.
jcl |
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wolfej1
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 679
Location: North Royalton, Ohio
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| Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:43 am Post subject: |
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| a914622 wrote: |
OR
Look into the Mercedes window wash fluid tanks . I ran into one at the wrecking yard a few months back and thought That would be perfect.
It has a stainless coil inside that is run off the heater hose. There is also a thermostat in-line, inside the tank. So the water gets hot from the coolant and then shuts off .
If i remember right, it was a 450 sc around 89 vintage.
Ill see if i can find any pics.
jcl |
i should have mentioned that my van is an 82 aircooled....so I cant use any coolant related options.... thx
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1982 Westy
2004 KDX200
2008 Kawasaki KLR 650
1979 Yamaha DT 175
1995 Toyota 4Runner |
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a914622
Samba Member
Joined: July 29, 2004
Posts: 840
Location: Westend of HWY2 , Wash
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| Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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| How about the oil??? |
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erdonline
Samba Member
Joined: September 26, 2004
Posts: 943
Location: CT
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| Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:28 pm Post subject: water heating |
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You don't mind giving up cold water for hot? I just purchased the Coleman hot water on demand system. I got a great deal on it while I was in Canada a few weeks ago. It was $150 (Can or US - same value at the time) and it came with the water bag/jug, the shower hose attachment, and the carrying case. Usually these are all sold seperately, but Canadian Tire had a package. It's a little bulky, but I think it will work well for me. A friend from camping had one and I tried it out. It heats water within a few seconds, has adjustable temp,and has a swing-out faucet and the shower attachment. He had it set up in a shower tent, but I also saw how he would use it for dishes. I'm looking forward to using it next weekend.
Do you have any pics of the interior shower?
Ed in CT |
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wolfej1
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 679
Location: North Royalton, Ohio
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 5:59 am Post subject: Re: water heating |
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| erdonline wrote: |
You don't mind giving up cold water for hot?
Do you have any pics of the interior shower?
Ed in CT |
No problem getting rid of the cold water, only use it for dishes anyway.
I will post some pics - however, all it is is a 2X3 frame made out of PVC pipe that rests in the space that exists when the top bed is pulled out and pushed up on that little angle. Shower curtain hooks hold the curtain on there.
I just need to find out if a electric heating element will suffice to keep the water in the insulated tank hot - provided it is initially filled with hot water.
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1982 Westy
2004 KDX200
2008 Kawasaki KLR 650
1979 Yamaha DT 175
1995 Toyota 4Runner |
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Stígandi
Samba Member
Joined: May 30, 2008
Posts: 110
Location: Houston
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:40 am Post subject: Re: water heating |
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| erdonline wrote: |
You don't mind giving up cold water for hot? I just purchased the Coleman hot water on demand system. I got a great deal on it while I was in Canada a few weeks ago. It was $150 (Can or US - same value at the time) and it came with the water bag/jug, the shower hose attachment, and the carrying case. Usually these are all sold seperately, but Canadian Tire had a package. It's a little bulky, but I think it will work well for me. A friend from camping had one and I tried it out. It heats water within a few seconds, has adjustable temp,and has a swing-out faucet and the shower attachment. He had it set up in a shower tent, but I also saw how he would use it for dishes. I'm looking forward to using it next weekend.
Do you have any pics of the interior shower?
Ed in CT |
http://www.dehn.wustl.edu/~blake/vw/shower/
this is the best option I have found so far!
_________________
Thanx,
Craig and Holly
82' Aircooled Vanagon
used to be known as ShotMagnet
http://vanagonshenanigans.blogspot.com/ new
http://vanagonshananigans.blogspot.com/ old
http://texaskayakfisherman.com/forum/ |
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tencentlife
Samba Member
Joined: May 02, 2006
Posts: 10078
Location: Abiquiu, NM, USA
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:38 am Post subject: |
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Man, that looks like a pain in the ass.
Wolfy, if you check out some solar suppliers you can find 12V electric resistive heating elements. Even a common 120vac one will heat up on 12V, just not nearly as hot as it would on it's proper voltage. Resistance is resistance, after all, and any current going thru will make heat.
But just get like a 250w 12V resistive element and install it in your water tank, on a good 40A relay like the ones you can scavenge from an AC-equipped Vanagon labelled #53 on the cube. 250w/12V= about 21A, so you could power this in the daytime from your existing alternator. It would compete with headlights and heavy use of other consumers, so you would either want to be able to power it when you can make a surplus of current, or put in a 90A alternator and you'll have some reserve. Install a switch to trigger the relay where you can flip it on or off from the driver's seat. If you want to get fancy install an electric water heater thermostat switch to turn it off when your little tank is fully hot. Don't want to boil the water now.
I'd rather run wire than hose anyday.
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spitsnrovers
Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2005
Posts: 924
Location: Calgary, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:38 am Post subject: |
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I know it has been seen before, but here are details of a hot water system
www.griffco.ca/interest/vw
you may find useful. |
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Blood Loss
Samba Member
Joined: June 18, 2008
Posts: 129
Location: Baltimore
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jackbombay
Samba Member
Joined: October 19, 2007
Posts: 2723
Location: Eastern Idaho
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 11:55 am Post subject: |
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Around here most of the year water is frozen, and the rest of the year its really cold 
My solution, which I have not made reality yet, is a cap on top of the tank I can remove then put a funnel in and pour a pot of boiling water in, I have plenty of propane, and its quick, electricity, not so much, on both counts.
