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speedygeorge
Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2009
Posts: 235
Location: Victoria, BC
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 Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 3:23 pm Post subject: Exhaust System Install Muffler shop vs VW Shop |
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I am looking to install a complete new exhaust system on my van, my usual shop is closed for a few weeks and another one is really not happy about installing outside parts (I am sure neither are actually) and will be adding on extra charges to cover lost revenue.
Is their anything that could go wrong with a muffler shop doing the work, they are more then happy to install. I would think they have as much experience if not more in doing installs? |
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insyncro
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Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:19 pm Post subject: |
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They should be able to do the job.
As the owner I would order the parts if they are willing to install them.
Stay away from generic pipes.
If exhaust studs break off in the head, very common, they will be able to drill and replace.
If thery take there time and mount the entire new system loosely and tighten from the heads out it will hold up well.
If it is just bolted together it has a good chance of cracking.
Make sure ALL supports for the system are oredered and installed as well or a cracked header is in the future.
Wait until you see how well the van runs with a sealed exhaust system, new CAT and new oxygen sensor. Night and day. I do not use the splice in oxygen sensors, even Bosch ones. Yes the ones with the harness are much more money. I have not had good success or longivity with the splice in or universal sensors.
Don't forget the stainless steel options available for Vanagons.
Be prepared for the total cost to be 3 times that of steel.
I feel they are worth every penny if you plan to keep the van for a lifetime.
dylan |
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RGS Paul
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Joined: April 20, 2007
Posts: 663
Location: Los Alamos, NM
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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How nasty is it under there? Any reason not to DIY? It is a 13 mm wrench, a 12 mm wrench, some antisieze and an afternoon. Soak the heads with penetrating oil for a day or two first and go. Get some stainless hardware to replace a bunch of the mild steel stuff (you need some 40 mm, 30 mm and 20 mm long bolts all in M8 ) and the nice copper coated lock nuts. You might need to find a buddy with a garage though, beer is a good bribe. No welding on these so it is easy.
Paul
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speedygeorge
Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2009
Posts: 235
Location: Victoria, BC
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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| RGS Paul wrote: |
How nasty is it under there? Any reason not to DIY? It is a 13 mm wrench, a 12 mm wrench, some antisieze and an afternoon. Soak the heads with penetrating oil for a day or two first and go. Get some stainless hardware to replace a bunch of the mild steel stuff (you need some 40 mm, 30 mm and 20 mm long bolts all in M8 ) and the nice copper coated lock nuts. You might need to find a buddy with a garage though, beer is a good bribe. No welding on these so it is easy.
Paul |
I would love to install myself, but I am just starting to do a few things on my own and not sure I could handle a broken bolt in block. I know how this would go, I would start get frustrated and after 6 hours I would take it into the shop, hat in hand. I would prefer to avoid this.
The local muffler shop thinks this is a 2 hour job at most, is that reasonable? |
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blueridgedog
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Joined: December 05, 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Virginia
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:26 pm Post subject: |
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If you have the shop do it, I would still soak the bolts with penetrating oil the day before.
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In process of getting on the road |
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speedygeorge
Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2009
Posts: 235
Location: Victoria, BC
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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| blueridgedog wrote: |
| If you have the shop do it, I would still soak the bolts with penetrating oil the day before. |
Block bolts only ? |
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speedygeorge
Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2009
Posts: 235
Location: Victoria, BC
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:43 pm Post subject: |
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| blueridgedog wrote: |
| If you have the shop do it, I would still soak the bolts with penetrating oil the day before. |
Block bolts only ? |
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j_dirge
Samba Member
Joined: August 08, 2007
Posts: 4641
Location: Twain Harte, CA
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| Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 8:29 pm Post subject: Re: Exhaust System Install Muffler shop vs VW Shop |
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| speedygeorge wrote: |
Is their anything that could go wrong with a muffler shop doing the work, they are more then happy to install. I would think they have as much experience if not more in doing installs? |
A complete exhaust install requires some bits to be removed in order to gain proper access.
