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Bosch SR0408X/409X vs HiTorqueIMI-101 gear reduction starter
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tclark
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:04 am    Post subject: Bosch SR0408X/409X vs HiTorqueIMI-101 gear reduction starter Reply with quote

So looks like my Bosch starter solenoid is on the way out after only 5 years
So when i bought this a back then I found out that http://www.hitorque.com
built a gear reduction starter for amout us$185
and I also see a few co doing rebuild imi-101
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320466104212

any feeds back from any one who bought either of these starter motors ?

particularly the rebuild units ??
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presslab
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:45 am    Post subject: Re: hitorque.com IMI-101 gear reduction starter Reply with quote

tclark wrote:
So looks like my Bosch starter solenoid is on the way out after only 5 years
So when i bought this a back then I found out that http://www.hitorque.com
built a gear reduction starter for amout us$185
and I also see a few co doing rebuild imi-101
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320466104212

any feeds back from any one who bought either of these starter motors ?

particularly the rebuild units ??


I tried one when I did the Subaru conversion. It spun the engine too slow. I don't know how it will work on a stock engine but I've never heard much good about these starters.

I have a good Bosch rebuild and it works great. The hot setup these days seems to be the Westyventures TDI starter adapter.

http://www.westyventures.com/parts.html
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tclark
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow is this too good to be true
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300277150519

NEW Gear reduction for $72 US ???
I wonder if this is this WPS
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3470399&highlight=wps#3470399

OK let hear the horror stories
on these guys CALIFORNIA ALTERNATOR AND STARTER
100% Positive feedback hmmm ???
man in the very least its the cost of bosch core that I dont have haha Smile
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fatboypaul
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Westyventures setup is the way to go, I tried Bosch rebuilts, too many of them, then tried one of Kennedy's HiTorque... it died way too early.
Now the Bosch TDI starter has the power needed to start my Suby.... everytime. Made me trust my Westy again.
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Rubber Tramp
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have TDI starter as well... haven't had the chance to try it out yet though
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the ebay gear reduction on my TD and have yet to have any trouble with it. Works very nicely
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BlackDogVan
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

allsierra123 wrote:
I have the ebay gear reduction on my TD and have yet to have any trouble with it. Works very nicely


Do you need some glow on a warm start?? Mine did until the WV tdi starter setup, definitely the way to go IMHO. Gear red justy didn't have the poop...
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tclark
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlackDogVan wrote:

Do you need some glow on a warm start?? Mine did until the VW tdi starter setup, definitely the way to go IMHO. Gear red just didn't have the poop...

BD - are you saying this about the ebay made in china SR0408X
or about the crap bosch reman starters for the the wbx'ers ?
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tclark
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to close this out yes this ebay starter motor
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=300277150519

is a WPS(WAIglobal and Transpo Electronics) Unit
they are sourced from http://www.wai-wetherill.com/
looks like they also have an online partplace http://www.wpsparts.com/
and its part 2-1974-BO aka the SR0409X
http://search.waiglobal.com/partsearch/partnum.aspx?part=2-1974-BO

interesting is that 2-1890-BO spec is 1.8KW aka the SR0408X
http://search.waiglobal.com/partsearch/partnum.aspx?part=2-1890-BO
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wcdennis
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just bought one of those eBay starters and the Westy Ventures adapter for my 2.2L Subaru powered '84. I have the hot start problem, but never to the point that the engine won't start--although sometimes it just barely makes it. This can be exciting when you accidentally stall it at a crowded intersection. I will report back after I install it.
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kenwilfy
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 6:56 pm    Post subject: Hi Torque starter Reply with quote

Because they are gear reduction starters they actually turn the engine over exactly half as fast as the stock starters (I forget how I figured this out). They sacrifice spinning speed for torque. I had a customer come in with one of these he bought from a vendor before he came to me. I installed it and then he came back about a year later. Wow this thing turned into a rusted pile of poop in that one year. The warranty was over and so was the starter. I put a Bosch rebuilt unit back on and it is still going strong. What do I put on my Vanagons? Bosch rebuilt starters. They are the best. They are expensive but they usually go the distance versus any other rebuilt starter out there. I tried a few Advance Auto starters when I was first starting out. Can you say "Spray Paint" rebuild? They didn't even a full week out of them before they were acting worse than the old one I took off. Yes they have a lifetime warranty but who wants to spend their lifetime changing them? Not me.
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Tristar Eric
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just installed my TDI starter on my Syncro Doka. I have the trans out, so it's way easier. Here's the thing, don't expect this thing to be changed easily when it's in. The diff lock bracket is notched to allow the starter to sit right on it. Then the diff lock switch is so close that it was not easily tightened.
I'm crossing my fingers that I won't be back in there for a while, but it might just be easier to drop the trans in the future to access the starter.

