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68 bus black box/turn signal system
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're right about the black box ground. I originally thought it was not grounded since it appeared to be insulated around the mounting screw. Upon further inspection, it definitely grounds through the screw. I will try to hookup another relay sometime today, I am in charge of my precocious 3-year old today, so I am not sure if it will happen before mom gets home.

Thanks for the links to the classifieds. I saw one of those in my search, but not the others. I must be a dysfunctional samba searcher. The only issue I have is that I would not get one of those in my hot little hands before Friday, when I leave for a trip to the Seattle area. I may buy one though, just to have it in the future.

Thanks to all, I will report back with my findings in hope of helping someone else in the future.
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
Your black box grounded through the mounting hole, 31a is the equivalent of Kbl, give it a try.


Nothing I have here has terminal 31a, just 31(ground) or 31b (switched ground) I will try it with KBL=31, 49 to the heavy black wire, and 49a will be as it was on the old flasher.
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 8:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, finger trouble, I meant 31b, the switched ground is needed for the arrows (Kbl) because they are wired like the idiot lights and get + power when the key is on.
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So the only relay I have here that has terminal 31b, is the one that also has terminal 50. It also has terminal 31. I am guessing I need to find a different relay that has 31b, 49, and 49a.
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try the Rabbit relay, run a wire from 31 to ground and leave 50 disconnected.

1970's Honda Civics lit up the brake warning light while cranking to test it, maybe VW went a step further and tested the signals too?
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
Try the Rabbit relay, run a wire from 31 to ground and leave 50 disconnected.

1970's Honda Civics lit up the brake warning light while cranking to test it, maybe VW went a step further and tested the signals too?


I could do that, but that would only leave two terminals (31 and 31b) to connect the three wires to, and none of the wires on the bus lead to ground, nor are they brown. I've got some more thinking to do.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cdennisg wrote:
So my new (old rabbit) relays read 49, 49a and 31, or 31, 31b, and 50. Compatible?

After re reading that the light just came on in my head that you are describing 2 different relays Embarassed

Try the one with 49, 49a and 31. Ground 31, connect + to 49 and 49a to 49a. Try connecting the arrow wire (kbl) to 49a with a piggyback connector, they may be on all the time unless the signals are blinking though.
But there is a fix incase that happens, you need to bent the tabs on the arrow bulb holders so they don't touch the back of the cluster and solder on ground wires to them.
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, I will give that a try. Sorry about the confusion, but yes I do have two relays here. Each has three terminals.

I may not get to try this until this afternoon, but I will report back with my findings.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So I just returned from my friend's shop. We went through most of what has been discussed here, and he showed me the way which he thought would work. Then he asked me if I just wanted another black box instead. He goes to his back room and hands me two of them to try. I would guess that will be the answer, providing one of them works. Interestingly, though they are exactly the same part #, they appear quite different from each other and are different than the one that I puled from the bus. The terminals are marked the same, though. I will try one soon, when my daughter takes her nap.
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cdennisg
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



So here is the end result. Of the two original black box type flashers my VW shop buddy had, one was broken, the other worked but the mounting tab/ground was missing. So I tried the rabbit flasher unit without the dash lights hooked up and it worked great. I piggybacked the dash lights to the 49a terminal, and the dash lights now work! (well, one of them works, I think I have a bulb to replace) busdaddy, you hit it on the head, and I didn't have to ground the arrow lights, thankfully.

So the pics show what wire goes where. I had to make a ground lead for terminal 31 that I just put under one of the screws for the ventilation system. After the pics were taken I tucked everything up nicely and zip-tied into place. Then I replaced the ignition switch, which is another story and was a battle in itself.

I hope this post will be helpful to someone down the road who runs into this same situation. Thanks very much to everyone that offered advice, especially busdaddy. This site is truly wonderful.
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