If a general purpose muffler shop has not done a Vanagon in a while.. Well?
I am not sure they could do better than a weekend hack like myself.
My limited experiences with "muffler shops" is that they are not willing to take the time to do it right.
Expect brackets to be cut, not removed.. make-shift 'new' brackets welded in place, generous use of patching materials to get it all sealed, and clearances to be near zero.
Expect to hear lots of complaints about how YOUR parts sucked.. and it cost THEM loads of extra time to use YOUR parts.
(even though thier parts would be the exact same ones)
Expect the worst.. Hope for the best.
But make it clear you want the Vanagon exhaust installed unmolested.
Good luck!
And report back.. hopefully with good news.
_________________
-89 GL Westy, SVX.. finally.
-57 pan f/g buggy with a 67 pancake Type 3 "S"
"Jimi Hendrix owned one. Richard Nixon did not"
-Grand Tour, Season 1, episodes 4 and 5
| danfromsyr wrote: |
those are straight line runs with light weight race cars for only 1/4mile at a time..
not pushing a loaded brick up a mountain pass with a family of 4+ inside expecting to have an event free vacation..
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 7:06 am Post subject: |
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check roadhaus.com
it has a list of good and bad VW shops.
the search is by zip.
the NW corner of the US has many shops. |
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RCB
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Joined: September 05, 2005
Posts: 4143
Location: San Francisco-Bay Area
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 8:30 am Post subject: |
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Years ago when I first bought my 82 I took it to a national chain muffler shop to have a new muffler installed and a new cat installed.
Years later when the muffler had rusted out and it was time to have it replaced...my mechanic pointed out to me that the national chain muffler shop had just cut off the old and welded in the new.
I paid dearly to have everything redone the correct way. Now, if something needs replacing its "unbolt the old and re bolt the new". |
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Terry Kay
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Joined: June 22, 2003
Posts: 13331
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| Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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RocketGeorge.
My advise is--stay as far away from A-1, Acme, or Gomer's muffler shop.
They'll get the job done alright--"no problem"
IF, they have any difficulties getting any of the mounting hardware off, and away from the engine, it'll be qa hack job.
Their in this to make a fast turn around, put the money in their pocket, and watch your taillight dissapear.
The Vanagon is anything but a rapid money maker for those not accustom to the glory of a flat 4 , shoehorned into a travel trunk.
My advise?
Get the Van to a shop that has VW experience, and will have an honset idea of what you need.
The price will reflect this--but the exhaust system will be more correct , I'm sure.
Last option?
Break out the torches, and crawl under the back side of the van & get it done.
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speedygeorge
Samba Member
Joined: November 28, 2009
Posts: 235
Location: Victoria, BC
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:20 am Post subject: |
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| Terry Kay wrote: |
RocketGeorge.
My advise is--stay as far away from A-1, Acme, or Gomer's muffler shop.
They'll get the job done alright--"no problem"
IF, they have any difficulties getting any of the mounting hardware off, and away from the engine, it'll be qa hack job.
Their in this to make a fast turn around, put the money in their pocket, and watch your taillight dissapear.
The Vanagon is anything but a rapid money maker for those not accustom to the glory of a flat 4 , shoehorned into a travel trunk.
My advise?
Get the Van to a shop that has VW experience, and will have an honset idea of what you need.
The price will reflect this--but the exhaust system will be more correct , I'm sure.
Last option?
Break out the torches, and crawl under the back side of the van & get it done. |
Well I just got a quote back from local VW shop $2,200 to replace whole exhaust system. Luckily I was put in contact with a friend of a friend who has worked on VWs for years and has offered to get the parts for me at a discount (he is a shop teacher) and help me install them, sweeeeeet. |
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purplepeopleeater
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Joined: July 23, 2005
Posts: 3117
Location: E. Washington
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| Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| 2200? crap, 500 more and you can buy a new long block. |
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