TDI Power coming soon!
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tclark
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wcdennis wrote:
I just bought one of those eBay starters and the Westy Ventures adapter I will report back after I install it.

Any chance you might want to take the starter case apart b4 you install
and confirm the 'design flaw' that buffbuh claims in this thread
(Also he did not get the 2KW model he claims to of got 2-1890-BO 1.8KW)?
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4395099#4395099

and take pics so the collective sambanistas sp ? can weight in in this on this China junk theory ?
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r39o
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dang, it seems there almost is NO perfect starter!

So what do I use?

TDI?

or

Porsche?

Anybody have some part numbers so I can find a Porsche one to use with my automatic and Suby?????

At least that bolts in and we know several local Porsche shops as trade partners.
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BlackDogVan
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tclark wrote:
BlackDogVan wrote:

Do you need some glow on a warm start?? Mine did until the VW tdi starter setup, definitely the way to go IMHO. Gear red just didn't have the poop...

BD - are you saying this about the ebay made in china SR0408X
or about the crap bosch reman starters for the the wbx'ers ?


I meant my OEM TDI Bosch starter on my AAZ makes me feel the same as when I'd climb the rope in gym class...

The gear reduction unit didn't have the poop to spin the engine over fast enough to start a warm engine without a wee bit of glow plug. Now all go, no glow.
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tclark
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

r39o wrote:
Dang, it seems there almost is NO perfect starter!

r39o the above post is only in reference to the wps clones of the
SR0408X/SR0409X, you can get brand new life time warranty
for 350-400 Bosch units + the $70 adapter
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Gauche1968
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This issue of the gear reduction starters is intriguing me, because I bought one of the Hi Torque starters in Spring 2007, just before GoWesty stopped carrying them due to declining quality standards from the manufacturer. I haven't had a problem with it since, so I am wondering if I got lucky and got one of the good ones or if I am sitting on a time bomb? Question
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are some photos of the eBay WPS SR0408X starter and WestyVentures adapter:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here it is with the adapter plate:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here is the adapter mounted on the starter:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Here is the testing video:

Link


All I can say now, is that it works. I haven't decided if I will try to take it apart before I install it and see what the internals look like.
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r39o
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BlackDogVan wrote:
tclark wrote:
BlackDogVan wrote:

Do you need some glow on a warm start?? Mine did until the VW tdi starter setup, definitely the way to go IMHO. Gear red just didn't have the poop...

BD - are you saying this about the ebay made in china SR0408X
or about the crap bosch reman starters for the the wbx'ers ?


I meant my OEM TDI Bosch starter on my AAZ makes me feel the same as when I'd climb the rope in gym class...

The gear reduction unit didn't have the poop to spin the engine over fast enough to start a warm engine without a wee bit of glow plug. Now all go, no glow.


What I meant was the relationship between the high power slow turn and adapter verses the Porsche starter. This automatic centric, though.

I don't know if I want a TDI starter or a 911 starter. Both will basically be free excepting if I get one that needs the adapter. But, my total cost will be very low. I just do not want to have to fix it again, if possible.
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tclark
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2010 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wcdennis wrote:
Here are some photos of the eBay WPS SR0408X starter and WestyVentures adapter:

Just FYI that is not a SR0408X
http://search.waiglobal.com/partsearch/partsearch.aspx?part=SR0408X&Submit=Go
its a SR0409X 2Kw
http://search.waiglobal.com/partsearch/partnum.aspx?part=2-1974-BO
the SR0408X is this one 1.8Kw
http://search.waiglobal.com/partsearch/partnum.aspx?part=2-1890-BO
and FYI again buffbuh bought the 2-1890-BO
might not make a diff in build quality but he did not buy the exact same unit
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