But I have a different gal than you, I don't want the whole tank hot, just not so cold it hurts my hands to wash dishes.
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PDXWesty
Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2006
Posts: 6245
Location: Portland OR
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| Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 11:57 am Post subject: |
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| I can see how that small 12v immersion heater would work on a cup of water, but I don't see how it could heat 9 gallons to a safe temperature. Remember, you need to heat water to 140 degrees to avoid harmfull bacteria growth. Water left sitting at 100-120 degrees is prime for legionella. I would worry about this in creating a hot water tank inside the van. |
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wolfej1
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 679
Location: North Royalton, Ohio
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 9:05 am Post subject: Re: water heating |
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| erdonline wrote: |
Do you have any pics of the interior shower?
Ed in CT |
Frame installed looking from bottom up
Entire Frame
With curtain(tarp) installed. You can see the shower head hanging in there as well
Unit is very stable. I added extra gromets(sp) as necessary for the tarp. I used a 8X10 tarp which fits perfectly if you make the frame area just a bit shorter than 2 ft sq.
Nothing elaborate here - but is stores easily and rests under it's own weight - there are no ropes needed to hold frame in place.
Any other questions jusrt let me know.
_________________
1982 Westy
2004 KDX200
2008 Kawasaki KLR 650
1979 Yamaha DT 175
1995 Toyota 4Runner |
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wolfej1
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 679
Location: North Royalton, Ohio
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 9:23 am Post subject: |
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anyone try one of these?
http://www.westsidewholesale.com/index.cgi?HN_Sess...TEGORY=426
was thinking you could run a dedicated city water line and use shore power - just plug in and hook the water line up. Use the sprayer head for the on/off functionality.
_________________
1982 Westy
2004 KDX200
2008 Kawasaki KLR 650
1979 Yamaha DT 175
1995 Toyota 4Runner |
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erdonline
Samba Member
Joined: September 26, 2004
Posts: 943
Location: CT
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:27 am Post subject: shower |
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What do you use on the floor to collect or direct the water? For now, when I'm camping and don't need to be inconspicuous, I clamp two tarps around the open back hatch and put a tarp over the opening to inside so nothing gets wet, and that works pretty well for a shower, but this idea is interesting, too.
Ed |
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wolfej1
Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2005
Posts: 679
Location: North Royalton, Ohio
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:00 pm Post subject: Re: shower |
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| erdonline wrote: |
What do you use on the floor to collect or direct the water? For now, when I'm camping and don't need to be inconspicuous, I clamp two tarps around the open back hatch and put a tarp over the opening to inside so nothing gets wet, and that works pretty well for a shower, but this idea is interesting, too.
Ed |
I use a plastic mortar box from Home Depot. It is big enough to hold the water and stand in. Also it is easy to empty. I was thinking of setting it up so that it is at a slight incline low side towards the door and putting a drain valve in there so that the container would empty itself. I would run a hose from the valve to a plastic pipe system which would run under the van to the gray water area.
If I am at a remote campsite I would not use this system as it is only for the times when I am at a organized campground where the shower facilities are bad or do not exist. In those situations I do not like the idea of setting up a portable outhouse shower or using the back of my camper as the shower. It is better to be inside of the van - at least that is how I feel.
Setup time for the enclosure is about 5 minutes. Taking it down takes a bit longer in that the water needs to be emptied and the tarp is wet and needs to be hung to dry. I have found that a 2 gallon sprayer filled 1/2 with hot -almost boiling- water and 1/2 cold provides a good temperature of about 100 degrees which is nice. Need to leave a bit of room in the sprayer so the air pressure can work. I have left the sprayer on and emptied the tank without having to re-pump.
Over all I am satisfied so far, however I would still like to get to the point where I could use the sink sprayer as a dual duty (shower/faucet) item. In the meantime this works good.
_________________
1982 Westy
2004 KDX200
2008 Kawasaki KLR 650
1979 Yamaha DT 175
1995 Toyota 4Runner |
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candyman
Samba Trout Slayer
Joined: December 20, 2003
Posts: 2694
Location: Missoula MT
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:52 pm Post subject: |
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Bump
Been contemplating using my water tank as a dedicated hot water tank since i never drink out of it. Anyone ever go the route of installing an element to heat the water to a temp for a comfortable shower or to do dishes? My plan would be to run a pump and hose threw the filler hookup to an external shower of sorts. Think this would be a nice upgrade. Tank can be safely bleached later to safely clean it. |
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Dampcamper
Samba Member
Joined: October 07, 2013
Posts: 788
Location: Rainy Portland, Oregon
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| Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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Not sure how warm you want to get the polyethylene tank? I know of a boat that had poured 2-part expanding urethane foam around a smallish poly tank that they stored heated water in, the foam provided both insulation and support all around the tank so it wouldn't split. I think their target temperature was 120 deg F (heated from coolant loop on engine, not an option for you with air cooled).
OK, how about mounting a small solar hot water system up top? Just a couple of tubes? Right beside the solar panels.
I've got a couple of solar showers (basically black douche bags with a shower nozzle on the hose) that I throw up in the luggage rack on the rare sunny day when I'm out. Cloudy days makes for shorter showers. |
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